^^Agreed. The first place to start is on the website of the college itself. Every university has this information. The net price calculator will give you an idea of what it might cost you without merit aid.
Many jazz bass programs often teach classical the first two years. I know that at UNT all of the bassists take 2 years of private lessons from Jeff Bradetich before receiving jazz lessons from Lynn Seaton. They want their bassists to have good bowing technique. It makes for better pitch quality and flexibility.
2 years is a long time in the life of a highschooler. So a lot can and will change. The more your son can experience and be exposed to what it means to actually be a musician or to be studying music the more likely he will land in a place that is right for him.
There is the “myth” of being a musician and then there is the reality. Summer programs such as Berklee’s 5 week that expose a child to what coursework and college will be like for a music major are especially useful. I had one child who was thinking he wanted to be a musician and attended Berklee’s 5 week. He enjoyed it but after attending it he realized that he did not want to actually be a musician even though music is a big part of his life (and still is). He is now a math grad student. He took music lessons in college and he continues to compose for his own enjoyment but he does not have any aspirations to be a professional musician.
I have a daughter who from the time she was in middle school thought she wanted to go into the performing arts (dance and theater). But then got to college and realized that life as a performing artist was not what she wanted. She is now a nurse practitioner.
The question of your child is what is the overall mission? Campus size can have a big impact on that. A city like NYC or LA have opportunities that others cities do not.
Your energy might be better spent right now making sure your son is getting the experiences he needs to sort out what direction he wants and to refine his overall mission. Doing that will make the list-making a lot easier and also hopefully land your son in a place that is the best match for him.
After your son spends all summer marching in a DCI corps on snare drum and not playing the bass for 10 weeks, he’s going to want to be a percussion major. When that happens give me a shout because the list will change and he’s gonna need to play the marimba asap. good luck
S has been back from DCI for a few weeks now. He accomplished his mission and is back on the bass. It was a great summer. He said he learned a lot about “listening in” - he seemed to really value that. He was disappointed to loose his bass calluses, and he figuring that swimming pool water is an enemy to a callus. He is blistering his way back into shape. He feels like he did not lose that much bass skill over the summer.
The junior year of HS begins with a nice load of classic college-prep classes. The voice/dance lesson schedule has been established. The MYA startup is this coming weekend. Private bass lessons (classical and jazz instructors) are going to be more ad hoc at about one lesson per week with about 3/4 classical and 1/4 jazz. For the sake of an exercise in putting something together, S is planning to submit a Grammy jazz audition video and has selected music he like for that. He will need to find accompanyists. He is looking at repertoire-building as something to improve right now.
Not sure what anyone else who really knows about this thinks, but have you considered DePaul University’s School of Music? They do have a terrific jazz program, and you can’t beat being in Chicago. The SOM is conservatory-like within a university. All of the faculty are outstanding.
@musicalkids - I am definitely aware of DePaul in Chicago. We are becoming more aware of some of the performers, instructors, and professors in the Chicago-land area. We have a terrible time figuring out what is “terrific” relative to the rest of the world. We are very happy to be geographically neutral, within the US at least, so DePaul doesn’t get extra points for closeness (I may even move after S goes to college, for example). I would give DePaul extra points in that travel costs for auditioning there would be less. I will ask S if he would like to set up a visit. I just looked up the Bass and Jazz Bass instructor names. I think we will and/or could be bumping into some of them - I recognized two of their names from looking for private instruction, and I have read and watched a fair amount of Jason Heath’s work. For schools in the price range, which is a very common price range, but not easy for me, we need to find ones where large scholarships are possible. For example, by reading the Lawrence University material, I see that scholarships range from $15K to $22K (non-stackable academic + music) for a tuition in the mid $40K, so that puts a firm floor under their cost to us.
@GoForth - You will have absolutely no idea what the cost of most schools will be for your son, until April, or even May of his senior year. Scholarships vary from school to school, from instrument to instrument, from year to year, and from one student to another. And they’re not fixed and can, sometimes, be adjusted, upwards, especially if you have multiple offers from comparable, or more elite programs, to compare. Even schools with reputations for not giving out much scholarship money may give a full ride to a particular student. You just don’t know at this point.
Certainly there are programs like Lawrence which are known in advance to be generous with merit scholarships, and it’s good to have them on your list, but don’t rule any program out until acceptances are received and final scholarship offers are in hand.
@GoForth, as you mentioned costs, I will just tell you that at least up to now – and I have no reason to think that this won’t continue – DePaul freezes tuition for all four years of the undergraduate degree. And they can be very generous to music students vis-a-vis scholarships.
Just a side note to get ready for the “we” to transition to “he” in the next couple of years! By the end of high school my daughter knew a lot more than I did. Summer programs and good teachers were mostly responsible for that
@compmom - Yes. I wanted this transition to occur and described that desire to S a few months ago. Based on S’ academic load and S’ nearness to graduation, we are aiming to move those duties over to S’ plate around the winter break coming up. One of S’ single-semester classes becomes a study hall at that time. His senior year also looks like an easier load than this year is.
I had a really good feeling yesterday. He went to his first MYA rehearsal, which made me feel like one of my logistical goals had been completed - showing up and seeing that it is real. The instruction crew had a very nice feel about them. I like their vibe. I think they will be good resources over the next year or two. S was quite pleased, he says.
Hello, again. The effort to develop the list of colleges is not going well. It is embarassing to think after reading through so much of the forum and college websites that S has only the smallest list, rather than a list of 20 that needs to be trimmed down to 8. It does not even seem reasonable to ask for suggestions because so many past suggestions can be searched through. Our local bass teachers are not the fountains of suggestions that seem to be available to some.
Category 1
Some colleges would be ruled out by using CC opinions - those which are expensive and have virtually no merit aid. I gather NYU and Juilliard are among those. It makes the search easier to know what can definitely be off the table. If there are more places in this category, I would like to know about them.
Category 2
S was considering that the Miami Frost Jazz Stamps Quintet deal might be worth shooting for, but when that was mentioned to a non-musical friend, it did sound a bit against-the-odds (maybe crazy) to invest in travel/effort for a single spot of such notoriety. I think a lot of options are going to fall into the category of - their program is top-notch, and you can go there if they like you enough to give you near their top-level scholarship, something near full tuition. A list of category 2 can probably be developed. Is it fair/sane/practical to travel to so many places, looking for the magic hand-out?
Category 3
The school that we could readily pay for with the automatic scholarships is UNT. The desirable traits that the program is believed to have include a good reputation, lots of competitive peers, a risk to get lost in the factory versus a chance to be challenged as much as you want. Maybe IU and Berklee would have a related feel, but in a higher price range? We are really short on schools that are both “affordable” and have a peer group that will challenge at all times. NOTE: even the Frost Stamps quintet is a bit different than this in that you get admitted as a freshman, and then you are a member of it for 4 years, without members rotating in or out.
If I could use an extra dose of advice, I think it would be which Category 3 schools exist - they can probably all make it onto the list. Which Category 2 schools are the better gambles, perhaps considering which ones are in geographical clusters with the others to aid with travel effectiveness. Which Category 1 schools can be marked off the list right away.
I would like to list a category 4:
Category 4
School that might not have quite the level of peer competition, but is still great for a self-driven student under a very good instructor, and the cost is controlled through low price and/or automatic scholarship. Is this Temple, for example? The category 4 colleges would probably be mixed in with the category 2 colleges on the final list.
Can you tell us what schools are on your son’s list at this point? That would be a good starting point for discussion. My son had only 3 schools on his list that he intended to apply to. I don’t necessarily think quantity is the most important factor. If what is on his list appeals to him and fits financially then you might be just fine. FYI, one of my son’s friends is a freshman as a jazz vocalist at UNT and is loving it there. I think I told you this before but the jazz bass program at UNT was my son’s strong second choice.
@GoForth - are you certain the stamps scholarship for your child’s instrument is for their year? It is one every 4 years
@momsings - thanks for reaching out.
The list:
UNT, for sure, hope to make it, will visit this summer for camp.
Frost, if worth the financial gamble.
DePaul, UIC, NIU, local Chicagoland options that are easy to visit and check out (or have already been checked out), but also would need merit aid and may have various strengths.
@ClarinetDad16 - S is a 2017. Currently a junior. Jazz Bass. He would hit the lucky cycle for the jazz quintet.
@goforth - national competitions and major summer programs are critical exposure to the inner circle of the major programs. Looking at Frost Jazz - and that program is certainly strong than orchestral - these kids selected are playing in the Grammy Band and are Young Arts finalists.
How are your child’s grades and test scores?
@ClarinetDad16 - S does have one more season to try out for the Grammy Band. Odds of acceptance are, you know. As far as exposure to the inner circles, that in itself would be like forming the college list - which inner circles should S be exposed to. S has exposure locally in Chicago, and plans a summer camp at UNT for a summer camp level of exposure.
One the more concrete front, S academics are alrightish with anticipated 6 APs, 3.93 UWGPA, 4.3 WGPA, rank 1/189. ACT might only be coming in at about 31 right now, but there will probably be efforts to see if that can go up a little bit.
Some things that mattered to my D that helped build a list:
Cool urban setting vs college town vs small LAC in the boondocks (you can see the attitude already)
Region - my D was mainly east coast and mid-west (due to our locations) - helps in auditions to be regional
General interests by your son - a school “environment” that he’s interested in for whatever reason…maybe a friend went there…maybe he likes a sports team or an outdoor activity or specific cultural events…this may seem trivial but you aren’t studying all the time and you need outlets…what outlets would he like and will the environment accommodate that…again assuming a respectable jazz program at the school
My D looked at a few LACs in small towns. She was pretty interested in a few until the audition when we visited one for the second time. After the audition she said “I know the whole lay out to this school and town and I’ve only been her twice on short visits. It feels so small.” But another person could love that. My D decided in the end she wanted a bigger environment with more social outlets. It took until auditions for her to see that. So as a parent, requesting a little variety in the initial list isn’t bad (as well as reality in affordability).
And your list is actually pretty good. We never had 20 - more like 12 and probably a few of those were just to keep a few options on the table. The actual list was probably 8 at most. But I can see where you might want him to add a few more for consideration. Maybe he could do a little thinking, researching and casting around amongst his peers and bring you an expanded list…just to see what he comes up with with no assistance or constraints…if it’s nothing you could move to parental Plan B (bribery, pleading, resignation etc).