<p>I assume neither of you are divorced. I am. I’d be proud of the kid. (I lived a not entirely dissimilar experience.) </p>
<p>Who do you think was going to pay the young woman’s tuition if dad didn’t? Mom had to co-sign to get the loan. </p>
<p>I love the way you two are inventing scenarios out of whole cloth to justify the dad’s behavior. Note that if dad was wholly unable to keep his commitment, he would have used that as a defense. There’s no indication in the news account that he did so. Instead, he argued that his daughter had breached the contract. </p>
<p>In the real world, when there is such a clause in a divorce agreement, the ex-wife has traded other things to insure that the kids’ college bills are paid. Dad then renegs. If he’s allowed to get away with it, then mom gave up lots of other things she might have gotten in the divorce agreement for nothing. </p>
<p>If his financial circumstances change in such a way that he can’t possibly pay, the court will modify the agreement. Here, the girl enrolled in a state school for 4 years based on dad’s promise to pay. He pulled the rug with one year to go. I assume he did that in part because he was convinced that with only one year to go, she’d finish anyway without his help.</p>
<p>“I’m not obligated to buy my kid a car, but if I sign something that says I’ll buy a Toyota, then I’ll have to pay.”</p>
<p>As a general rule, that’s not true. Promises to give a gift are not usually enforceable, even if they are in writing. As jonri notes, the rule is different here because there was a negotiated agreement where both sides engaged in horse-trading, and the contract with the father was an extension of that agreement…not a stand-alone promise to give a gift.</p>
<p>This is certainly a lesson on what parties should negotiate.
Support until 18? Until 21? 4 yrs college? 1/2 of 4 yrs college? R & B? 1/2 of R & B? “Reasonable” costs of college? No mention of college? A specific dollar figure toward college?
My S is past college age, but if I were divorcing now and had a 10 yr old(for example) I’d hesitate to promise anything toward college.</p>
<p>jonri, you assume incorrectly. I have been a single parent for almost 15 years. We all expected my ex would contribute to the college expenses - and I gave up nothing at all for him to agree to that - but his circumstances have taken a drastic turn for the worse in the years since then. I don’t intend to enforce that clause in our agreement because it would literally kill him at this point. My children are all over 18, understand that life can hand you lemons at times, and have made adjustments. They will have some loans to pay after graduation, but chose their schools and fields of study wisely and I gladly help them as much as I can. In any case, I would be disappointed that they would be so greedy and vindictive toward a parent over a matter of $20K as they have been raised to have better characters than that.</p>
<p>I didn’t invent any scenario…it was clearly identified as speculation on my part, given the nature of his business and the timing (it would have been 2008 or 2009 when she was a senior). It’s telling that his ex-wife did not choose to seek enforcement of the divorce decree though. The daughter prevailed because her dad had signed a separate agreement with her in 2005.</p>
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<p>I don’t think it would be too unreasonable to expect her to repay the loan for her final year herself! I don’t know why Mom and student chose to use a private loan for the entire amount as the student would have been eligible for a $7500 Stafford loan. Btw, the Stafford loan may have been eligible for loan forgiveness…the young woman is now a teacher in CT.</p>
<p>I am have been divorced and the ex in my case quite literally stole nearly 40K of college investment back in the 90’s. I did not make concessions in my own division of assets but instead allowed the father of the child to maintain executive control over a college savings trust. The cost of suing this man, who had an attorney that preferred his fees vs what was in the best interest of the child, was such that even if I had had the money at the time would have probably wiped out any potential gain. </p>
<p>And for the record… my father died during my final year of college. And yes, I turned to loans that I ended up paying off myself.</p>
<p>In my divorce agreement, the ex was supposed to contribute half of educational expenses and medical expenses, which he never did. As in Modadunn’s case, the cost in lawyer’s fees to recoup the money would have wiped out the potential gain.</p>
<p>The agreement was not specific to college costs, but the ex is contributing nothing. The ex continues to pay his nominal child support, as per the divorce decree, but I and my current H are covering college costs for S. At an in state school. At this point, it is more like Jonri’s case, the ex has been unemployed for 2 years and was divorced again a year or two ago, with child support for another child to pay. So you can’t get blood from a stone.</p>
<p>I don’t think we covered private wagers in contracts class, but I do know that sports bets and the like are not enforceable unless they are part of a licensed gambling operation. Illegal contracts (like for the sale of drugs or prostitution services) are never enforceable. This is why Tony Soprano’s goons come to shoot you in the knees if you owe them money…they’d get nowhere trying to collect from you in court.</p>
<p>If you’re talking about some other kind of wager, then I don’t know. Maybe another lawyer who paid more attention in law school will pipe up.</p>
<p>Divorce decrees are typically enforceable, but you have to be wiling to spend the money to have it enforced. Simple cost/benefit analysis needed. I will venture to guess that the woman in question had a pro bono attorney who was more interested in setting a precedence that will be quoted in decades of these cases to come: AKA Case law. Not a bad little moniker to have on your resume. Therefore it cost her nothing except for the relationship she had with her father, which was horrid to begin with. Sad. She might be able to convince herself that it was for the principal involved, but I doubt her pro bono attorney will stick around to be sure she collects on the judgement and again, it will become a cost/benefit analysis.</p>
<p>It always amazes me how many times insurance companies etc are willing to settle even when they have a strong case against settling. It’s simply cheaper.</p>
<p>^ Get divorced and your kiddo might sue you for college tuition… stay married and you’re off the hook… Actually, toblin, that sounds to me like a financial incentive to stay married!</p>
This is because (generally) a promise is only enforceable if the promiser also gets something for it–this is called “consideration.” So: “I will give you a car when you turn 18.” Not enforceable. “I will give you a car if you mow my lawn every week for the next three years.” Enforceable (if all the other rules affecting enforcability are met, of course.)</p>
<p>It bothers me that broken families expect the courts to solve all of their disagreements. I’ll make no assumptions about why the father didn’t fulfill his comitment to his daughter, but as someone else so adeptly said, at times life gives you lemons. You adjust and adapt and best you can and then move on. I’m of the opinion that this young woman should have expressed her dissappointment in her father, emphatically told him so, and then moved on towards a successful life without him. What has she really gained by the litigation besides more agita and sadness?</p>
She got the money this deadbeat owes her (at least, hopefully she’ll get it). It seems to me that he’s the one who’s getting the agita and sadness, and it’s probably well deserved.</p>
<p>Hunt, if he is truly a deadbeat, yes he deserves scorn. But we don’t know the full circumstances of this family’s situation. You know that divorce and its results are a complicated matter where people will put their demands, desires and emotions ahead of reason and practicallity and even fairness.</p>
<p>I’m also surprised that he signed a written agreement to fund her through age 25, which is much more generous that many are willing to fund these days. Most kiddos graduate from college at age 21 or 22. Is she thinking to have funding for grad school too? The money that both sides paid for the lawsuit could have funded more years of school for the plaintiff, her sibs or others.</p>
<p>A rare situation in that there was a contract. Too often a parent makes promises to pay for college without thinking about the what the expense will be. Just like we read so many posts here from folks who find out that not only can the cost be prohibitive, that all those scholarships and aid programs are not available for their kids. Really a shocker if they did not look into this earlier. </p>
<p>And when you throw in a divorce and a new life taking up more of the money, it happens quite often that the parent won’t or can’t pay the cost of a private education. Or anything if the finances just don’t allow it.</p>
<p>My close friend’s daughter found herself in that situation. She was always an excellent student and daddy’s pride and joy. Of course he would pay where ever she should go to college. He was also a surgeon and made a lot of money. Too much for her to get any financial aid that took his income into consideration. A divorce and a new life changed Dad’s perspectives. He refused to come up with the then $50K that was needed for her schools. And those schools wouldn’t give her anything other than loans which didn’t come close to covering the cost. She ended up living with her mother and commuting to college. Very bitter pill to swallow and she is still sore about this. She did graduate summa cum laude and was accepted to a top law school where she went, taking out a slew of loans. She spits at the name of her father. Her brother fared no better. Happens all of the time.</p>
<p>This whole thread just makes me want to hurl chunks… to the point I have virtually no words to type. Emotion, bitterness, lack of any sort of rational, logic… or just plain common sense.</p>
<p>I’m sorry, but parents are and should never be required to pay for their kids college. Yes, it’s awesome if they are willing (and can afford it)… but sheesh…</p>
<p>I’m wondering if there will ever be a law that states when this is court required “college support” enforced that the kids are then somehow financially responsible for the parents care after the age of 65. Perhaps required to pay for their in-home nursing care or a nice retirement home. </p>
<p>The father was required to pay because he CHOSE to sign a written contract. The court found that the contract was enforceable, so it must have been supported by consideration. </p>
<p>We don’t know the history. But the bottom line is two people made a deal, one held up their end of the bargain, the other didn’t. The subject of the deal or the relationship of the parties is irrelevant. If a father and daughter agreed to buy a car together, or to fund a vacation together – and one didn’t keep up their end of the deal, then the contract would be equally enforceable.</p>
<p>I don’t know that it caused all that much family animus or grief. It’s a relatively small dollar amount – (big to them, but small in terms of how courts handle it) – so there was probably a very streamlined court proceeding. Sometimes the best way to settle a dispute is by going to court, especially when its a “short cause” type of matter – you aren’t talking about months of legal wrangling and depositions – just each party showing up to court and presenting their cause before a judge, who rules from the bench or shortly thereafter.</p>