<p>“If finances were a concern, you shouldn’t have applied ED.”</p>
<p>Some schools are trying to counter this belief, not wanting only the well-to-do to apply ED. That’s why the Common App ED agreement has the “decline” verbiage; it solves this kind of problem without consequences.</p>
<p>CRD: Your reasoning is precisely why people who need finaid should not apply ED! There’s never a guarantee that colleges will agree with the students about what constitutes finaid. There is an exception if the accepting would constitute hardship, but that usually means that the finaid package was unacceptable or that the applicant’s financial circumstances changed (this could lead to negotiations with the college). There is nothing in the OP’s post that indicates the parents cannot pay, though not without some difficulty. Nothing seems to have changed since the OP applied, except for the full ride at the state school.</p>
<p>Yes, the problem is or will be solved. An ED school cannot enforce the contract, and all it can do is to alert other schools of the breach. It is most unlikely that state schools would care (though MIT might). But hey, Penn is probably happy that the applicant won’t matriculate.</p>
<p>ClassicRockerDad- The OP could have applied to UPENN RD and then compared all her packages. What is her explanation for applying ED? I can’t see a valid one.</p>
<p>I’m not getting this at all. The ED agreement clearly says that the OP must attend unless the financial aid offer does not make attendance “possible.” Not “acceptable.” Not “relatively more difficult.” But “possible.” OP’s first post said the aid offer was “not too horrible”, which I take to mean that it was sufficient to make it “possible” for OP to attend. Whether the OP received a better offer elsewhere is simply irrelevant to whether attendance is “possible” under the ED aid offer. So I fail to see, ClassicRockerDad, what “valid clause in the agreement” allows OP to withdraw.</p>
<p>Having said that, OP should talk to the ED school; they may be surprisingly understanding.</p>
<p>I’m also not a fan of ED for many of the reasons that have been discussed, and for a few others, but the ED agreement is not rocket science, nor is it “unethical”. It was also signed by the OP, his/her parents, and the GC. I guess either that means something to you, or it doesn’t.</p>
<p>“CRD: Your reasoning is precisely why people who need finaid should not apply ED!”</p>
<p>Isn’t that great? So only the students who come from families that can afford the costs of these schools should apply? </p>
<p>One reason I dislike these schools. :)</p>
<p>There wasn’t a deal. </p>
<p>It’s similar to buying a house. I accept the sellers offer. He accepts my bid. But my bid has contingencies. I can get out of the deal.</p>
<p>And the full ride changes the game.</p>
<p>"For those applicants who have already decided that the University of Pennsylvania is their first college choice and who agree to matriculate if accepted, we encourage application under the Early Decision Plan. Children of alumni also receive some preference under this plan in accordance with standard University policy.</p>
<p>Students who desire Early Decision and who submit their applications by the November 1 deadline will receive a mid-December decision of Admit, Deny, or Defer. Those admitted must respond to us by January 1, since there is a commitment involved. Those deferred will be reevaluated in March and will receive a final decision by early April. Denied students will not be reconsidered in the same academic year.</p>
<p>IMPORTANT NOTE: As noted above, a student may apply Early Decision to only one institution. Accordingly, if an applicant for Early Decision to the University of Pennsylvania also applies for Early Decision to another school, the Early Decision application to the University of Pennsylvania will be withdrawn. Further, if any Regular Decision applicant to the University of Pennsylvania is accepted Early Decision under a College Board approved Early Decision plan by any other school, the application to the University of Pennsylvania will be withdrawn."</p>
<p>Classicrockerdad, I can understand if OP said the family suffered unforeseen financial hardships that didn’t exist at the time of application, but even in that case, OP should have asked to have the application rescinded as soon as the situation arose.</p>
<p>If a student feels s/he is good enough to get into an Ivy, they should also know they can get very good packages at less selective schools. I see OP’s explanation as an excuse rather than a reason. Of course, there’s nothing wrong in trying to talk with the school, but they have no obligation to release OP.</p>
<p>“From the National Association for Admission Counseling Statement of Principles and Good Practices:
Early Decision (ED) is the application process in which students make a commitment to a first-choice institution where, if admitted, they definitely will
enroll. While pursuing admission under an Early Decision plan, students may apply to other institutions, but may have only one Early Decision application pending at
any time. Should a student who applies for financial aid not be offered an award that makes attendance possible, the student may decline the offer of admission and
be released from the Early Decision commitment. The institution must notify the applicant of the decision within a reasonable and clearly stated period of time after the
Early Decision deadline. Usually, a nonrefundable deposit must be made well in advance of May 1. The institution will respond to an application for financial aid at or
near the time of an offer of admission. Institutions with Early Decision plans may restrict students from applying to other early plans. Institutions will clearly articulate
their specific policies in their Early Decision agreement.
If you are accepted under an early decision plan, you must promptly withdraw the applications submitted to other colleges and universities and make
no additional applications. If you are an early decision candidate and are seeking financial aid, you need not withdraw other applications until you have received
notification about financial aid.
Yes, I have read and understand my rights and responsibilities under the Early Decision process. I wish to be considered as an Early Decision candidate at:
______________________________________________________________________. I also understand that with an Early Decision offer of admission,
this institution may share my name and my Early Decision Agreement with other institutions.”</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Marite, I respectfully disagree 100%. The financial “out” is exactly what makes it possible for people who need finaid to apply ED. I think she played this correctly, strategically and ethically. I think she is making a responsible, ethical, and possibly wise decision. In 20 years she may wonder what if? I have far more sympathy for those struggling to find a way to pay for an education than for UPENN. UPENN could match the full ride if they really want her. Then she would have no out. </p>
<p>I agree with dstark. This deal didn’t close. The offer was too weak.</p>
<p>The full ride had absolutely nothing to do with the ED agreement. I guarantee that the OP did not expect to get a “full ride” from Penn.</p>
<p>It seems like we have a hung jury. The defendant goes free. (Pun intended!)</p>
<p>Touche that was funny!!!</p>
<p>Thanks :-)</p>
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</p>
<p>The OP mentions that the finaid offer is not what the family had hoped for; s/he does not say the finaid offer does not make it possible to attend UPenn. </p>
<p>Let’s say a guy goes out on a date and promise to bring his date back home safely. Then at the party someone more attractive comes along and he drops the date. Can it be done? Sure, all the time. Does that make the guy less of a cad? You tell me. An eye on the main chance is not an attractive character trait.</p>
<p>I think it is unethical for colleges to offer ED. </p>
<p>I think it is especially unethical and cynical of colleges to have lower acceptance standards in the ED round, thereby putting pressure on students to apply ED. </p>
<p>Colleges are playing this game, essentially, to look better than they are. And to improve their bottom line.</p>
<p>I have a bigger problem with colleges being unethical than students being unethical.</p>
<p>EA is fine, though I have great respect for the colleges that did away with all early programs.</p>
<p>So ClassicRockerDAd, play this out for me, because in theory one ED, one EA and one public school sounds like a solid strategy. If you were the parent of the OP would the OP be going to the state school? Or would the OP be waiting to see what MIT deals out on Wednesday? Assume that both Penn and MIT will not be offering a free ride. What is the strategy? Decline Penn, decline MIT go to state school. Or decline Penn, accept MIT and pray that the offer isn’t rescinded and if it is the state school is the fallback position? I’m still struggling with the MIT piece of this. In your opinion can you "hold the ED school at bey until the EA finaid offer comes in? I don’t know and it all seems convoluted. The ED vs. State thing feels clear to me, but the Penn/MIT thing doesn’t feel strategic, it actually feels creepy.</p>
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<p>Let’s say hypothetically she’d have to sell herself on the street to go to UPENN, but with the full ride it is no longer necessary. Would you say it is still possible for her to attend UPENN? </p>
<p>Cuts both ways.</p>
<p>To the OP:</p>
<p>There are some posters here who seem to find it easy to be judgmental about your financial situation. </p>
<p>Please keep in mind that the most ethical thing you can do is to make responsible financial decisions. If attending Penn would require you or your parents to take on needless debt, then it may be irresponsible to accept the ED offer. </p>
<p>It may well be that what is “needless” today is the same as what seemed “necessary” last week. I think this is a concept that may elude people who hare financially well off – but those of us who live on tight budgets often have to rely on debt to finance major life undertakings, and continually adjust our view as to what type of debt is reasonable and necessary depending on changing life circumstances. Example: you want a job, but you need to have a car to drive to work, and the only way you can afford the car is take out a loan. Under those circumstances, you should buy the car. However, if a close relative, upon learning that you need a car, offers you the free use of their 2nd car – the situation changes. It is no longer reasonable and necessary for you to buy your own car – and what was a responsible decision one day, has become converted into an irresponsible and frivolous expenditure by virtue of the changed circumstances. </p>
<p>In hindsight it may have made more sense for you to apply to Penn RD rather than ED, but you could not have known at the time that you would be getting a free ride. Penn is a school where there is a very large difference in admit rates for ED rather than RD, and it is quite possible that your next-best option among private colleges after Penn could be substantially more expensive. So I think your choice to apply ED is understandable: it significantly enhanced your chance of admission to a school known to be generous with need based aid. </p>
<p>The posters on this board who are critical of your choices are not paying the bills. Either you are, or your parents are – and the choice you make should be with your financial stability and well-being in mind.</p>
<h1>2 is all set with apps, but I just decided over my dead body (and my husband’s) will #3 even consider ED.</h1>
<p>“Let’s say a guy goes out on a date and promise to bring his date back home safely. Then at the party someone more attractive comes along and he drops the date. Can it be done? Sure, all the time. Does that make the guy less of a cad? You tell me. An eye on the main chance is not an attractive character trait.”</p>
<p>I don’t see that analogy, but if the first date was a *****…</p>
<p>momofthreeboys: She declines the ED offer from UPENN because under her current financial condition (possession of an offer for a free ride), their offer makes it impossible for her to go. She is released. Period. </p>
<p>Since she is declining the offer, there is no longer a reason to withdraw the MIT application. However, she can only go to MIT if their offer is substantially better and MIT is aware of the UPENN ED offer AND agrees to allow her to attend. I think it would have to be a substantial difference. Not likely, but possible.</p>
<p>I would also be applying to more schools that offer full rides if they are better than the one in hand.</p>
<p>Calmom: Beautifully put in post 97! The full ride is a game changer.</p>