<p>Yes you are Debrockman…That was the point of my posts. When people cry with a loaf of bread under their arm people have little sympathy. The folks receiving financial aid are not to be ridiculed or shamed or told that their kids got in because the school needed poor kids for their diversity profile, and yet that is often the tone on these threads. I just can’t stand listening to that kind of c$^% because it usually comes from those who have been fortunate to not need the aid. I really feel for the kids who are less fortunate they we are who have what it takes to go to an MIT or Cornell but are taking out loans that will be difficult to pay off later. These kids are struggling to stay afloat financially in college and in my opinion that is what need based aid is all about. Provide to those who need.</p>
<p>sylvan, I hear you. My hackles always go up when I hear someone say we haven’t managed our money well or that we don’t care about our kids. LOL. I want to say, Oh…honey…if you ONLY knew.</p>
<p>Sorry that you are offended Sylvan. I am offended by much of what I hear regarding this subject as well.</p>
<p>Lots of great kids don’t get to go to Cornell or MIT for lots of reasons…so they go to Purdue or, God forbid, Miami of Ohio. And they live happily ever after.</p>
<p>Or even worse, they go to no-name undergrad and the University of KY medical school like my husband. LOL. It’s a great country.</p>
<p>“I think that everyone is pleased that her grateful kids were given a lot of support in their education, but I’m not sure that anyone was handed a straw man.”</p>
<p>her strawman are precisely the assumptions about your financial situation, etc. Because they are relatively easy to shoot down.</p>
<p>I am NOT arguing that any particular family has a “correct” EFC. I am only arguing that, ceteris paribis, its easier for higher income folks. That and not even not holding all things strictly equal, most higher income folks have an easier time financing college than MOST middle/upper middle income folks (to be more specific, most families with incomes above 180k have an easier time than most families with incomes of 120k, and most with incomes of 120k have an easier time than most families with 75k)</p>
<p>“Some may have been desired athletes that the school wanted, but the parents wouldn’t pay (or they had a better offer elsewhere).”</p>
<p>when did Harvard start offering athletic scholarships?</p>
<p>"Just about every family is in shock the first time they realize just how expensive college is going to be, and how much it’s going to cost. No system is going to be absolutely fair to everyone. When people educate themselves about the nuances of the system, and how it works, that tends to generally take care of the strawman arguments. "</p>
<p>Yes. I believe though, when people are more educated about the nuances of the system, they usually realize that its more difficult, as a general rule, to finance college as you move further down the income scale. You have less money left over to live your life after paying for college at lower incomes. </p>
<p>Several people on this thread who have been around CC for a while are making posts that either directly claim, or in some cases imply, the opposite.</p>
<p>Brooklyn, but some of us are responsibly deciding that for health reasons, “financing” an education is not a good choice…or ripping money out of retirement, when retirement could come sooner rather than later. And some of us are deciding that really, bang for the buck, our kids will have everything they NEED with a quality public education, and they aren’t sacrificing anything.</p>
<p>Debrockman…Should my kids have given up their spots for a more deserving wealthy kid? It is the tone of the forum that I dislike. I call it as I see it and what I see I don’t like. I NEVER said that schools outside of the top 25 are not good enough but for what my kids wanted to do the schools they attended were perfect for them.</p>
<p>the tradeoffs in private vs public are, IMO, unique to each family, and to each student. Many students, of course, have a BETTER education at a particular public than at the privates they were considering. Many will pass up on a SLIGHTLY better education, where the difference in quality pales before the difference in cost. And some will find a private education to be a good value for them. It depends on many things, which I do not need to rehash here, as we have had to many public vs private discussions. While I do not think every family’s choice is always right, I think in most instances the family has a much better idea of whats best than I as a poster here do. And even where they do not, I do not really see much use in critiquing their choice.</p>
<p>I am posting in this thread ONLY because of the statements I see about larger issues. Claims that the FA system makes things systematically easier for folks with lower incomes. Claims that full pay folks are subsidizing need based FA. Implications (well what look to me like implications) that lower income folks should be happy with publics, IN ORDER that there be less need based FA for middle income folks at privates, IN ORDER to (allegedly) make privates more affordable for full pays.</p>
<p>No way. I think that if the schools gave you money, they thought your kids deserved it. But there are people on these Boards who make ridiculous claims about those of us who make practical choices that make sense for our families when we really do not have an Ivy option without a lot of debt. Any Ivy or elite education is just not a necessity for most of us. A doctor or a CPA or an actuary does just as well, generally, whether they went to Cornell or to the University of Michigan or IU. I don’t appreciate the comments that indicate that those schools have a “better class of student”. They generally do have a smaller, uniformly outstanding student body, certainly, But the top 10% at Purdue or IU or Michigan ain’t a shabby bunch.</p>
<p>^I have never said that top students at a great lower tier school is not as strong as a student at the most elite schools. I will say that my sons would have been snoozing at my daughters school. That is simply the truth and if someone wants to argue that point than they don’t know my kids. We did what we thought was right for each of our kids. They went to their respective schools because that was what they felt was best and they knew we agreed. It is about choices and if that makes some people uncomfortable trust me it is not any more uncomfortable than the wealthy saying needy kids don’t deserve their reduced tuition. That to me is just plain arrogant.</p>
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<p>In general, I agree. Which is not to say that there aren’t people at either end of the income scale who are getting incorrect (as in unaffordable) EFCs. </p>
<p>Retirement funding frightens me much more than college funding.</p>
<p>“Dear Moderator. Put her out of her misery.” That was so rude and uncalled for.</p>
<p>It seems some people think having money or making a large salary indicates a character flaw. My husband has a high income, not because he is better than anyone else and he actually went to a lowly (and I mean lowly) state school. He works very long hours, both at his office and at home. I am very well aware there are many careers with similiar hours without similiar compensation. I am very happy to be able to comfortably pay tuition out of curent income. I have never denigrated anyone who recieves financial aid at any income level. I happen to think a salary of $120,000 with 2 kids in college is not what anyone could or should consider a high income situation. I don’t care where you live, having an EFC of $35,000-$60,000 would be difficult at that income. I think there are odd cut offs and unusual and difficult situations that are not addressed by FAFSA. My sister’s EFC was undoable and they had some financial setbacks that make it impossible to get loans. It is a tough situation.</p>
<p>I just wonder why it is okay to bash the financially fortunate? No whining here, just curious.</p>
<p>Most of us pretty much agree that for pre-med it makes sense NOT to incur debt. There are other areas where that also applies. I think engineering is one. State med schools are absolutely fine options and also reduces the debt one will have.
For those with great in-state universities- great to have that option. A top student wanting a smaller environment can usually get great merit money from a good LAC (see Curmudgeon’s daughter’s history). </p>
<p>This thread reminds me of the “dumb jock” discussions.</p>
<p>"But there are people on these Boards who make ridiculous claims about those of us who make practical choices "</p>
<p>that may be. I have seen many comments on here (I won’t rehash them) that have made the kinds of points I have been trying to respond to.</p>
<p>I am not sure how this became about mom of wild child dissing Miami of Ohio. </p>
<p>Momma - three AFAICT is concerned about the same issues I am, though she expresses it perhaps in ways that sound more like attacks on you.</p>
<p>Who knows.</p>
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And yet, having told me that we “did something wrong” you are apparently unwilling to pontificate on exactly what that might be…I haven’t seen people here denigrating your choices.</p>