<p>Many *adult *posters on CC spend allot of their time creating unreasonable expectations.
It’s part of their brag thing.</p>
<p>There was/ is no attempt on my part to extrapolate a trend. I posted the link to Cornell Sun because I wanted to share this very sad news. Other posters tried to draw comparisons with other institutions. While over time, the number of suicides at Cornell do not seem to be out of the norm, the fact remains that the Cornell community has had to deal with three deaths in the space of one month. Instead of suggesting that it is in line with what happens at other universities, the Cornell administration is doing what it can to prevent further suicides.</p>
<p>Having personally experienced an unexpected family death (car accident) and the devastation in can wreak on the whole extended family for a very long time, I have always made it abundantly clear to them that I am in no way tied into the success of my children. I am very tied in to them being alive. That is why I always make them promise to wear their seat belts, always, always, always, and tell them that they have to know that there is no achievement or failure that is more important to me than just they themselves. I remember how stressful the college years were and I hope they will always have my loving voice in the back of their head to help override the bad times. I know this isn’t the whole answer, but I will do what I can to have them avoid this tragic path.</p>
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One also has to take into account that one suicide can often trigger a series of suicides within the same school/vicinity.</p>
<p>A high school two minutes away from me has also had three suicides in a very short time span (just a few months) after years of having a “clean record”.</p>
<p>I was at Cornell this weekend. Some of the students do seem very stressed due to prelims and lack of confidence in the (their) future, including a young engineer that we’ve known since freshman year. And they are all talking about the suicides.</p>
<p>It was startling to see the security guards on the bridges. Understandable, but shocking nevertheless.</p>
<p>I hope spring break helps.</p>
<p>I look forward to my sons being home in a few days and I want to slap myself in the head for complaining about them being slobs a couple months back. I reread my posts and I am ashamed that dishes in the sink or any other mess was troubling to me. I just want to hug my kids and remind them that they are loved so much. The events of the past few weeks are so beyond sad. My heart and deepest sympathy goes out to each one of the families. </p>
<p>I have a child that is being treated for depression…I can’t imagine…</p>
<p>I would also like to mention that one of my kids was not feeling too good. He described his symptoms to me over the phone. They sounded very unusual for him since he is always a very upbeat and active person. I asked him to go to Gannet right away and he did within a couple of days. I want to thank Gannet for the wonderful assessment they did but I also would urge all of you to consider making an appointment for your child to have a physical while they are home. My son had an extreme vitamin D deficiency which was really affecting him. They prescribed a very heavy dose of weekly Vitamin D and he is back to his normal self. I am only mentioning this because as we all know that because of Cornells location, the kids only have there faces exposed. Vitamin D deficiency can cause lack of energy and symptoms of sadness/depression. I thank Gannet for ordering the blood work and realizing this was a physical problem.</p>
<p>I also mentioned on another tread that you might want to consider getting the special lights for seasonal affect disorder. A little light could go a long way.</p>
<p>On the Cornell board a thread was closed down for what was undoubtedly inappropriate posting. However, I disagree that knowing what was behind the choices of these three young men is irrelevant. If it’s some copycat suicides, it’s relevant to how the school addresses things. Are some students at a much higher risk than other students (i.e., bipolar, Aspergers, “simple” depression)? And instead of a rundown of counseling services, how about better info on special supports? </p>
<p>People want to say it’s some morbid curiosity or that it’s no one’s business but the family’s, but I have to think there is a great deal of benefit to know the reason why, even if it makes no sense. If my kid was massively depressed, had been undergoing treatment for a while now, had gone off of medication… or had just started medication … all of those things are important for other parents to understand for the health and well-being of their own kid. If even one kid who has committed suicide in college as a result of lacking support for his Aspergers… wouldn’t you want to know what kind of supports WOULD have helped? Especially is you had a kid with Aspergers?</p>
<p>Wondering why a child or any person takes their live is not morbid curiosity. It’s part, would it apply to my child and how can I help my own kid navigate the pressures of college. Believe me, I put far less pressure on my kid than he puts on himself. So just telling parents to not put too much focus on grades is not always the problem.</p>
<p>It is so sad to read of this. My prayers go out to the families. </p>
<p>While no one can ever assess whether there is more or less pressure at any particular place than any other, it is helpful to assess what can be done to help others, before a tragedy occurs. Years back, when the community was then processing the death of a student at that time, there were a number of articles in the Cornell Daily Sun in which students tried to engage then President Rhodes in a dialogue. Rhodes did meet with students and responded to their concerns, and I think a lot of the changes in terms of the housing arrangements that we have seen since that time, were in part a response to some of those concerns. </p>
<p>It is not so easy to express what I mean to say here, so if it is inelegant, perhaps those of you out there who get the gist of it can jump in and help. In my opinion, Cornell seems to be a place where you can become isolated in your struggles, and it is not easy to find adequate support. I am not talking just about a health clinic visit or visits. For example, if you are majoring in one of the big majors (lets say bio or government), you will not get to know your professors well unless you make a big effort yourself. There are lots of students also vying for their time etc. You might live in a dorm, and just not click with those around you on the hall. You have to work to go outside of where you are to find friends etc. The sheer size of the place can cause many difficulties. It may be like this for anyone, anywhere, I really can’t say; however, coupled with the location in central NY and the dreary weather it can be a real downer. If you become depressed it can be that much harder to reach out to find support of any kind. If people ask me what I think is a good trait for a Cornell student, I always say strength. The strength to plow on regardless of the roadblocks. The mental strength to be on your own at 18. (Yes, I know that many many people find a great niche of peer support with a sorority or fraternity, or a great apartment or house, but not everyone does, and this support might not be enough.) </p>
<p>I went to Atlanta to grad school, and I found the small classes a blessing in terms of getting to know students and faculty. If wanted to get off campus, there were many things available. Later I lived in a small apartment in Manhattan, not much larger than my dorm room at undergrad. I never, not once, ever felt as lonely or isolated there as I did on that campus in central NY. Nyc is a big place too.</p>
<p>I know one anecdote does not a theory make, but I had friends who went to Yale. It always seemed to me that their system of residential colleges had a design that would help in avoiding isolation. Additionally, there are many fewer undergrads there.</p>
<p>I apologize if this is rambling or disconnected. It really hurts me to see something like this happen again.</p>
<p>Modadunn…I understand that many parents have a desire to get information so that they could understand how these trajedies occured, but it is none of our business. I just shared something in post #26 in the hope of alerting parents that their own child may not realize that something could be causing their shift in emotions.</p>
<p>I think it is more important to stay in close contact with our kids and really listen when they talk, and listen harder when they don’t talk.</p>
<p>We can’t understand why this happened in much the same way that so many things in life are not understandable. We are so geared toward getting information because information is power…the common mantra in most families, but we also need to realize that suicide is not the act of a person who is in a normal state of mind. That is why information in this case would not even serve much purpose. Whatever had occured with these beautiful young boys could not be used to stop further incidents because it is not rational behavior. I again apologize if what I am saying causes any hurt to any parent. It is not my intention to hurt anyone. I am just so upset that there are parents grieving the loss of their children…something no parent should ever experience.</p>
<p>anothermom…I understand exactly what you are saying and I have spoken to my kids about the very thing you are discussing. That is why so many parents had such a negative attitude to the parent bashing the frats on the student forum. I think these kids need as many people in their lives as possible. It could get cold and tough at any top college but because of Cornells size it is important for kids to find a place for themselves so there are enough people who are aware of them and how they are doing. I thank God my sons have each other so they always have someone to bounce their feelings off of.</p>
<p>I always inquire about my kids grades but I never make a judgement about them. I think that is something that I learned after first year. These kids were admitted because they are great students but the reality at Cornell and all schools is that some kids will be at the bottom. That is the reality of Cornell and that is the reality that parents need to know. Cornell students do need to be strong anothermom.</p>
<p>Additionally, about the release of information about the deaths. I believe that the people who need to know about the nature of the deaths do know about the nature of the deaths. I am a cornell student, and there have been a number of changes on campus already (longer counseling hours, dorm checks, more awareness about the resources available to people etc). Telling the community at large wont really change anything.</p>
<p>Yes, I agree Tboonepickens. If the information could prevent this from happening ever again than I would want to know the big answers. The reasons and circumstances are as individual as any human being. The only commonality is that they are all tragic endings.</p>
<p>My brother lives in Palo Alto. His local high school is getting raked over the coals right now because they have had 4 suicides within a year. Don’t know what the history for these things are for that school but this was a bad year. I remember one year when NYU had a number of suicides in a short period of time.</p>
<p>Unfortunately, once there is a suicide, it makes the deed more possible to others who are in that mode, and copycats are common. In fact, a risk factor for suicide is if someone the person knows has recently committed suicide. It shows are strong peer pressure is with these kids.</p>
<p>Getting a physical over spring break is a great suggestion!</p>
<p>Probably should add a “mental” too.</p>
<p>I agree that the reasons should remain confidential and can serve no real purpose. How could knowing the info possibly help? If possible reasons are a-demanding major or b- pressure from parents or c - recent break-up or d- whatever, are we supposed to go through the list and say, a,b,c or d - Whew! Not my kid and close the book on it? Of course not! You speak with your child, know what your child is doing, keep a dialogue going…
Support your child and if they are potentially in crisis, intervene to help them immediately. What makes one kid choose this option may certainly not be what sends another to do the same.</p>
<p>As another poster stated there should also be sensitivity as to the type of words one uses when speaking of any type of mental illness. There are words that could instantly cause your friends or loved ones to close up and realize you are not a person they could talk to. The word “mental” immediately strikes a chord that you are passing judgement.</p>
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<p>There is such a stigma about mental illness but we only compound the stigma when we refuse to talk about things in a non-judgmental way. It seems very unproductive to me that the door to the discussion seems very much closed when it could be very much opened by the triple tragedies at Cornell in the past month. Certainly individual details are not what is called for, but to say, it is none of our business is actually quite ridiculous to my way of thinking. It is very much “our” business of what is driving young people to feel they have no other options or hope, whether it happens at Cornell or any other college campus. What makes mental illness, whether it is a brief interlude or a lifelong struggle, so shaming is the feeling of being shamed or the whispers or worse, the “let’s not talk about it in proper company” that leaves those suffering very much amid the shadows. It simply isn’t right. </p>
<p>So you can say that using the word “mental” strikes a judgmental chord, but the absolute truth there is that when you DON’T talk about things and make them seem dirty or unseemly - that’s where the judgment comes from. My point is this: How do you really know if a kid you love with all your heart is truly dealing with something that is quickly spinning out of control and when they just might need the space and time to work it out for themselves? What was it about these kids or any kids that made a once rational boy, become completely irrational. The thing about suicide is that often, almost immediately before the deed is done, the person seems to be getting better, over things, what have you. But in reality, they’ve made a decision and are good with it. How can not talking about what was going in that young person’s mind - delusional and out of sorts as they might be - be the right thing? How does that help anyone, including the understanding that getting help from a mental health professional is a good decision? It all reminds me of my neighbor who can only whisper the word “cancer”, as if saying it aloud spreads the disease… least of all to herself. She acts as if it only exists for others, happens to others. So… the “why” may not mean much in an exact way (grades, parents, perfection, etc), but the discussion of what those young men may have or may not have been doing for themselves seems like a really relevant discussion to me.</p>
<p>Re post #38:</p>
<p>…unless it’s your child. Dealing with generalities as to why so many young people, including those at elite colleges, commit suicide may be helpful. Revealing why one particular person did so is highly unlikely to be helpful. </p>
<p>Drawing an admittedly imperfect–and rather silly anaology–it may help to know the 25/75% range of SATs for students admitted to a college; knowing the SAT score of ONE of those admitted really isn’t–and revealing it is also offset by privacy concerns. </p>
<p>In this case, it hasn’t even been conclusively established that all 3 committed suicide. My heart goes out to their families–no matter what the cause of death was.</p>
<p>Maybe a professional or someone experienced can comment:
DW and I consider ourselves to be typical parents with typical kids. They have periods of stress in college like any other kid, and have good days and bad ones as we all do. They take weeder courses like Orgo and worry about it like all their classmates.</p>
<p>If the kid is living a time zone away and your typical contact is the 2 minute call between classes, and perhaps a longer chat in the weekend, what exactly can the parent do to both keep their spirits up and detect any potential problems?</p>
<p>DS spoke about his classmate who is thought to have jumped to his death in a stairwell in a tall building in the first week of class last August, and he had no idea anything was amiss. He said the boy’s parents had indicated their son had even talked to them about details of setting up an auto deposit for his new job the day he died. That doesn’t sound like kind of details I’d be doing if I had much weightier issues in my mind. What kind of signs should sound an alarm?</p>