Colleges ban Greek life and throw them off campus to avoid liabilities. When sororities and fraternities are on campus then college security could drop in and monitor parties. At the same time, if there are any issues (rape, drug, under age drinking) then the school maybe liable.
College students will always party, with or without Greek life. People are naive to think by banning Greek on campus is going to make campus safer. I am also someone who does not believe having drinking age of 21 is preventing our kids from drinking.
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But without the “us vs. them” culture, resulting in some feeling obligated to (at minimum) look away when a “brother” engages in something questionable?
Everytime I read about the occasional deadly initiation outcome, progressing/escalating over many hours, I ask myself how likely the same could have happened in a regular dorm, or a regular student apartment building, without someone “unaffiliated” having stepped in and calling BS on it.
Or how likely the Greek victim would have felt that “stepping away” was actually a reasonable option, if it was just a rowdy party between regular peers on a level playing field.
I suspect that Greek “culture” adds another facet that is notably absent from regular wild parties, that potentially can result in a much different outcome.
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All the Greek houses at CU are off campus and always have been. The university never supervised them with the campus cops or otherwise. When the frats became unrecognized as student groups, they lost their office in the student union building, weren’t allowed to hold meetings on campus (as many groups can do), etc. Not much to give up.
The sororities continued to be recognized student groups and use the university facilities to organize Rush, can host meetings and post informational notices in the student union.
I attended a smaller east coast Catholic school with zero Greek life. Most parties occurred in off campus housing adjacent to campus or at bars that you could walk to. I know at least 5 girls that were sexually assaulted, 2 were at parties and 2 were “date rapes”. And the final one was a gang rape by non student locals. I worked in the counseling center so I know there were a lot more incidents than the ones I knew of personally. Some of the worst offenders were athletes as a this was a D1 school. They were considered untouchable. But two of the assaults I knew of I know were committed by kids most students would consider “nerds”. To think this problem is only related to Greek life is completely naive. Not one of the students I knew reported it. According to kids I know that currently attend, the culture has not changed much since I attended.
My son recently joined a frat at a school out west. He’s very open with me and there was no drinking involved in his hazing (2 pledges don’t drink at all). They only had to do things like clean the frat house, set up for parties, interview and memorize info about all the frat brothers, etc. Parties always have several brothers who are not allowed to drink to keep an eye on anyone getting out of control. They had a speaker come in and talk to the pledges about consent. Kids also take a course as part of orientation. Frat parties are open to anyone (even members of other frats) so there is no exclusivity. School seems very liberal about drinking and local bars accept crappy ID’s. But it’s really not considered a party school as lots of kids don’t partake.
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If a kid is impressionable, they are likely that way in all aspects of their life, and it would be my hope that the parents have addressed that issue during childhood, in order to avoid unpleasant consequences that might arise not only from fraternity interactions but any general interaction with “the wrong type of person” whether it be at a college party, a dorm, a classroom or a job.
Speaking to my experience with sororities, there are many independent thinkers and leaders who seek out the opportunity to join these organizations, not only for the social connections to similarly strong women, but also for the networking and alumni connections that these groups provide.
Certainly, if a kid feels some kind of peer pressure by the mere existence of Greek organizations on a campus, they should seek out colleges where Greek organizations are minimal or non-existent - however, there are thousands of students who successfully co-exist on campuses of all sizes, where Greek life is present. They simply make the decision not to be associated with it and move on with their college life.
I don’t doubt that there may be some small campuses with a large Greek presence, where a kid may feel like there aren’t opportunities to be social unless they go Greek, but that’s why it’s important to vet the campus culture before depositing and make sure it supports your kid’s social personality type.
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Princeton doesnt really have fraternities and sororities - they have eating clubs which are different. Since all housing is on campus for all students, there isnt really any Greek life (I have heard there are “underground” frats) but fraternities and sororities are not part of the campus culture at all.
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Williams college does not have Greek life, and you can Google their sexual assault and drinking culture. Where were the people to call BS on it.
I am not here to say when sexual assault and drug abuse happen at fraternities is normal or ok. What I am saying is parents are naive to think if their kids were to go to schools with no Greek life then their kids would be safe.
Parents may want to think about setting examples for their kids when it comes to alcohol, drug, respect for each other and show their kids on how to say no sometimes.
I often think about how those young men were raised that they think it is ok to rape someone. Or they dont know forcing someone to drink in such excess that would kill someone.
Instead of putting responsibilities and blame on the school or society, maybe we should look at ourselves as to how we have raised our kids.
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I have two girls who are out of college now. We didn’t take whether a school had Greek life or not into consideration when they were looking at schools because I knew it didn’t matter where they went, they had to look after themselves.
Both girls ended up going to Cornell and joined the same sorority(didn’t overlap because of their age difference). Their sorority had good protocols to keep their sisters safe when attending parties.
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And even at non-party events. I remember when my daughter was a freshman and was at a sorority/frat combined meeting (I don’t think it was a party). She wasn’t feeling well and wanted to go back to her dorm room. Two of her sisters had to walk her back (two so they could return). The frat house was on campus, as were the sorority houses, across the street from her dorm, but the rule was she couldn’t walk alone, even though they hadn’t been drinking and it was probably about 7 pm. Now she could have walked home from the library alone, or the gym, or a night class that may have taken her along the same path, but not a frat house or even the sorority house to the dorm alone.
Her sorority house was probably about 1/2 block from her dorm.
I’ve said this before on other threads, and repeat here, but my advice to kids is not only to never consume a drop of alcohol, but to never hang out with anyone that is drinking alcohol. These types of incidents have always happened, and will continue to happen. Protect oneself.
That’s never going to happen. Even at BYU there are alcohol problems on and near campus. Even at schools with no drugs or alcohol policies for dorms, or even substance free dorms, there are drugs and alcohol in the dorms. There is alcohol at school events (sports, meetings, dinners).
On CC you see parents post all the time that their kids aren’t partiers, want a college with other kids who don’t want to party AT ALL. Sure, their 16 year olds may be straight as an arrow, but when they are 18 and in a different environment, they may try beer or wine and might even like it. Parents, be prepared. College kids do drink.
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I agree most kids will drink at least occasionally. I’ve always emphasized that you never leave a friend behind. If you came together you leave together. From what I gather she and her friends use a modified buddy system - the whole group doesn’t have to leave together but there is always at least one person who is looking out for you. I’ve also emphasized never leaving a drink unattended and if you do go get a new one. And pour your own of course.
My kids’ sorority had soberers at parties. When it was your turn, you were not allowed to drink at parties and if they saw a sister was too drunk they would hand over a bottled water as a sign. They also required the fraternity they are have social with to have designated drivers to get them to and from a party. I was told one time they noticed a driver was drinking at the party, and the sorority’s social director reported it to the fraternity’s social director. They didn’t have another social with the fraternity for some time. Ranking is important when it comes to Greek life. The way ranking is often determined which fraternity or sorority you are having parties with.
I agree with you that my advice will never be taken en masse. But it is the most reasonable and proven advice I can give, and a few kids will absolutely take it. Others can go against it at their own risk. There is very little that can done policy-wise that will keep these unfortunate events from happening.
However, the long history of alcohol and other recreational drug use indicates that there are many people who choose to take the risks of alcohol and other recreational drug use.
https://store.samhsa.gov/sites/default/files/SAMHSA_Digital_Download/PEP21-03-10-006.pdf indicates that about 53% of college students drank alcohol in the past month. However, a parent is unlikely to know whether their student is in the group that does drink alcohol versus the group that does not. Parental advice not to drink alcohol is generally interpreted as parental disapproval (and hypocrisy if the parents themselves drink alcohol), so those students at residential colleges who do drink just avoid telling their parents.
I’m not suggesting that students don’t drink, or that I even have control of kids I am around, so I offer advice. They can take it or leave it. They don’t need to report back to me.
I think there are many kids that have no interest, and they are silently begging for support from an adult that says, “Despite the culture that promotes drinking and partying as a right of passage in college, not everyone participates. It is ok not to participate.”
I do set an example for them. I’ve never had a drink.
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That!
That depends on the parent’s relationship with the student. If the parent takes the do not drink approach, then the student will not disclose that they drink.
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I know this to be true with one of my D’s good friends from HS. She had drinks at high school parties, and now regularly drinks in college. All her friends know it. We (parents of friends) know it. Her parents don’t, or maybe they’re in denial.
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I am a freshman at Northeastern University and while there is Greek life, it isn’t as big as can be at other schools. There are no sorority houses, and the fraternity houses are smaller and off campus. It is definitely more laid back here and there is less pressure to be involved in it. You can still attend parties without officially being in Greek life. I decided to rush and so far it has been a great experience as I have met a lot of new friends and have had fun events to look forward to as well. While the issues with sexual assault and drugging is not completely avoidable anywhere, I will say I have not personally experienced either nor have my friends and have felt very safe overall. I like the balance the Greek life at NU offers because it doesn’t make or break your social life, but it is a fun opportunity to get involved if that is what you are looking for.
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