Cost >50% of Income... has this happened to anyone else?

<p>Hi everyone,
I just received financial aid notification for one of my top schools, and I got a 18k merit scholarship, which was great, and brought the total cost down to about 45k. I did not, however, receive one dollar of need-based financial aid. Actually, my EFC was just about equal to my family's net income, but with the scholarship, they would be spending >50% of their income on my yearly tuition. I contacted the college and they basically said that they determined that I could afford that amount. We are calling the FA office on Monday, but I was just curious if this has happened to anyone else? </p>

<p>Could there have been a mistake with regards to my dad's income, perhaps? He is self-employed (a musician) and makes ~150k a year, but because of the costs of travelling and recording and everything, he really only ends up making ~30k. Did the college maybe overlook this?</p>

<p>Sorry for all of my questions, but I'm really nervous because it is impossible for me to attend college if it's going to cost that much.</p>

<p>(Apologies for any typos; I am typing this on my phone and it's very difficult to scroll up and proofread.)</p>

<p>First, not all colleges meet full need.</p>

<p>Second, those colleges that do meet full need tend to do very stringent calculations of ability to pay for families with self-employment income. In other words, even though your net income for IRS purposes is only $30k, the college will likely disallow several of the deductions that got you from $150k to $30k.</p>

<p>So, yes, you should contact the financial aid office and ask them to explain their calculation. Whoever makes the call (whether it’s you or a parent) should be prepared to go over that Schedule C with a fine-toothed comb, figuring out what deductions have and have not been allowed.</p>

<p>OP, true that not all colleges can even begin to meet need. Your situation may be a little different, depending on how assured he is of having that income, each year. Some musicians barely cobble it together and some have the level, contacts and demand that assure they’ll stay busy. You may need to ask about “professional judgment,” where your parents document their side, bring additional details to light. (And ask how long that would take.) </p>

<p>But first see if this is a school that doesn’t usually offer much in the first place. </p>

<p>Not unusual. </p>

<p>Thanks to you both, and yes, this school is one that at least claims to meet 100% of need, and I have read very positive testimonials about their FA. We even did the net price calculator on the college’s website with the same numbers, and that predicted that our total cost would be less than half of what it is now (which would be an amount we could actually afford). I realise that the net price calculator is by no means a guarentee of the amount of financial aid we will receive, but it shouldn’t be 20k off…</p>

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<p>NPC’s do not work well for those who are self-employed/have deductions. Many NPCs include that warning.</p>

<p>The school is “adding back in” many of your dad’s deductions. They might be food costs, cell phone, car, gas, whatever. </p>

<p>The school probably does not think that you’re living on $30k per year…before taxes.</p>

<p>If you put $150,000 as your income, you would NOT have gotten a LOT of need based aid. If you put $30,000 you would have been ignoring deductions that likely were added back in as income which often happens with the self employed.</p>

<p>The Net Price Calculators are NOT accurate for those who are self employed or own their own businesses. </p>

<p>Look at it this way - deductions are a choice, even if you think they are essential to your business.</p>

<p>Is this an ED II acceptance and financial aid award? If so, contact the school ASAP. You have a very small window of time to accept their admission offer…or not. </p>

<p>It is very possible that the school added back in deductions as income. Even though these are allowed by the IRS, schools sometimes add these back in, as they are expenses ALL folks have. Things like meals, phones, cars, computers, utilities, home use, even travel expenses, can be added back in. </p>

<p>You need to discuss this with the school. But they will most certainly want to see documentation for each business expense, and they can ask how you are paying all of your bills on $30,000 a year.</p>

<p>I am wondering about this. My son has applied to a very selective school that “meets full need” as determined by them (via the Profile and their own methodology). I, too, am self-employed. My GROSS revenue is about $130,000, but my deductions are “real” - things I actually have to pay for to run the business. Office rent, supplies, part-time help, etc. Things that are truly out-of-pocket. The only things that seem to me appropriate to add back are things like mileage, depreciation, etc. - that are not actually paid ‘out of pocket’, but are just paper expenses.</p>

<p>My AGI is about $52,000 and we qualify for a small Pell (FAFSA efc = $5,038). We have basically no assets, home is about break-even, no substantial equity (we actually only own a 1/2 interest in the house, which has a big mortgage - I put down the market value of our 1/2 interest and 1/2 of the mortgage, which actually puts us underwater; we are technically/legally responsible for the whole mortgage, but we only pay 1/2, so that’s what I put down). No substantial savings or even retirement accounts. We live in a very expensive place (some schools take that into account).</p>

<p>So I am wondering what they will likely “add back” for the purpose of determining our true need. I figure maybe a couple hundred in mileage expenses (I only take off for business-related trips to/from the office, NOT for my daily home-office commute), not sure what else. It sure wouldn’t be fair if they add back things I actually have to pay, like phone and copier charges, insurance, rent, supplies, etc.</p>

<p>Anyone have a similar situation? Do you know what they are likely to add back? How about self-employed health insurance? That’s pretty big, and I didn’t include it in my “medical” costs since it is already factored into the AGI.</p>

<p>One more question. My husband is, honestly, a bit of a deadbeat. He has his own business, which used to be a little profitable until we moved. For about a few years he had a loss, but last year made more than he spent. Because of the prior years’ losses, however, his ‘net income’ was reduced to zero by carrying forward some of the loss that had been disallowed last year. I know they add back losses that go into the figure (forget exactly which line it is, line 12? maybe) on the front of the 1040 (like last year, my net from Sch. C was, say, $60K, he had a $2K loss, so the line 12 amount was $58K - I understand they would add that $2K back). But what about a loss that reduces the Schedule C net amount from, say, $2K to $0? So the amount carried forward onto line 12, from his Sch. C, is 0. Would they go into the Sch. C to determine whether there was an old loss contributing to that 0, and add it back, or not?</p>

<p>And, will they say, he should get a job, and increase our contribution because of that? I doubt he could get a job, honestly, he is over 50 and hasn’t worked (except in his own business) since he was about 21. I didn’t put down that he was a “dislocated worker” because while the recession did have a large impact on his business, more of it was probably due to moving and having to re-establish himself in a new location.</p>

<p>OK, these are tough questions, I know, but I am just wondering whether our “true need” is likely to be considered a LOT higher than our FAFSA efc, or maybe only a little higher. Anyone know, or have a similar situation?</p>

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They don’t do this. While who works is a lifestyle choice, they don’t try to dictate who has to work and who doesn’t. </p>

<p>Sweetbeat…you would probably get better answers if you started your OWN thread instead of piggy backing onto this one. Your question is similar…but not the same.</p>

<p>OP, does this school guarantee to meet full need? Also did your run your family numbers through the NPC for the school? Does the school use FAFSA only, or does it use PROFILE as well? Do your parents have a family business or significant assets. </p>

<p>For schools that do not use PROFILE or another supplementary questionnaire, they rarely guarantee to meet full need. I don’t know a single school that guarantees to meet full FAFSA need, by the way. And once a school uses other apps in addition to FAFSA, all sorts of things like home equity can come into consideration and even the usual FAFSA asset percentages do not necessarily hold.</p>

<p>@cptofthehouse This college meets full aid (or is supposed to) and uses the CSS profile. We ran our data through the NPC for this school and it was still expensive, but radically less than what we are expected to pay now. My parents supplied me with the data I needed to fill out the FAFSA and CSS, and we may have listed my dad’s music “business” as an actual business, I honestly can’t remember. :confused: Other than that we don’t have any significant assets.</p>

<p>FYI we called and left a message at the FA office today.</p>

<p>Hopefully, you get more specific answers from the fin aid office. I have seen, and we all have on this forum, many times when a family business is involved that a lot of deduction and line items are added back into income which can result in less aid. This can happen with the most generous schools; one poster here had this issue with Swarthmore last year. Your father may have to discuss his tax return and PROFILE entries line by line with the financial aid director to try to get some resolution.</p>

<p>This is also an area where schools can vary widely. The student who could not get Swarthmore to budge was able to get consideration and a generous award from another top LAC. Hopefully you and your father can work this out with your college. Good luck.</p>

<p>Just talked to the FA office today and they changed the numbers around drastically (still not sure if I can afford it, but at the numbers are much closer to where the should be). Thanks to everyone who provided input!</p>