There isn’t a job in the world (that I can think of) that doesn’t have its unpleasant sides. Hopefully we can end up in a situation where the enjoyable outweighs the unpleasant.
And frankly one of the reasons our outside of work hobbies and interests are so fun is that we do them on our own terms. As soon as that becomes a job, we lose that freedom. A friend of mine’s dad loved and was so good at fixing and repairing things he ended up as the go-to handyman for the whole neighborhood. This was entirely unrelated to his job. People were forever telling him he should open his own business. His answer was always a quick “no, because then it would be work”.
While I recognize now, as an adult, that all jobs come with stress…I would venture to guess that many young adults might not fully understand this, at least while they are still in college.
Yes! There’s a reason it’s the young who set out to change the world. I try not to dampen the enthusiasm of youth, and just inject a dose of reality when necessary.
Different strands in this convo, all touching the OP’s question as to whether to suggest better paying degrees.
As best as I can summarize (leaving the very talented and very motivated few out of this):
Good to let kids explore different things, but not too much, because then they’ll fall short of 10k hours to get to virtuoso (gladwell via @neela1) and maybe a little directed exploration of hobbies because certain things like foreign languages and outdoor fitness always good (@momfromca)
@alqbamine32 puts it well, what is a job? vocation? bread-earning toil? And to what extent can one influence this, are people wired to view things one way anyway? And some people love hobbies but would hate do them as a job. Good point, whoever said this.
@choatiemom said something very profound about education on another thread, that if one could support it, to view it as a way to enrich one’s mind, that is their goal. Provided that that the mind’s education is taken care of, to figure out a way to earn’s one bread becomes a more trivial exercise.
I think some people have a an abundance of passions and brains and the focus to do it all or switch back and forth. Perhaps not fair to compare ourselves to them.
At some point, I realized that I/we were good at imparting some values and some behaviors to our kids (to the extent that it wasn’t genetic anyway) but I have most certainly fallen way SHORT of giving them all the enriching experiences that I should have. Not due to lack of material resources but lack of parental focus, I suppose.
Yeah, apologies if I have misinterpreted but I think these points are all valuable to think about how we guide our kids.
That is a great point. I hadn’t thought about it quite that way before. But I think it hits the nail on the head well (at least for me). When a hobby/interest becomes a responsibility, there is a loss of freedom that can make even a loved activity feel more stressful and burdensome. The activity can still feel satisfying but it no longer feels like leisure.
Heck, I could say that about the job of parenting and being the “head of household” in my family as well now that I think about it. Love parenting, wouldn’t change it, deeply meaningful, joyous at times AND it comes with a lot of stress, frustrations and a loss of freedom!And while I love my “co-workers,” at times they can be very irritating, indeed. Too bad that I can’t draw a paycheck at home too.
People can find their jobs satisfying, stimulating, and even rewarding, without being necessarily passionate about them. On the other hand, there are some jobs that tend to attract people who are truly passionate about them, whether they are financially rewarding or not.
And we’ve had the opposite experience. In my current field people go into it based on passion and interest, in my husband’s field, tech they often work until the morning hours trying to solve this or that problem. Most love their jobs and it’s a large part of what inspires them and also pays the bills.
I think one tends to surround themselves with like minded people. When we were younger it was even worse in terms of people being married to their jobs. Everyone we worked with, we also socialized with. The hours were long and people often traveled and worked closely together. Many even married. Not the same at all for some people we know in fields like teaching, real estate etc but more common in jobs with long hours.
Same here. But I think this is rare. Even those who have a lot of passion and love their jobs often have some aspect which makes them want to get some $$. For me, I’d do the work for no money but I’d still need to be paid for anything that involves running the business (like invoicing, IRS forms etc).
My kids have often commented on how much I love my work. I often find myself lost in it.
My goal 1,000%. I’d also add that they find a career that changes through their lives to keep them engaged. Some fields don’t change that much so the work can become repetitive. Other fields are always changing and that can keep people engaged long term.
I’m mostly retired from my job…which I loved. I actually am doing some work at no charge, and might be a guest speaker at a conference…again no charge. I do it because I like to.
Yeah, I don’t think retirement is a good indicator. A lot of people keep working because they have to.
I did think it was great my dad loved being a researcher and professor so much that he didn’t retire until he was 78, after 52 years. And no, ha, it was not because it was a cushy job. He worked his tail off.
Not everyone. Rupert Murdoch and Henry Kissinger both seem to still be pretty active in their 90s.
I was quite shocked to hear from an old friend earlier this year that he was retiring and walking away completely from the industry we’ve been in for the last 30+ years (he’s about 5 years older than me). He didn’t intend to do any of the typical things I would plan to do to remain involved, like be on company boards, write about the fascinating technology stories we’ve been involved in, or just consult part time.
I guess I’m just used to people in their 70s and 80s still being around. I have lots of great stories from people like that (one of the classic ones: “I told Neil Armstrong he should have used a high side thruster instead of a low side thruster” - this incident in case you are wondering Gemini's First Docking Turns to Wild Ride in Orbit - NASA).
Well I can only speak for us. I think I’ll work as long as I am able. My spouse works very long hours and has done so for 30 years. He’ll likely just do consulting. Or help mentor others in tech. He’s done that for a while. He would also like to see the expansion of STEM in underfunded schools as a volunteer type thing. He’s worked on that for years.
Ok…SOME people who love their work want to retire and smell the roses. It’s not like everyone who loves their work wants to continue doing it full time forever.
Being on company boards is not exactly a typical opportunity for most people who retire from full time work. Writing about fascinating technology stories presumes both desire and (writing) skill to write about them, in addition to having been involved or at least in contact with such technology stories. Not every job that someone had is the kind where part time consultants are in demand.
I can think of a lot of reasons people who don’t need the money and really love their jobs may retire:
• to finally do things they can’t do as much while working (travel is a common one)
• to finally stay home if work involved a lot of travel
• spend time with grandkids
• mandatory retirement age in some professions
• losing a job and difficulty finding a new one due to ageism
• health issues that make the particular type of work more difficult or impossible
• tired of the commute or other logistics
• just plain tired!
FWIW I have also worked with quite a few people in their 70s and even 80s who continued at their jobs long past the time when they needed the income. (To be honest, in some cases it seemed it had more to do with the person’s identity being so defined by their work that they simply didn’t know what else to do with themselves.)
LOL, I actually know a guy who was in this exact position! His wife “urged” him never to retire. He finally stopped working at about 83. Fortunately, this guy had lots of “puttering around the house” type projects to keep him out of trouble.
There are quite a few in the performing arts who have kept working well beyond retirement age…off the top of my head…Paul McCartney, Elton John, Bernadette Peters, Chita Rivera, Joel Grey, Andre De Shields, Bob Dylan, Stevie Wonder, Billy Joel, James Taylor, Bruce Springsteen, Morgan Freeman, Robert De Niro, Jack Nicholson, Harrison Ford, Betty White, Dolly Partin, Julie Andrews, Patti LuPone, Angela Lansbury, Willie Nelson, Glenn Close, Barbra Streisand, Betty Buckley, Mandy Patankin, Andrew Lloyd Webber, Tony Bennett, Stephen Sondheim.
Too bad that I can’t draw a paycheck at home too.