Delaware in-state vs oos

Colleges and Universities A-Z University of Delaware
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<p>I live in Delaware and my daughter is attending UofD.</p>

<p>We went on a tour during her Senior Year, she actually was accepted by the time we took the tour in Feb. During the tour we heard the complaining from the oos people concerning the in-state requirements. And they didn't understand the justification from the UofD admissions staff on why it is easier for in-state students to gain admissions.</p>

<p>Okay, lets first identify the issues that Delaware students face.</p>

<p>Delaware is a very small state and each year 5,000 - 6,000 students graduate each year. There are not that many high schools in Delaware, around 40. And keep in mind that there are not many of the "super" high schools that have the money to offer advanced courses that other states offer. My daughters high school did not offer AP classes until she was a Senior. That was the first year they offered it. They had a very weak math program ( no Trig ). My daughter had to study for her SAT's on her own, and she killed on the SAT's.</p>

<p>Choices for higher education are very limited in the state of Delaware. Really it is UofD or Delaware State University. Okay there are a handful of private colleges. </p>

<p>Delaware State is not a bad school, and is actually a good choice for certain degrees; pysch comes to mind. Del State is very small and has a limited set of options for majors. </p>

<p>The only other option is the large community college system in Delaware.</p>

<p>So UofD is the only major college or university in the state. And it is very cheap, even for oos students. Room and board is a bit out of whack. If you look at the oos cost for UofD, and compare it to some of the in-state costs at other states, UofD is cheap. Penn State's in-state costs are higher than the oos costs for UofD. </p>

<p>So a Delaware student who wants to major in something other than business, liberal arts, or healthcare is banking on UofD or going out of state. </p>

<p>As a parent of a Delaware student I need to know if I am facing the extra cost of sending my child to another state for college. In-state UofD is about 22,000 a year, that is pretty much all-in costs. Compare that to going across the border to PA or MD. Penn State would be 36,000 or so a year. That is a big difference.</p>

<p>The other issue is the small population of Delaware there are not that many potential Delawareans applying to UofD. roughly 1800 in-state apps vs the mountain of oos apps. </p>

<p>UofD would be a state university that had very few students from its own state if it did not have relaxed standards for in-state students.</p>

<p>Relaxed does not mean automatic admissions. Keep in mind that UofD has partnerships with the large community college. In-state students can attend UofD through the community college and they are considered UofD students. There are also UofD programs offered at the community college at small remote UofD campuses. Basically there are programs that help students who don't quite meet the UofD standards, but UofD gives them 2 years at community college to prove themselves. If they keep a certain average they can transfer into UofD later. </p>

<p>The other issue is that UofD was not very responsive to disclosing its actual admissions guidelines. So in-state students had to sweat-out the admissions process from the only real choice of state schools. So the answer was the "Commitment to Delawareans", which clearly spelled out what an in-state student had to do to be assured admissions. And if your school did not offer the courses, then they would take that into consideration. </p>

<p>BTW- My daughter would have gotten accepted without the in-state relaxed standards. Though the lack of AP and odd math offerings at her school would have hurt her. She did apply to UPenn and did not get in, though she did have a shot with her SAT's.</p>

<p>The point of this is for me to vent my frustration with Delaware, not the oos parents and students.</p>

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<p>Airborne,
My D is applying out of state and I am one parent who has no problem with the admission policies of U of D. I agree with you on all counts and am happy that your D has been able to utilize a wonderful college in her own state. We live in MA and my oldest D goes to UMASS Amherst where she is very happy and getting a great education at a reasonable cost. My youngest won’t be such a bargain, I’m afraid but it is our choice to apply out of state and it would never occur to me to complain about benefits to in-state students. I wouldn’t worry too much about the negative comments that you hear but I understand your need to vent. By the way, her application went in at 10 last night. Wish us luck!</p>

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<p>Good Luck.</p>

<p>One thing bad about UofD, it has a well earned rep as a party school. And the reason is simple, the staff does nothing to enforce any regulations concerning drinking or getting high in the dorms. Your D can drink day and night, no matter how old she is, and they won’t say a word. But if she violates the quiet hours with a loud TV they will write her up. Or even better if she brings a hot-plate or electric tea pot she will have to meet with the building supervisor…</p>

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<p>I completely understand (D is an OOS applicant) where you’re coming from. I face the same frustration in my own state. She would love to go to Binghamton and is very high in the applicant pool, but the admissions people told everyone straight out that they’re granting preference to OOS students because of the money. The new “modified rolling” admissions plan turned out to be a way to grant that preference to OOS kids and hold up the instate kids till afterward. So my D is a great candidate with a specific interest that would be well-served by either Binghamton or UD, but she is a second-class candidate at both. Which stinks for her. But your state is doing the right thing.</p>

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<p>airborne - I sympathize with the plight of Delawareans looking for colleges. Your observations are exactly on point. That said, there are real advantages to having >15K students in a public flagship university. As you observed, that would be impossible without a large OOS contingent.</p>

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<p>Thank you, Airborne for the insight about the drinking problem at U of Delaware. It isn’t the first time I have heard complaints about it and it does concern me. Both of my children prefer the larger colleges and those seem to be the ones with the big party reputations. As I mentioned my older D goes to UMASS Amherst which has a big drinking reputation. She doesn’t seem to be too interested in the party scene and it hasn’t been a problem but I wish more colleges would be more proactive on that front.</p>

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<p>OOSer here who has no issue with the so-called relaxed standards. Sounds like policy that makes sense for a state the size of Delaware.</p>

<p>I had asked about the drinking on another thread, but no one responded. My daughter isn’t experiencing this on her floor.</p>

<p>What happens if you complain about the partying? Is there any escalation process that can be used? I’m actually aquainted with a kid that was asked to leave (3 strikes?)</p>

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<p>As the parent of an OOS student, I have less of a problem with lower standards for in-state students than I do at a school like SUNY Binghamton which does things the opposite way – lower standards for OOS.</p>

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<p>This is an interesting dialogue, and it is interesting because the 2 states mentioned that have opposing policies, also have very different admissions factors. Delaware, a tiny state, can not possibly fill their slots with in state students, thus they need out of state students. Since they are a small state, they are not burdened with tax deficits like it’s larger neighbors, and their budgeting can be somewhat competitive as they depend upon oos students. As their academic standards increase, and it’s desirability increases, so will it’s costs. I don’t know if I agree with Airborne’s limited list of Udel’s majors, they have a pretty full complement of subjects. My S is in engineering, with double minor and lots of options. They have PT, Crim, and many other departments. </p>

<p>New York, on the other hand, has a very good educational system, and millions of kids who could and should attend SUNY schools. Unlike Delaware, there is much less appeal for oos to attend the SUNY schools, mostly due to locations of campuses. Buffalo attracts a good amount of oos and international students, but that’s about it in a 30 school system. As bad as NY budgetary climate is, they keep the cost of SUNY education pretty reasonable of oos and instate (with lots of partial scholarships - the only bargain offered in NY imho) as an incentive to stay. </p>

<p>Penn State, UMD, UConn, and other schools in the region are simply more desired, whether it is location, sports, facilities, or just all around luster, and thus can command higher standards and tuition. It may not be fair to everyone, but is the way it is. </p>

<p>As afar as party school reputation, if you can find one college that is not - including evangelical ones - let us know. It’s pervasive in today’s society, and it is an embarrassment to all.</p>

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<p>In the end a state school is a state school. I am in NJ and cannot justify paying that much more for schools like UConn ,UMCP or UDel when Rutgers rates just as well, so it comes down to the merit money. My son is a good student (loves UDel) but I can’t justify paying 30K for Delaware if Rutgers gives him a free ride.</p>

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<p>I totally agree with you. OOS tuition is almost triple what our state’s flagship charges so it made no sense to send my son to another state school without a sizable scholarship.</p>

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<p>I didn’t realize this would spark this much dicsussion.<br>
First I am not complaining about oos students, as pointed out UofD actually needs them. I don’t think for the money, as much as for the bodies. The issue from UofD’s standpoint was how to actually get more in-state students. </p>

<p>I was just hoping that maybe a parent from oos might read this and gain some insight, so when they go on a campus tour that they don’t verbally assualt the admissions staff during the Q&A. Well at least not about this topic. ( Instead assualt them on the cost of housing. ).</p>

<p>I say not for the money. But I believe that maybe not be true. My understanding was that UofD was chartered as a state school, but due to the DuPont family and company support that the school didn’t need state $$. I actually heard UofD has a huge endowment. </p>

<p>As far as choice of school. I am not a native Delawarean, I actually still consider myself a PA resident, though I have lived here for 7 years. ( I am a permanently disabled vet and am stuck here until I can figure out how to physically move. ) But I don’t have any loyalties to UofD. But UofD has always had the status as a “cool” place to go. </p>

<p>As far as majors, except for Chem. Eng. and a few other odd majors, there are better choices for oos students. Other posters have pointed out this fact and I agree. For instate students there really are limited options. </p>

<p>Concerning the drinking. What really burns me is that freshmen are put in seperate housing areas. ( the worst rooms, that are overpriced. Though they have really nice housing for upperclassmen ). So it really would not be too hard to at least control drinking by freshmen in the dorms. But the RA’s really do nothing, I think they would actually hold the door open if someone were bringing in a keg. As far as I am aware very few freshmen are legal to drink. </p>

<p>I believe the philosophy of UofD is that they deal with the behavior and not the actual act of drinking. If your behavior is unacceptable when you are drunk or high, then they take action. One thing they did do, which I guess at least is in the best interest of the students, is to have an amenesty policy. If someone gets to the point where they need medical attention, they are not punished for doing so, they get a free pass. They only get one free pass. I think they should still be more proactive in enforcing the drinking by freshmen.</p>

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<p>“First I am not complaining about oos students …”</p>

<p>Ah, airborne. From another Vet (NOT disabled, thankfully), thank you for your service.</p>

<p>I thought you were very clear in your OP that you weren’t complaining about OOS students. UDel is unique in that it’s the only flagship public university with more OOS than in-state students. It is also unique that a single benefactor (ie, DuPont) is largely responsible for how the university looks today (which is pretty darned good, kind of like a LAC but with university-level resources). The 4-1-4 is also quite unusual for a state flagship university. My D is attending there because UDel’s uniqueness, and she has certainly benefitted from that uniqueness. (She also likes to have a good time, but that’s a discussion for another thread.)</p>

<p>I applaud UDel’s efforts to enroll Delaware students. I think it’s the right thing, and I think it’s a good thing. Yes there should be more choices for Delaware students. But it does appear that UDel is at least trying to give Delaware students a quality state university.</p>

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<p>4-1-4? What’s that?</p>

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<p>4-1-4 is an academic schedule that has a five-week (ie, approx. one month) Winter Session between the traditional four-month Fall and Spring semesters. Students can use this short term to catch up with courses they’ve missed, take electives unavailable to them during Fall/Spring semesters, or do study abroad … all without sacrificing their summers. It’s particularly useful to students who have rigid course schedules … such as those majoring in engineering and the sciences … and to students who want to double-major and still graduate in four years.</p>

<p>[Winter</a> Session at the University of Delaware](<a href=“Winter & Summer Sessions | University of Delaware”>Winter & Summer Sessions | University of Delaware)</p>

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<p>That winter session made it possible for my engineering major son to study abroad last year. As was implied above, he never would have been able to fit it in his schedule otherwise.</p>

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<p>The Winterm is great if your student wants to study abroad. My son went to Ghana last year and it was an awesome experience for him. It also allowed him to take extra classes so that he is on track to graduate in May '10 with a dual degree (B.A. in Political Science and a B.S. in Chemistry.) The only draw back of the winterm is that if your student does not take classes in Newark or travel it makes for a very long winter break especially since their friends from other colleges are not around to hang out with. </p>

<p>I also want to address a previous comment about RA’s. My son has been one for the last 3 years and I know for a fact that he has not held the door for anyone bringing a keg into the dorm. If he catches an underage kid in his dorm with alcohol he writes them up. I think it is unfair to expect RA’s to be substitute parents. Underage kids know the rules and are breaking them. You can’t expect an RA to police an entire floor or know what is going on behind closed dorm room doors 24/7.</p>

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<p>DEMOM,
RA’s are not parents, and the students are old enough to be held responsible for their behavior. And your comment is striking and really is the core of the problem. The drinking age in Delaware is 21. Any underage drinking in the dorms is a violation of state law. Your son simply writes up the offenders? How about calling the police, it is a crime.</p>

<p>UofD has chosen to allow the students to have the traditional college experience, including the party time. This is fine to an extent, since it has been going on for the last 100 or so years in American colleges. But a good portion of schools have cracked down. I remember when West Chester U. cracked down. </p>

<p>There is an underlying issue and the town of Newark is at odds with UofD over legal issues. UofD does not want the police called. They want everything handled by the University. Which I can sortof understand, but over the last year or so the campus police decided they are going to be the only people that can call in outside law enforcement. </p>

<p>This may sound logical, since they are the campus police. The reality is that the campus police have to elevate any felony, and that is understood. So the campus police have to respond first, then call the locals? The campus police are not investigators, they are security and crowd control. So they will only compromise a crime scene and add a delay in an emergency.</p>

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<p>I think DEMOM’s main point is that RAs aren’t facilitating drinking in the dormatories. Regardless, making RAs and extension of the Newark police force certainly isn’t a practical solution. I mean when an RA approaches a dorm resident you don’t want the conversation to include “I’m not saying anything until my lawyer gets here.”</p>

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<p>The UD police are a fully accredited police agency and have full police and arrest powers through the state. They can handle a felony or any other crime themselves. There is nothing that they need to call in an outside agency for that they cannot do themselves. Likewise, UDPD has full arrest power on and off campus and you frequently see them pulling over cars in the City’s jurisdiction.</p>

<p>Of course UDPD is going to respond to emergencies on campus, because it’s their campus. Why would another agency respond? It’s no different than if you call for the police at your home, you local PD will respond instead of the PD from the town over.</p>