This is the smartest thing I did without knowing it was smart!
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At highly selective colleges, biology is often one of the most popular majors. Prior to the recent CS boom, biology was typically one of the 2 most popular majors, the other being econ. The main reason for this is pre-meds. While pre-meds can major in anything (so long as they do the pre-med classes), most choose to major in biology. Some specific numbers are below from Stanford:
Most Popular Majors at Stanford by Year:
1965 (Vietnam) – 18% History, 10% English, 9% Econ
1974 (Bio boom for unclear reasons) – 12% Biology, 10% Psych, 10% Econ
1984 (Reagan elected, Home computer) – 17% Econ, 15% Bio/Hum Bio, 7% Electrical Eng
1990 (Cold war, End of USSR) – 13% Bio/Hum Bio, 10% Econ, 8% Polisci
1996 (Psych boom for unclear reasons) – 17% Bio/Hum Bio, 12% Econ, 11% Psych
1998 (Stock market boom, CS still uncertain) – 17% Econ, 13% Bio/Hum Bio, 8% Psych
2001 (Delayed effects of dot com boom) – 13% Bio./Hum Bio, 9% CS, 8% Econ
2008 (Subprime mortgage crisis) – 18% Bio/Hum Bio, 7% Econ, 5% Gen Eng, … CS: 4%
2019 (2nd CS boom) – 20% CS, 10% Bio/Hum Bio, 5% Econ
Brown provides long term information by major. At 10 years out, the most common job titles of bio majors were:
Most Common Job Titles of Brown Bio Majors: 10 Years Out
- Physician
- Resident Physician
- Student (primarily at med school, although a significant minority did PhDs)
- Director/manager
- Fellow Physician
I would not be surprised if it were more common on these forums than in general, since many students here grew up in high SES environments where their families’ living standards consume most or all of a $250k+ income (where they will not get any need based financial aid at any college). An extreme example is a recent one who said mentioned being “broke” with a family income of $840k.
With those income and spending expectations, no reasonable expectation of entry level job after college after any college major will produce a financially comfortable life for them.
I understand the kind of lifestyle such kids are accustomed to and desire for themselves. But everyone needs to start somewhere and work their way up. Expecting such a high income at age 22 right after graduation seems like a lot and atypical of what first year jobs pay. But what do I know?
One more thing…often kids from rich families have parents still helping them financially after they graduate. My D has a very close friend in her 30s whose parents are both doctors and the parents subsidize her still. This young woman is in the performing arts. Very different situation than my D, who must earn her entire income without any subsidizing from parents.
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If you consider the popularity of majors at graduation based on events 4 years prior, that can make year correlations better. For example, students starting in 1998-2000 may have chosen CS during the boom, only to graduate in 2002-2004 after the crash. Similarly, with the crash in recent memory, CS was not very popular in 2004-2005, so there were relatively fewer CS graduates in 2008-2009.
I listed number of students enrolled in the major, rather than number of students graduating with the major. The listed years are the year with the most extreme major enrollment effects. For example, CS major enrollment peaked in 2001 and hit minimum in 2006-8. I listed 2008 due to the peak in Bio enrollment rather than low CS. I suspect this was more a process of elimination. With the sub-prime mortgage crisis and effects of dot com bust, students seeking a high salary might favor pre-med over econ/CS. I chose 2019 for the 2nd CS boom because 2020 shows the start of a decline due to what I expect is effects from COVID.
These are numbers from the senior survey this year at Princeton:
So you can see how each major fares.
The sample size is one quarter of the full class. Not a bad sample size.
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The Princeton pay numbers are probably inflated relative to general college graduates by favored recruiting from Wall Street and management consulting. Also, if “average” is mean, it is likely to be higher than median since a small number of very highly paid people can skew the mean much more than the median.
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Anything is possible. If you are claiming that the market irrationally pays Princeton grads more, then you need to offer some evidence in support of a claim like that.
Separately, a small number of some highly paid people cannot bring up the mean of a 170 sized department like CS to 200k. The intent of the post is to show that 150k+ average pay majors do exist.
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Yes, of course they exist. But to expect $150K+ right after graduation from UG seem atypical. The majority of majors did not make that pay following graduation. As well, for the top 3 majors, those were the average pay, so not every grad in those 3 majors got that salary upon graduation. Further, the survey says “expected salary” and is not necessarily actual salary. Thus, I think expecting to make $150K upon graduation may be atypical. I never said nonexistent.
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The survey question is phrased, “What is your expected income… Consider income to include base pay, stock options, and initial bonuses.” There are a variety of reasons why this survey response may lean on the high side – “expected” earnings for following year vs actual, including sign-on bonus and stock options, bias in self-reporting, etc. CollegeScorecard lists actual tax reported earnings for students in federal database (mostly federal FA recipients), which are notably lower than the survey responses at all colleges in the US. That said I don’t dispute that many CS majors earn $150k in their first year out of college.
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So, it’s a survey of 22-ish year olds, roughly representing 25% of the class, about their expected future 1st year earnings? What happened to other 75%, did those students not respond and why?
ETA: Data10 covered it.
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This survey asked for pay right after graduation. Not some number of years after graduation. I am not claiming that every graduate is getting that number. I know how averages work.
Right, but you pointed out earlier that newly minted graduates who earn $150,000 DO exist and nobody disputed that. I was merely saying that making $150K upon graduation seems atypical for all college graduates, not that it cannot happen and does not happen.
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This is not what some 22 year olds were hoping to get paid. This is what they know they are going to get paid next year based on what they were offered and what they committed to. Getting a 25% response on a non mandatory survey is pretty par for the course. The response rate is not a small number.
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The number is not a “hoped for number”. This is what kids are saying has been promised in the offers they received.
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Unless they don’t get what is promised for one reason or another. It’s the future, I assume nothing is guaranteed.
And I’d guess that if you were to include the other 75% of the class, as Data10 mentions, the numbers will likely decrease.
And who hasn’t embellished a survey. 
In fact, Columbia was just accused of it recently.
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These things are written down in the offer letter. Unless they rescind those offers, that is what they get paid.
If US election polling on the phone is believed with a 1000 size sample, I would say a 25% sample is likely to be exceptionally robust.
These surveys are anonymous. There is zero reason to embellish. Nobody will know that you are getting 200k in order to make you look great! And 200k is not necessarily considered great on campus !!
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How awful and tunnel-visioned people are to call a degree “worthless”! It saddens me that so many people do not understand the meaning of a higher education.
Also important to note: Nobody can determine where a degree or a first job will lead. Anyone who says that path A is secure and high-paying, and that path B is unsecure and low-paying, is narrow-minded about how a career unfolds. Most careers are like driving at night. You can see the road ahead a little bit, but the rest of the road becomes visible gradually, a bit at a time as you move forward.
Exceptions for a tightly circumscribed career path like medicine. Although even with medicine, there are unknowns and deviations.
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The reason medicine feels so secure is because the AMA has controlled supply indirectly for the longest time.
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