I am sure we have significant influence on what they end up doing. I am also certain they’ll do what they want. These conversations have been going on with the kids since perhaps 6th grade. What do they like. To show other people in the family and friends and discuss what they do, what they may be getting paid, what does it cost to have a certain life style, what are the risks in certain professions, how long does it take to train (e.g. medicine), what are the boring aspects of each of those jobs, have the kids talk to the adults etc… Have them do tons of internships in various things just so they have an idea what those jobs are like. Make sure they are making good assumptions about everything along the way. Tell them that we have nothing to give them for an inheritance etc…
I am sure the kids are having inputs from the school, from other friends etc. If they don’t have inputs from the parents, then it is a missed opportunity to teach them about how the world functions, and how to make a living while still having a fulfilling life.
We made both kids acutely aware of the reality of their major decision. My daughter was in costume design /backstage theater originally and told us she will be working 2/3 jobs and not making much money but will be creating art. Well, graduating in Cultural anthropology bs during the pandemic (changed majors/schools junior year) there were no jobs. She worked as a assistant to 4 kids by herself with them all having to be on their computers remotely to learn their projects. All 5 year Olds with different schedules. She made a ton of money during the pandemic and lived at home and banked that. That, having her own real money, opened her eyes to maybe she can be creative in her work but still live nicely. She’s going into grad school in June in a field that she will live independently. Both kids after college have been totally on their own paying their own way etc.
I was raised to expect that my family would pay for four years of college, that I would graduate debt-free, and that I would need to be self-sufficient by the time I graduated. So while I was in college I made sure to add another major that was practical and would get me a job (though certainly not a high-paying one…working in public education in the south is not exactly lucrative). My spouse and I anticipate to use the same parameters for our child’s college education; what he studies is up to him, but he will need to be self-sufficient upon graduation.
No. One got an AAS in graphic design at community college. Art is clearly her strong suit, but she didn’t want an Art degree so this was her solution. She doesn’t make much more than working at Target but she likes it and she spends less than she makes. We’re in a low COL area.
The other just graduated with a Parks & Rec BS. Looking at jobs, there are the minimum wage seasonal types, and up to city park directors over $100K. Don’t know where she’ll end up (currently an internship at $13/hour) but it’s also clearly where she shines.
We like to say one majored in coloring and the other in recess.
I let them choose their majors in college. One kid major in Comparative Literature, in hindsight she said English should be her major, but she ended up adding Critical Studies as a second major, which is a film major. She loves this major after getting an A in her first production class, that’s got her hooked. She started her own production company in her sophomore year in college. But I think being a small business owner is hard even though she’s quite capable, so I did offer to pay for an MBA, parlaying her business experience, but she didn’t want to leave her business, she did apply to get a free mini-MBA from Goldman Sachs, I think this program has helped her in how to improve her business. She recently landed a lucrative deal with lot more money and my husband and I are named in her first movie, all from her own effort. This kind and sensitive kid is now very outgoing and doing well. She also bought a brand new car last year n her own credit. Needless to say my husband and I are very proud of her.
My other kid was very good in math and she wanted to apply to Math, but I said she would get her butt kicked in college for Math major, too many international students that are much better than American kids, so I’m glad she listened to me(not always), so she switched to Computer Engineering, that scored her Regents scholarship at her college, but her first semester in college she switched to Computer Science, much better suited for her than math.
I also would be gladly to pay for an MBA from top schools to complement or enhance their work experience. I figure that’s one way to front their inheritance. I don’t believe in handing money to them now. Both kids live a very good life, they are not just scraping by, going to multiple concerts and travel frequently to oversea locations even in this pandemic.
Neither of my kids were artists or musicians, so that conversation didn’t have to happen. Older S is a mathy person who always liked to make money, even as a little kid. I was more worried about him being the next Bernie Madoff vs poor. Younger S was more of a struggle. The Power Ranger comment made me laugh. We always tease him that in pre-school, he said he either wanted to be President of the United States, or… an underwear model!!! Uh yeah. That changed quickly, but we will never let him live it down. The path he’s taking now, I think he’ll be able to make a good living and be independent, but probably not as much as his brother. That is fine.
This, times a million. Anyone who doesn’t have wealthy full-pay parents (which make up a majority of CC, but definitely a minority in the real world) must be preprofessional in college. I would never advise a middle-class or low-income student major in the humanities or arts.
My children are young relative to the group but all are determined to go down the pre-professional route (business, consulting, high end real estate sales!)
All are money minded.
I put it down to environment. Never suggested anything as parents. In NYC, one lives next to a multitude of economic levels. The kids seem to talk about it among themselves too.
We continually asked our kids what they wanted to “be” while they were growing up, and stressed to them that what they want to do would change over time. Early on S16 wanted to be an astronaut, and D22 wanted to be Spider-man. Luckily, their goals did change over time.
Similar to @AustenNut, we let our kids know that we will pay for 5 years of college allowing them to graduate debt free. After that, we expect them to be self sufficient.
They do know, however, should they ever run into difficulties we will be here to help
And I’ve said this a million times: Pursue what you love, son, and you will make a go of it even if you have to live in a box under the freeway for while. Your undergraduate education will be our last financial gift to you. Our income has nothing to do with yours. You will make your own way in the world and build your own wealth just as your dad and I did.
Our son was hell bent on cinematography until his junior year of high school. Then he chose the military. It’s his life to do with as he pleases, and we always encouraged him to follow his passions knowing that the life of his mind will take care of the life of his wallet. The size of that wallet is immaterial (and has nothing to do with ours).
Our goal is to have our children grow into adults who are good people, happy, healthy, and financially independent. My two kids followed two different paths. The one common rule we had was that we would support them in any major as an undergrad, but if they wanted our financial support for grad school it would have to be for a program leading up to a degree that would allow them to be financially independent.
DS - He is a kid who likes to have things planned out and likes to know his path. Before college applications we talked and thought that a business major would likely be in his academic wheelhouse and be something he would likely enjoy and be successful at. He applied to b-schools. He did choose to attend a college which also has a strong liberal arts program in case business proved to not be his thing. Ended up getting a BS and a MS in Accounting and is working for a Big 4 firm.
DD - She is more laid back. She wanted to major in some kind of science and loves to work with kids. She decided early in her college career that pre-med wasn’t for her (too intense, too long a road etc.). In her junior year I encouraged her to shadow people in some allied health fields over vacations (she had contacts from an HS internship she did). That really helped her to figure out what she wanted to do --she ended up going to grad school for speech therapy and is happily employed in that field.
I want them to be (1) Good human beings; (2) Be able to support themselves and (3) Be happy.
A distant (4) is to be more successful financially than mom and dad.
Both my kids realize that it takes money to do just about everything in this world and being poor is not a particularly fun thing. They also realize that one cannot drive two cars at once, live in two houses at once. My daughter wants a big house and a very nice car. My son wants peace and stability. Very different goals and they were raised exactly the same.
Could it be that a heavy emphasis on (4) by some upper middle class parents has a lot to do with overbearing helicopter / tiger parenting, the tendency of upper middle class parents to deploy money to purchase opportunities and remove barriers for their kids, and pressure to choose elite career paths and colleges? After all, there is not much upward room (in terms of space to enter, rather than the dollar amount of income / wealth) from the upper middle class, so any such pressure can be intense to get to the elite level of achievement to reach one of the non-inherited places in the upper class.
We didn’t have to since financial stability was one of the major reasons of career choices for both kids. It is also one of important criteria for their partners since similar fiscal habits and goals are important for marriage. From their friends circle I can see that those who were at luxury not to select better paying careers were those who knew that their family will support them financially. Another observation is that first generation immigrants will influence kids to be doctors and lawyers and have stable income. Kids of those doctors and lawyers who don’t have to think about money will go into careers that don’t offer good pay. And their kids who grow up without money will look good paying careers.
$150,000 divided by 5 kids, absolutely needed to major in an employable field! Oldest got a 5 year masters in accounting, busted her butt and passed all cpa exams first try, hired right out of college. She’s a brilliant musician, gets paid gigs many times each month (her passion). Next majored in finance. Loves his job in valuations, should be making 6 figures 3 years out of college, spends weekends hiking and kayaking. Both will have paid off $80,000 worth of loans in 5 years. Third will have a ton of loans after her DPT program, her dream since freshman year in high school, graduating undergrad tomorrow after just 3 years which saved money. Fourth is a finance major, wants to be an actuary, should graduate in 3 years. Fifth hasn’t figured it out, will be staying local to save money on college. I think the majority of college students don’t have the luxury of exploring interests and spending thousands regardless of future employment and salaries. My husband works in finance, plays in the same band since high school. It’s funny, they get way more job offers than they want, they just do it for fun (band practice is once a week).
Yes.
I do not think people with generational wealth frequent CC and other such forums. We are mostly in the 9%. I understand fully the fallacy of limited space at the top. We are not afraid of heights but more worried about slipping and falling down.
We didn’t suggest our kids seek degrees that make more money. But we did talk to them about economics of different career paths. As well as flexibility, hours required, etc. Going into things with eyes wide open tends to lead to better decisions, less shock, etc. Decisions were theirs to make.
Son’s interests and talents put him in high paying jobs. Just worked out that way. He was wired for those things pretty much at birth. He is also extremely frugal and is saving a lot of money at this point.
Daughter picked a passion at a very young age and stuck to it. Bad ROI in terms of grad school/8 years of college required. She likely will make less at her peak than her brother does now. And jobs she has talked about taking right out of grad school will pay the same amount as I made as an accountant 30+ years ago (with just an undergrad degree – not inflation adjusted, actual same dollar pay). But its what she has wanted to do pretty much her whole life. Will she like it when she actually has to live on what she makes? Not sure but my guess is she will do fine with it.
One of my best friends growing up had a dad who insisted his kids go into high paying fields and could do what they liked for hobbies. All are in the healthcare field, have done very well financially and are happy from what I can see (not of them took any off ramps there were available to them to different fields). That same friend told his kids there are only 4 college degrees/career paths he will pay for. 2 kids in med school/medical residencies and two who appear to be headed in that direction.
Different people will have different approaches. Though for many people, financial issues have to play at least a significant role in decisions.
Basically no, we never did push our kids to go into a lucrative field. However…
My oldest might be the most talented musician that I have ever met (could I be biased?). She was fabulous. She used to have a sign on her bedroom wall that said “music = life”. We paid for lessons and never discouraged her. However, we did let her have a chat with a professor of music who I know. This particular professor of music also introduced her to a different professor of music who used to be a singer and dancer on Broadway. The two of them basically just talked about how difficult it is to make a living as a musician, and how you do not always get to choose what you play. This daughter started to neglect her music to focus on academics, and is now in a DVM program.
Once she started neglecting her music, she started spending more time with animals. She has a lot of experience with animals from many perspectives, including in a veterinary situation, and including reaching inside a cow many different ways. She found a path that is right for her. Being a DVM is not as lucrative as, for example, being a doctor (which is itself probably not as lucrative as it once was). However it is a good living if you really want to do it and if you can get your DVM without taking on debt, or at least with very little debt. Being a DVM is really something that you need to want to do. It requires a great deal of hard work and determination. I do not think that any parent should push their child into this path.
For our youngest we similarly did not push her into any particular field. She picked what she wanted to major in. In university at one point she switched her major and needed to take four lab courses at the same time. This seemed like it might be a lot. However, it turned out to be a bit like asking a duck who had never seen water to paddle across a pond – it turns out she loves lab work. Apparently it is possible to make a living in a lab.
If you are not going into a very lucrative career, then avoiding debt is a very good idea, and is something that I did push. For one daughter “avoid debt” was something that required me to be firm and insistent (she eventually thanked me). For the other daughter “avoid debt” was something that she felt just as strongly as I did (which is quite strongly).
