Detroit among the best cities for families?

Colleges & Universities A-Z University of Michigan
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<p>That’s true, but the same can be said of students graduating from many of the nation’s leading universitie, relatively speaking of course. </p>

<p>Unemployment in the US is very close to hitting 10%. California and NY have unemployment rates almost as high as Michigan. Of course, those states are much larger and as such, have more job opportunities for fresh college graduates. However, let us remember the supply side of the equation. Let us face it, the State of Michigan only has one elite university and it graduates 5,500 students annually. Very few people from neighboring states purposely target Michigan as a place to work. So the top companies in Michigan, and there are several, recruit very heavily at Michigan and MSU. One may not think of Michigan as having many companies, but it has several. Kellogg, Dow Chemical, Down corning, Whirlpool are all doing relatively well and recruit heavily. Many out of state companies have large divisions in Michigan, such as Deloitte, Ernst & Young, General Dynamics, Google, IBM, Johnson Controls, KPMG, Nissan and Toyota (both of which have large research divisions in Ann Arbor) etc… to name a few. And the Big 3 may be down now, but the humanity will always have the desire to move and as long as that is the case, we will need cars, so once they manage to reinvent themselves, they will be good places to work. My two years at Ford back in 2001-2002 were definitely worth it.</p>

<p>Now take California and the Northeast:</p>

<p>California students are graduating from Caltech, the Claremont McKenna Colleges, Stanford the UCs (particuarly B, LA and SD) and USC. Those schools combined graduate 25,000 undergraduate students each year. And one must consider the fact that students from all over the US want to move to California for the weather and perceived lifestyle. Does California have 6 or 7 times more jobs than Michigan? I highly doubt it.</p>

<p>The Northeast (from Boston down to DC) has an incrediblly dense student population attending elite universities and those are all located within 300 miles of each other. Each year, well over 15,000 undergrads graduate from the Ivy League + JHU and MIT. Another 20,000 or so graduate from other top colleges and universities, such as Amherst, Boston College, Georgetown, Haverford, Middlebury, NYU, Swartmore, Tufts, Wesleyan and Williams. Again, like California, many students from all over the nation want to move to the Northeast, so the competition for jobs in this area is very cutthroat. </p>

<p>At any rate, students at top universities generally find jobs regardless since companies from all over the country and the world actively recruit their students on campus.</p>

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<p>To state this in a few sentences: </p>

<p>The city of Detroit would be a terrible place to raise a family. Crime, dysfunctional city government, ridiculous taxes and terrible govt services. Would never even consider it. </p>

<p>The suburbs on the other hand could be a fine place to live. Of course places like Troy, Rochester, Farmington Hills, even the Grosse Pointes and Bloomfields are not as wealthy as some previously mentioned suburbs. But that doesn’t mean they are not great places to raise a family. Good schools, safe, etc. If I could find a good job in the Detroit area upon graduation, I’d take it in a heartbeat.</p>

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<p>Most suburbs are not as wealthy as the previously mentioned ones anywhere in this country. Detroit has more than it’s fair share of beautiful suburbs. I should know, I live in one of them.</p>

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<p>Bloomfield Hills is one of the 10 or 20 wealthiest suburbs/towns in the US. Grosse Point Shores is one of the 50 wealthiest suburbs/towns in the US. Those two cities are as wealthy as any city in the US. The median income per household in those two towns is $170,000 and $150,000 respectivelly. That’s comparable to towns such as Weston (MA), Great Falls (VA), Scarsdale (NY) and the cost of living in Southeastern Michigan is significantly lower than it is in NY and MA. </p>

<p>Birmingham, Farmington Hills, Rochester and Troy are not as wealthy, but they are pretty well off. </p>

<p>If you take those 6 suburbs, which have a combined populations of some 200,000, you have a pretty significant community of well-off familes.</p>

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<p>Even though it’s kinda pointless I disagree with you alexandre.</p>

<p>Bloomfield Hills is one of the 10 or 20 wealthiest suburbs/towns in the US.</p>

<p>Definitely Disagree. Off the top of my head I can come up with at least 10 communities just in Connecticut significantly wealthier and more old money than bloomfield hills, and that’s not counting a large number of new york and California ones. (by the way to the poster who posted the link earlier…look at your source… it is from midoakland.com… i wonder what they have to say)</p>

<p>Grosse Point Shores is one of the 50 wealthiest suburbs/towns in the US. Those two cities are as wealthy as any city in the US.
Maybe (But by chopping up Grosse Pointes it’s like talking about Greenwich in terms of Old Greenwich, New Greenwich, obviously it’s going to boost up the numbers)</p>

<p>“The median income per household in those two towns is $170,000 and $150,000 respectivelly, Weston (MA), Great Falls (VA), Scarsdale (NY) and the cost of living in Southeastern Michigan is significantly lower than it is in NY and MA.”</p>

<p>That’s irrelevant. Most obvious case in point, Greenwich, CT. Probably not the highest income per household you can find, but certainly the wealthiest place anywhere in America. The actual statistics that matter is networth per household. A huge proportion of Greenwich’s population are either retired bankers, mega fund managers (125billion of the 1.25 trillion AUM by hedge funds in the world is managed out of greenwich.), and people who withdraw out of a trust fund every year. </p>

<p>Being at hotchkiss for a couple years, we get a fair share of Bloomfield Hills and Grosse Pointe Shore kids. The caliber of wealth is different. The wealthy Michigan type of kids are generally from GM/Ford management or famous doctors; the wealthy greenwich type are generally ex wallstreet rain-makers, fund managers… the wealth level is not comparable.</p>

<p>This is obviously just my opinion. But being around old money for a significant portion of my life, it is pretty easy to tell the level of wealth at different places. Places like Greenwich, Darien scream wealth and have the wealthy aura that you can feel even before you get there. Bloomfield Hills, somewhat, but definitely to a much lesser extent. This is not a shot at anything or anyone, but it is the way it is.</p>

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<p>Actually bearcats, I have lived my whole life around money (old and new). Abu Dhabi roylaty has estimated wealth that tickles the trillion dollars mark. Those people will never discolse any information about their wealthy, but they are quite possibly the wealthiest people on earth. And I am not going to discuss my own family’s financial background and situation because it is irrelevant. But I will say that the US does not really have “old money”. Old money means wealthy for 1,000 years or 500, not for 100-200 years. There is no real “old money” in the US. </p>

<p>And Bearcats, Bloomfield Hills has been one of the 10 wealthiest cities with a population of 1,000-10,000 in the US for over three decades. That is not open to debate, it is a fact. We aren’t discussing academic quality of universities here, we are discussing balance sheets.</p>

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<p>^^ Let’s say the old money in America do exist. They are smart enough to keep a low-profile and stash their money elsewhere.</p>

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<p>tenisghs, I did not say that there is no old money in the US. There are some Europeans who first settled the colonies back in the 17th century who were wealthy and who’s families remained in the US. However, the vast majority of American “old money” elite were formed in the 1875-1925. Families like the Vanderbilts, the Carnegies, the Rockerfellers, the Fords, the Mellons, the Kennedys etc…Those tycoons accumulated as much wealth as any people in history, but that wealth was not created until 100-150 years ago. As far as I am concerned, that does not qualify as “old money”. To me, old money are the families in England, France, Germany, Itlay and other parts of Europe that current own hundreds of millions and in some cases billions of dollars but whose families were wealthy 300, 400, 500 or more years ago.</p>

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<p>You can’t compare the salaries that the major players in the hedge fund, private equity in Connecticut and investment banking world make with the ones that auto industry tycoons and wealthy doctors in Southeast Michigan make Alexandre. It’s really not even comparable; we’re talking about a difference of hundreds of millions of dollars here.</p>

<p>Off the top of my head, here are 10 townships that are definitely wealthier than West Bloomfield:</p>

<ol>
<li>New Canaan, CT</li>
<li>Darien, CT</li>
<li>Greenwich, CT</li>
<li>Beverly Hills, CA</li>
<li>Aspen, CO</li>
<li>Bloomington, IL</li>
<li>Brookville, NY</li>
<li>Atherton, CA</li>
<li>Naperville, IL</li>
<li>Chevy Chase Village, MD</li>
</ol>

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<p>Can you provide actual statistics that all 10 of those townships are “definitely” wealthier than Bloomfield Hills. The median family income at Bloomgton, IL is $61,000. That’s almost 4 times lower than the median family income in Bloomfield Hills. The median family income in Beverly Hills is $110,000, which is roughly half that of the median family income in Bloomfield Hills and given the cost of living difference between the Detroit Metro are and LA, that is a HUGE difference in wealth when adjusted. Just because you have a few wealthy movie starts does not mean that the whole city of Beverly Hills is wealthy. The median family income at Naperville, IL is $130,000. Again, that is slightly lower than the median family income in Bloomfield Hills. </p>

<p>Just for the record, the median family income in Bloomfield Hills is over $200,000 and roughly 50% of the homes in Bloomfield Hills have a value over $1,000,000. Darien, which both you and Bearcats claim is MUCH wealthier than Bloomfield Hills, has a median family income of $190,000 and a median house value of $1,000,000. In other words, the median price of a house in Bloomfield Hills is equal to the median price of a house in Darien CT and the average family income of a family in Bloomfield Hills is roughly equal to the median family income of a family in Darien. </p>

<p>So ring<em>of</em>fire, can you please explain how Bloomington (IL), Naperville (IL), Beverly Hills (CA), Darien (CT) and Brookville (NY) are so much wealthier than Bloomfield Hills? I don’t see it. It would appear that Bloomfield Hills is actually just as wealthy if not wealthier.</p>

<p>Now I do not pretend to know all those communities. Hell, I am not even that familiar with Bloomfield Hills. Most of my friends at Michigan came from Bloomfield Hills and its surrounding areas. I opten visited their homes and familes. But they were all pretty low key about their wealth. Those kids clearly knew they came from money and did not need to show it off. Still, wealth is relatively easy to measure in those demographic reports. If you have actual figures that proves that Bloomfield Hills is not in or around the 10 wealthiest cities in the US, I will gladly believe you. But so far, all you guys have done is offered me opinion. I have actually provided factual and validated figures that prove that Bloomfield Hills is at least as wealthy as many of the cities you claim at MUCH wealthier.</p>

<p>Oh, and ring-of-fire, much of IBanking wealth has been wiped out over the last year and will never be recovered, because that money was never there in the first place. I would estimate 50%-60% of the wealth was completely fabricated. It was not real wealth but ill-gotten gains to begin with. Those supposed wealthy people pretended to have money but it was not theirs to have. There was $125 trillion of “supposed” wealth floating around the US last year and that was supported by a mere $5 trillion of actual wealth. Money was being leveraged at a rate of 25 to 1. That is insane!</p>

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<p>“You can’t compare the salaries that the major players in the hedge fund, private equity in Connecticut and investment banking world make with the ones that auto industry tycoons and wealthy doctors in Southeast Michigan make Alexandre. It’s really not even comparable; we’re talking about a difference of hundreds of millions of dollars here.”</p>

<p>ring<em>of</em>fire, I know how much money Investment Bankers (HF/PE/VC included) make. I was an investment banker for close to 4 years. My father and uncle were both investment bankers for decades. It is not as much as you think…certainly not in the hundreds of millions of dollars. Sure you have a few top executives who make that kind of money, but althogether, we are talking about 200 or 300 people in the entire US. The vast majority of Investment bankers are no wealthier than the very successful lawyer or doctor. Most reasonably successful investment bankers make $500,000-$1,000,000 per year, which is around the same as the typical successfull lawyer and doctor.</p>

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<p>Excellent point Brosen, Kenilworth is indeed wealthier than Bloomfield Hills. In fact, it is probably the wealthiest city in the US. Wilmette is not as wealthy as Bloomfield Hills, but it comes close.</p>

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<p>Alexandre, my comment was referring to European aristocratic families who were already wealthy for centuries and immigrated to America to seek greater fortune/freedom (Continental Europe was beginning to show signs of unrest and decline in the late 1800s). You don’t hear much about them is because they keep a low-profile and have a behind-the-scenes influence. I wasn’t referring to the Fords and Rockefellers. ;)</p>

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<p>“In other words, the median price of a house in Bloomfield Hills is equal to the median price of a house in Darien CT and the average family income of a family in Bloomfield Hills is roughly equal to the median family income of a family in Darien.”</p>

<p>hmmmm???</p>

<p>Greenwich average listing price :$3,707,665
Greenwich average sale price: $1,487,500
<a href=“Trulia: Real Estate Listings, Homes For Sale, Housing Data”>Trulia: Real Estate Listings, Homes For Sale, Housing Data;

<p>New Canaan average listing price: $2,218,889
New Canaan average sale price: $1,036,250
<a href=“Trulia: Real Estate Listings, Homes For Sale, Housing Data”>Trulia: Real Estate Listings, Homes For Sale, Housing Data;

<p>Darien average listing price: $1,922,537
Darien average sale price : $813,750
<a href=“Trulia: Real Estate Listings, Homes For Sale, Housing Data”>Trulia: Real Estate Listings, Homes For Sale, Housing Data;

<p>Bloomfield Hill Average listing price :$1,027,375
Bloomfield Hill Average Sale Price ** $210,340 /**
<a href=“Trulia: Real Estate Listings, Homes For Sale, Housing Data”>Trulia: Real Estate Listings, Homes For Sale, Housing Data;

<p>Using sale price to gauge which reflects the most current housing trend, looks like Darien houses are on average worth 4 times more than Bloomfield Hill houses. Greenwich houses are on average worth a whopping 7 times more than Bloomfield Hill houses.</p>

<p>Also, alexandre, we are not talking about the average investment bankers here… Average investment bankers do not live in greenwich/darien type, retired RAINMAKERS/fund managers do.</p>

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<p>

</li>
</ol>

<p>Naperville, IL is a nice upper middle class area, but that’s it. It has pockets of middle class within it as well. It’s affluent enough, but it’s not OMG-Richie-Rich and it’s CERTAINLY not any kind of old-money. It’s hardly the most exclusive area in Chicagoland.</p>

<p>And Bloomington, IL? LOL. State Farm executives, maybe - but it’s in the middle of nowhere. I think someone just took a list from somewhere and doesn’t know what they’re talking about.</p>

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<p>Bearcats, I agree with New Canaan and Greenwich being wealthier. I never said otherwise. Darien is not wealthier though. And I certainly don’t agree that there are more than 10 much wealthier cities than Bloomfield Hills. Altogether, I would estimate that there are 5-7 significantly wealthier cities and another 5-7 slightly wealthier cities. And by the way, cost of housing does not necessarily reflect wealth as much as it reflects cost. Tokyo, London and Moscow are the three most expensive real eastate markets on Earth, but they are not the wealthiest.</p>

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<p>Greenwich, CT, a city almost 8 times the population compared to Bloomfield Hills, had 22 foreclosure from April to June 09.</p>

<p>Darien, CT, a city with 5 times the population compared to Bloomfield Hills, had 3 foreclosures from April to June 09. </p>

<p>Bloomfield Hills, had 214 foreclosures in the same time frame. </p>

<p>A reasonable explanation is that Greenwich, Darien people are retired rainmakers with ACCUMULATED WEALTH. It’s there and it’s not going anywhere.</p>

<p>Bloomfield Hills people are the management/professional type with ACCUMULATING WEALTH. Once they lose their job/income stream they are screwed.</p>

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<p>and as you can see, Bloomfield Hills has some uber low (multiple times lower) house prices compared to the typical wealthy cities. The bar of entry is simply not high.</p>

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<p>And yet, Breacats, residents of Bloomfield Hills earn more money than residents of Darien. I guess when adjusted for cost of living, Bloomfield Hills residents a much wealthier than residents of Darien. </p>

<p>And by the way bearcats, I don’t think that retirement areas (such as Greenwich) and vacation spots (such as Aspen) should be included in this study. But even, then, Bloomfield Hills is still one of the 20 wealthiest cities in the US.</p>

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<p>but the thing is, average household income really doesnt mean jack when it comes to the really wealthy area.
Think about it, Greenwich’s average household income is 120k. Do you seriously think that with an average income of 120k, Greenwich household can afford the over 1.5million dollar average pricetag on the houses? The average household income is low because these are retirement areas. Many households make 0 dollars with millions of networth because they are retired.</p>