Also, what’s wrong with a biology major? It can lead to all sorts of things, including med school.
A chemistry major also can lead to all sorts of things, including med school or a pharmaceutical business. My husband majored in Chemistry in undergrad and then became a Doctor of Optometry, as one example.
Agree with all you said. My spouse has been in tech for 30+ years and I was in the field for a long time. Salaries are high and so are the demands in terms of work, learning new things and many other factors. It’s a competitive highly compensated, highly intense field.
In terms of compensation, I think crazy variations in tech happen. When I left a major tech co. my salary doubled. And then another offer came in the following week which raised the bar further, the company complied with the additional 30% more. I do think I provided written documentation as verification.
Why? If he liked that job more he should absolutely tell them what the offers are. The likelihood of someone meeting another offer is high. Taking the highest offer isn’t good negotiation, IMO and it might not be the best career path. We’ve had some people take a lower offer than the highest number with perks, some just take the original offer with delineation such as I want to be in X position and y can help me get there. During one’s career, it helps to be open and honest and that includes pay.
Surveys are nice, but humans aren’t always the most truthful.
And I, as a parent, personally wouldn’t quibble about “missing out” on a few thousand $ per year. I’m not telling my kids what they can or can’t study.
If you re-read my post, you will see that we had our son review salaries and what fields will require an advanced degree to be employable. Biology - along with other pure science fields - falls into this category. So, biology does poorly on our first concern (ROI for undergrad tuition), but it does well re our other two concerns. The short answer is that we would not dissuade him from studying Bio, but we would make sure he understood that he needed to go on to at least a masters.
People don’t usually match +50% offers. Even if they do, it will be reluctant. And every year the mark-to-market will be reluctant. You should also read the rest of the comment – I said “modulo the nature of work”.
Will Hunting also read on weekends and rivaled the knowledge of professors at MIT. And he had friends who would gladly take a baseball bat to you for him. And he ended up with a smart, fun, kind, beautiful girlfriend.
I suspect that many of the kids who major in music at Berkeley often do so as part of double major. They combine their passion/interest in music, with a major that has a reputation as having better career prospects. For example, ~20% of the listed music majors work as software engineers at Google/Facebook/Oracle. The software engineer music majors likely did a double major in CS + music. Other colleges/groups often show very different patterns. For example, some 1st year earnings for music majors as listed in the CollegeScorecard database are below:
New England Conservatory-- $19k
Johns Hopkins – $24k
Julliard – $25k
NYU – $26k
What are these music majors doing that gets them $90,000 a year in pay? Not everyone gets jobs with the BSO.
Many cobble together a bunch of smaller part time jobs. That works for my kid.
My younger son is interested in Biology. This is a topic of active discussion. We told him that an undergrad in Bio cannot be a terminal degree given his stated money needs. He should go down this path only if he is mentally prepared to do a PhD (8 years) or go to medical school (11-14 years). He agrees that the grad school choices are unpleasant. He is noodling on the tradeoffs. It is my job to surface these issues early enough so that the path taken doesn’t hurt him in the long run.
I didn’t realize the chart of starting salaries posted were JUST for UC-Berkeley.
A PhD in academia will not make a high salary, and there are not many tenured positions. One can go into research also.
Medical school is a long haul. Biology majors also go into other healthcare professions (PA, NP, PT etc).
Biology majors can teach HS and earn extra money tutoring, etc.
I guess if one wants a huge salary right off the bat then biology isn’t the way to go, but there are certainly opportunities and many paths.
And that it included those working in fields beside music most likely. That’s a bit misleading, don’t you think?
1NJ, I would have discouraged him from majoring in history at college due more to concerns about the “indoctrination mill” factor than salary. Besides, that is a subject he could easily learn about on his own without attending a university.
I wish people wouldn’t assume that others can just go to grad school anytime, so they should do anything they want in college from age 18-22. Grad school costs time and money, and often leads to student debt. Some graduate degrees, even from elite places like NYU, have a negative ROI. An elite MBA runs $200k, not counting the lost salary of those years of perhaps another $150-200k, even assuming one is admitted to the T7 schools. That is a $400k journey ( not many companies pay for it anymore).
Yes, great data analysis!
I tell my kids and whoever asks me that an MBA is a $500k+ indulgence – opportunity cost and actual cash costs. Best avoided if one can.
Since I mentioned grad school, perhaps your comment is directed to me, not sure. I will say that in no way do I assume just anyone can attend graduate school if they want to! It costs money in most cases, though not necessarily for all PhD programs. I was simply saying that an undergraduate degree is not what it once was years ago and that for many professions and careers, one may need to go to graduate school.
On a personal level, my kid in the performing arts did not go to graduate school because her undergraduate degree is considered a professional degree program, a BFA.
My other kid did go to graduate school. My kids are VERY fortunate to have parents/family who will pay their education expenses, though they qualified for aid. I took out lotsa loans too. My graduate school daughter also got scholarships in graduate school. It was our value system to do whatever we could to provide their education, after which they were on their own. I realize some parents won’t pay anything for college or anything for graduate school, either because they cannot afford to or don’t wish to for whatever reason. So, higher education was our investment in our kids, even if very challenging to pay for. I also realize many parents support their kids AFTER they graduate, and we NEVER have. I invested in their education so they would become educated individuals. I never looked at ROI as to whether it was “worth it,” because education itself was the goal. However, considering both kids are successful in their chosen careers and have supported themselves since graduation day, I guess one could say it was worth it on that end too.
But if his interest and aptitude were in humanities, not math or another quantitative field, what would you have done?
This is very true, but there are also ways to get funded (full/partial) for graduate degrees.
My daughter did a popular gap year program that paid for 90% of her masters (necessary for this particular job). She paid $3000. Not nothing, but not horrible.
She is now in grad school where she is receiving FA and merit.
While I do agree with you, there are options…at least for some professions.
I went to grad school on a veteran’s grant and didn’t pay a dime in tuition. It can be done.