<p>northeastmom, couldn’t the other side simply say “I don’t think the government should be in the business of using public dollars to award need-based aid for college. A low-income student has plenty of opportunity to get aid from other sources or to seek out student loans.”</p>
<p>The government is, as it all too often does, handing out money like candy. If the government is going to play a role, I think (and I assume the vast majority of taxpayers would agree) that the money should go to students who have earned it, rather than to students who were born into certain circumstances.</p>
<p>“I don’t think that an A student is more worthy of being able to select a certain college, or to go to college over a B or a B+ student.”</p>
<p>Sorry, but that’s bullcrap. I worked my butt off for 13 years to get into a good school, and I absolutely think that being an “A student” should give me an advantage. </p>
<p>I don’t think that a low-income student is more worthy of being able to select a certain college, or to go to college over a middle-class or upper-class student.</p>
<p>There are plenty of B and B+ students and A- students who work very hard as well. That does not mean that they are entitled to tax dollars, and the same is true for A students. You may apply with your stats to colleges and see where you get in and what merit and financial aid is available through institutional funding. </p>
<p>Unsubsidized Staffords are available to help ALL college students who are US citizens, even if they’re families are extremely wealthy, as long as the fafsa is completed. Pell grant recipients get the Pell to have access to at least some type of college (ie: community college). This is how we allow access to college to the most needy citizens in our country.</p>
<p>Keep in mind that student loans get paid back with interest. It is the Pell grant that is given to our neediest students to use to have access to a college education.</p>
<p>Many low income students are getting much more than just a pell grant in need based aid.There’s state aid such as tap in nys, seog funds, many need based institutional grants, acg(prior to its demise this year), in addition to many private scholarships that have a need based component.</p>
<p>And your assumption would be incorrect. States like California are dropping merit money bcos it advantages the already advantaged. For example, a study of NMSF showed that is disproportionately favored the wealthy in California. Conversely, it disproportionately disadvantaged the lower income families, many of whom were minority.</p>
<p>Result of UC dropping participation in the NM program: yawn. </p>
<p>Run the numbers, the vast majority of students are not merit-worthy; thus, the program has limited appeal to taxpayers bcos they ain’t in it.</p>
<p>I will also tell you that we do not qualify for Pell money, not even close. I just don’t want our tax money funding a family with more money than we have because their kiddo has relatively high stats. I have no problem with them going to an Ivy and having institutional money offer financial aid (they do not offer merit awards), or having them go to a school that gives them a full ride with their institutional funds.</p>
<p>I do not resent having my tax dollar giving a hand to our neediest citizens so that the door to a college education opens for them too.</p>
<p>To even be considered for a Byrd in California, one needed a 2400/36. And to make matters worse, the powers-that-be unrounded the ACT, such that a 35.75 beat a 35.5.</p>
<p>i agree, a PELL grant should never be given to a community college student which is higher than the cost of tuition and books. Don’t even get me started on not having to claim the income of a non-custodial parent … maybe if your entire college is being funded (not loans) by the federal/state government students should be forced to start off in a county college for 2 yrs.</p>
<p>I think it would be good if the federal gov checked on students after their first 2 yrs of college are completed, to see how they are doing grade wise - give a scholarship to some students who did just okay in high school and did not qualify for a scholarship at that time, but flourished when they got into college.</p>
<p>Another thought - since may get PELL grants and low interest Perkins Loans and never work, i think if a student works in college during a school year, the government should match that $. An incentive to work is a good thought.</p>
<p>Pell grants are a great idea, but I see a couple of flaws:</p>
<ul>
<li><p>I’ve heard of far too many who take the money, but don’t actually seriously intend to complete or attend school. </p>
<ul>
<li>It’s not enough money for a student to attend an upper-tier uni.</li>
</ul></li>
</ul>
<p>My idea? Turn the “grant” into a subsidized loan, perhaps with conversion to a full- or partial-" grant" upon degree completion (or perhaps not - if “college” is the ticket to a high-paying job, why should the middle-class student have to pay their loans back, but the Pell doesn’t?)</p>
<p>In any event, this would likely skim off enough applicants who have no intention of completing their course of study to provide for higher ceilings for more expensive institutions.</p>
<p>Any student with a Pell is already likely taking out significant subsidized/unsub Stafford loans too. The Pell Grant alone doesn’t come close to covering tuition at most schools.</p>
<p>Off the top of my head, I can think of four students I know that
receive the Pell Grant
do not have jobs during the year
have not taken out any loans
profit from going to college (i.e. walk out with more money in their bank accounts after every semester than when they started)
To be fair, one of these kids started off the school year with a job, but soon quit it after realizing how little money he was making in comparison to his profits from need-based financial aid.</p>
<p>One of these kids drives a Mustang (the one I described), another drives a BMW.</p>
<p>Exactly one of the four got a part-time job just for over the summer. All four signed up for summer classes. The Mustang guy is the only one with a GPA above 3.5.</p>
<p>Tuition at my school cost just over $5k last year (not including summer).</p>
<p>Medwell, the maximum Pell Grant is only $5,550. So if tuition is a little over $5,000… that means they’re maybe “profiting” by $300? And that sum would not even cover a year’s worth of books for most undergraduates.</p>
<p>Assuming they’re commuting, then they’re saving significant amounts of money over many students by avoiding room and board charges.</p>
<p>medwell, where do you go to school? I would love to read their FA page and see if I can see the fantastic FA program that they’re involved in. I know a lot of people in my income bracket who are struggling and I would love to show them that school in hopes that they could get the same deal. </p>
<p>i think if a student works in college during a school year, the government should match that $.</p>
<hr>
<p>This already happens. It’s called federal work study (it’s government funded Title IV aid).</p>
<p>The Mustang and BMW driving folks are not the norm. They most likely have parents who have significant tax write offs that lower their AGI to a Pell eligible level. I can assure you … having worked at a school with over 10,000 Pell grant recipients this year alone … that the vast majority of students receiving Pell grants have family incomes low enough that you would NOT want to trade lives with them.</p>