Disadvantaged by High School?

Parents Forum
1

<p>We are just starting the process of identifying colleges. S is a high school sophomore in an IB program. We are from a small southern state and S is attending one of the lowest ranked schools within the state. The school began an IB program about 10 years ago to help diversify the campus.</p>

<p>The school stats are about 90% free/reduced lunch and less than 50% graduate on time. </p>

<p>How does my son make himself standout. He is very involved in several ECs, one independent sport and two volunteer positions and has about 100 volunteer hours a year. The teams he is on regularly win regional awards and sometimes state. He also has won several individual awards at the state level. We are not interested in "padding" a resume, for example son refused to join the math team just to be on the math team. He is much more of a work hard play hard type kid with the attitude that life is to short to participate in a club to make it look good. School is school but the weekends were make for surfing.</p>

<p>Right now he is ranked in the top 5 of about 428 kids. All honors/IB classes and 4.0 average. Lowest grade ever was 97 in PreCal.</p>

<p>He is interested in schools like Williams, Wesleyan, Amherst, and Macalester among others.</p>

<p>Although we have a couple of students who are accepted to Ivy and Ivy like schools each year, the GC said none of top students apply to the LACs. SAT is just a bit above 1500.</p>

<p>So is there anything S should do to make himself stand out? The opportunities and resources available both financially and geographically just aren't available. We know that acceptance to one of these schools is a long shot but it is a shot he would like to take.</p>

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<p>I like your son’s attitude. His authenticity will stand him in good stead in the admissions process, ironically, because he is not doing things for that reason.</p>

<p>Many of the top colleges, whether Ivies or LAC’s or other schools, are looking for diversity, whether socioeconomic, or geographic, or other, and many are doing outreach to high schools that rarely or never send kids to their schools.</p>

<p>I think you should encourage your son to apply anywhere that he wants to go, with the caution, as for everyone, that there is always a chance of not getting in. </p>

<p>But coming from a less than stellar school can be a plus, in some ways, as I said.</p>

<p>Hope he keeps his good attitude about not joining for resume building, and surfing on weekends! (Is that in the ocean or on the web?!)</p>

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<p>One of the top 5 students in a rigorous IB program is likely to look pretty good. I really truly believe kids stand out by following their interests. It really can be serendipity that leads them to unexpected places. </p>

<p>For example, my older son was standard computer nerd. All his EC activities were academic or computer related. (Science Olympiad, academic team and a varied list of computer activities - learning on his own, computer lab helper at the Senior Center, some game modding that got a write up in a Gaming Magazine, volunteer programming for a med school prof and some paid work in programming.) Except for the stint in the senior center he didn’t do any of this to look good for colleges. His applications basically said “I’m a computer nerd, I’ve taught myself at a high level, take me or leave me.”</p>

<p>My younger son was much less focused. He liked history, played the violin, has an interest in global warming, likes to work with his hands and mostly likes hanging out with his friends, so some of his ECs were more to be with friends than because of say an overwhelming interest in the literary magazine. He ended up writing about two activities - one was about helping archive the neighborhood association papers which led him to learn about the history of our elementary school. He wrote about the experience in an engaging way that showed him thinking like a historian. His other main essay was about folding origami, something he’d taken up to keep from falling sleep in AP Bio and because he could make earrings to give to his friends without having to spend a lot of money. When the time came he two colleges had supplemental essays that were up his alley. He wrote a rather strange and funny essay for U of Chicago that drew on his knowledge of green building and he wrote an alternative history of the United States for Tufts. None of this was planned ahead of time. His applications said, “I’m a pretty normal kid, with a quirky sense of humor, somewhat unusual activities, with a lot of potential not always realized in high school.”</p>

<p>I don’t think it will hurt your son at LACs that he comes from a not so good school especially if his SAT scores are strong. State level awards, a leadership position in one of his ECs and being able to write about something in an engaging way will get him where he wants to go.</p>

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<p>Colleges, including very selective schools, want to see what a student has done with the resources available. Your son will have a compelling story.</p>

<p>It would not hurt to retake the SAT and try the ACT.</p>

<p>He should apply to a variety of schools, understanding that some are a crap shoot for almost everyone and that finance packages will be a factor .</p>

<p>I am a proponent of applying early to schools with rolling admissions policies or non-binding early action programs. Having an early acceptance at hand is a wonderful thing as your son decides where else to apply.</p>

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<p>Is your son a URM? Were the students who were accepted to those top schools URMs?</p>

<p>How does he score on standardized tests? What percentile does he test on state wide tests? </p>

<p>I would have him take the ACT and SAT soon to get an idea of how he tests. </p>

<p>I recently spoke with a mom whose son had gone to a school similar to your son’s…IB…great GPA…top rank…but, his test scores were very average. I’m not saying that your son will have modest test scores…he could have spectacular test scores…but you’ll want to know now what you’re dealing with. This poor mom is now learning during her son’s senior year that colleges aren’t accepting her high GPA son with modest scores.</p>

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<p>m2ck, SAT is 1500. I am guessing that is old scoring (M & V)?</p>

7

<p>missed that…</p>

<p>OP…</p>

<p>Is that a 1500 over 3 sections (out of 2400)…or is that a 1500 over 2 sections (math + Critical Reading)?</p>

<p>What was the score breakdown of each section?</p>

<p>Is your son attending this school because of the IB program? Was he zoned for another school before?</p>

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<p>I appreciate all of the responses. His PSAT was in the 1400’s for CR/M (sophomore year). His practice tests for SAT have all been above 1500. We are deciding if he should take the SAT this year or next. </p>

<p>As far as state standardize tests he is always in the top 99%. Our state gifted program has a 3 tier admission program with the first being if you are in the top 97% you are automatically qualified. He was the only student in our district that qualified with just the one test the year he was tested and he was 99%.</p>

<p>As far as the students who go to Ivy or similar schools all are Asian. The few ranked above him are all Asian. One problem in this area is that parents and students don’t consider going out of state. So we have the handful of students who do fight over the extra point on the test, fight to be club leader, etc. etc. and they end up at very good schools. S is not competitive with feeling he needs to beat anyone or join every club. He is very comfortable with doing what he does.</p>

<p>Compmom - the surfing is the ocean although he does his fair share of web surfing too.</p>

<p>We are assuming that a 1500 SAT score will be good enough. I’m not sure at what point is too low. Also, his writing scores are usually his highest section. Our schools don’t refer to them so I can never remember his exact numbers.</p>

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<p>We are not zoned for this school. He choose it based on the IB program available.</p>

<p>His last real SAT was 7th or 8th grade. He took the PSAT this year with a 221. The SAT numbers are based on practice tests given by the school and only M/CR.</p>

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<p>I think January or March of junior year is soon enough for SATs.</p>

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<p>Don’t know if finances will be an issue, but that PSAT score is probably going to make him a NMF. Besides the LACs, which generally give oh, $500 to $2500 total for NMFs, would he want to consider schools which give a full or near-full ride to NMFs?</p>

<p>You didn’t say what his likely major would be, but a large state school that offers “everything” as well as an Honors College for its top students, and a free ride, would be mighty attractive. :)</p>

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<p>The PSAT score is a definite Semi-Finalist score for your state…almost anywhere actually. Good job! In May he will get to send the score to two colleges. I’d use it as a way to show early interest at those colleges. If there are colleges you might not be able to visit (that track interest), they might be good colleges to send the scores to.</p>

<p>You’re probably going to have to make some choices if finances are in play. You’ll want to consider financial safeties – including colleges that he’s interested in that might offer merit money – along with the colleges that are tops on his list. (It’s always happy when those overlap!) He can find money, I think, but it could mean that you end up with expensive favorite school on one hand and, on the other, you might have very affordable less than favorite school.</p>

<p>By the way, about ECs, I think you’re better off showing a passion for one (or a couple) thing(s) instead of dabbling in a gazillion things. It creates a clear image for the admission reader: Elmer’s the kid who restores antique birdhouses in Tennessee is more memorable than Elmer’s the kid who does lots of everything in Tennessee. There are lots of the latter Elmers out there. Depth beats breadth, so that’s a good thing!</p>

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<p>I like the LAC’s you list, and sent one son to one of them. His academic stats, coupled with his rural high school’s limited offerings and poverty stats, sound nearly identical to what you describe in your home. </p>

<p>My instinct from reading your OP is to find one project to carry out over a long period of time, or a series of several projects all within the same category of interest. In my son’s case it was theater - community productions outside of school shows, something I had to drive him to an hour away, then some independent films. But it can be anything: in science, business, birdhouses, bicycling. If he loves surfing, branch out and get involved in everything ocean: marine biology clubs, the local TV weather station, cooking seafood…expand the passion, in other words, from physical activity into academic curiosity. It’ll be cool to present in a few years.</p>

<p>If this strikes you as appealing, then I would sit down with him now on the 'net to research a way to pursue something outside of school, entirely his project that nobody else in his h.s. has any IDEA it even exists. He can create it himself. Rather than join yet another team or club, can you help him find something that is all his, to make his own, starting between now (or begin this summer) and college-application-writing time? </p>

<p>If his school is that limited, I think he should demonstrate a bit of restlessness to find opportunities outside of those walls and advisers. Do this in addition to remaining a contributing member of his school community. Be part of the school, but add on an outside dimension. </p>

<p>He will also need to get used to the fact that nobody in his school will have heard of the very excellent LAC’s you have listed above. It goes with the territory. Nobody will jump up and down at “Williams” where you live, even if they know the Ivies. Oh well. Reassure him if he needs that boost. </p>

<p>Plus, take the standard CC advice: construct a list of safety , match, and reach schools among the LAC’s. The schools you listed are reaches for students with top qualifications from toney school systems; so keep this in perspective. Those are top LAC’s. </p>

<p>I often wonder, to this day, if my son’s application was helped by his being from such a cruddy h.s. I do know that it didn’t get him in. Rather, he had to show top SAT’s, top grades and a focussed/dedicated EC pattern to compete. I was surprised when he got in, but happy. He was accepted at 4 LAC’s and chose his favorite. He was waitlisted at some Ivies, and eventually offered from one of them but declined, preferring the LAC.</p>

<p>Keep those LAC’s on your list, even if you include Ivies. Being from a small town and knowing everybody in it, from dogcatcher to mayor, and the intergenerational social confidence that builds, is very relevant to LAC college culture. At least I wonder why my S “almost” got into several Ivies (waitlists) and found welcome mats rolled out at top LAC’s. Evidently, the LAC’s were undaunted by his unknown rural high school where the GC spoke in faulty grammar by phone. It’s a mystery, but I applaud you for reaching far beyond what your home community recognizes!</p>

<p>Good luck for your S.</p>

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<p>Coming from a high school of about 90% free/reduced lunch and less than 50% graduation rate is disadvantageous to him if he isn’t doing well in school because of the school environment. With state level awards and great standardized test scores as those you’ve mentioned, however, his low achieving high school is actually a plus, because it’s immediately setting him apart from all the high achieving students coming from the more competitive areas. Keeping reaching out for opportunities on his own like paying3tuition suggested, and he can easily turn this into an advantage.</p>

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<p>Also, dig around to find LAC’s that boast of diversity in state-of-origin. My alma mater, an LAC which prided itself on its national draw despite its Midwest location, tried to include in each year’s student body at least one student from every state of the union. Classmates from Montana and South Dakota, for example, felt they had an edge over “equally qualified students” (whatever that means!) from New York, California and Texas. Your obscure Southern location might become an admisssions advantage if few from your state apply, depending on the LAC of course. </p>

<p>Hopefully this discussion won’t cause too many folks to leave their fine public schools in populous states, seeking poorer quality schools in obscure states, as an admissions strategy!</p>

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<p>It looks like your son already stands out in terms of grades in the most challenging courses available, test scores, commitment to extracurriculars, etc…</p>

<p>Note that some highly regarded schools (e.g. Harvard and Stanford) claim to have very generous need based financial aid. For some people, they may actually become financial safeties relative to less well-endowed private or out-of-state public schools if one gets admitted (obviously not guaranteed).</p>

<p>BTW, Asian is ORM, not URM, at most highly regarded schools.</p>

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<p>Thanks again. We have a public and a private that are both financially and academic safeties. Since S loves the private safety he is planning to apply to only the two safeties and 6 or 8 reach schools. Of course he is young and things can change a million times before the first application is due.</p>