Discussion of Changes at USNA

<p>Beat Army!!!</p>

<p>You have made my night! :D</p>

<p>Except have you heard the latest?</p>

<p>Supt has banned yelling "beat Army" after the singing of Blue and Gold.</p>

<p>For us fat, lazy, non-military Americans, tell us how that advances the mission of the Academy?</p>

<p>Over the past few years, ever since USNA started winning and filling the stands, we have been getting more and more alumni at the football games. Some of them have forgotten tradition and have been sneaking out early to beat the traffic. He has now ensured that a resounding "Beat Army" will follow the singing of Blue and Gold, after the game. Probably louder than ever yelled before.</p>

<p>


</p>

<p>This ain't the Army. The 25 or so SEALs will get much more training down the road as will the 100 or so grunt Marines. Aviators will get "weapon specific" training once they are in a squadorn. The majority of the rest will never pick up a personal weapon throughout their entire career. Ammo is very expensive. USNA Plebe summer is simply a familiarity exercise. There is no need for them to become accomplished M-16 experts. Seems to me that posts such as this are a last ditch feeble effort to countermand the new Supts training policy.</p>

<p>The amount of time it takes to learn to hit the side of a barn with a Model 12 Winchester loaded with buckshot is infintesimal as compared to something else, say, like tooting a tuba.</p>

<p>USNA69,</p>

<p>I would assume that all SWO's are required to have some type of weapons training (probably M-9 pistol) for boarding operations, which are probably happening a lot more these days.</p>

<p>Some, yes; all, I doubt it although it does make some sense for it to be a part of SWO quals since not all come from the same background.</p>

<p>From Plebe Summer, you have the necessary exposure to be an officer in charge of a boarding party. You know range and weapon safety and will be able to recognize that the gunners mate (or whatever they are calling themselves these days) is doing everything correctly when he conducts boarding party weapons training.</p>

<p>
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All you old school alumn cheering on the changes .. how are you reacting to "Beat Army" being banned from being said after the signing of "Navy Blue and Gold"?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>A bit disappointing, but sort of like when Navy loses to Army. It doesn't ruin my week or my year. In the vast scheme of things, there are many more important things to worry about.</p>

<p>Football games may be quite amusing, however. I'd venture that most of the alums won't have heard about this change and will yell "Beat Army" even as the brigade remains silent. Whether or not they continue to do so (after learning of the change) will be interesting. </p>

<p>I would be curious whether the rationale is that (1) Blue & Gold is an alma mater and should be treated with reverence throughout or (2) "everything" at USNA shouldn't be focused on beating Army. Or some other reason. Doesn't really matter. As I said, change happens.</p>

<p>I don't believe that the responses to weapons training has anything to due with the Supe's new policies. It is simply that if we're going to train for a terrorist war having a bit more weapons training would certainly not hurt. Captain Couch talks about the significance of small arms training. It also helps with discipline. Our enemies now and in the future will be trained. I would think that all services would likewise be trained. It is a bit late in the game when they issue you a weapon and you're rushed through training to learn to use a weapon. This has nothing to do with the Supe or undermining his plan. It was indeed a suggestion. I wasn't a SEAL or a grunt and had a weapon and access to more at various times. </p>

<p>Beat Temple.</p>

<p>So much of the budget of USNA is from outside sources(large corporate donors, NAAA, Alumni, and charitable endowments) More than many people actually know about. Wesley Brown field house would not have been built without outside funding, as well as the sailing programs 44's and many too numerous to name. Will these wonderfull and generous companies and individuals open their checkbooks if they feel as though they are being left out or if their EC was taken away. (most have ties to USNA through a personal history or a family member) ???
EXAMPLE:#1 Will the CEO of _____________ Corp. Class of ______ continue to generously give XXX thousands of $$$ if they took away his beloved_______ EC. The EC that gave him a chance to decompress during that difficult XX year.
EXAMPLE:#2 Will Mrs. _________ (WHO BY THE WAY IS WORTH 9 FIGURES)mother of _____ class of ____ who's daughter played_______ and was a member of _______ continue to give?????</p>

<p>I wonder???????</p>

<p>Wow...imagine if these message boards had been around in 1976 when it was announced women would be entering the academies....:)---in my opinion a far more significant "change" than anything discussed here.</p>

<p>How many people would have been posting that "the end is near!!"?</p>

<p>How many sponsors withdrew their money then, and in the end, did it matter?</p>

<p>
[quote]
I would be curious whether the rationale is that (1) Blue & Gold is an alma mater and should be treated with reverence throughout or (2) "everything" at USNA shouldn't be focused on beating Army. Or some other reason. Doesn't really matter. As I said, change happens.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Perhaps the teaching, learning, and singing of the song should be completely eliminated as it in no way contributes to the military mission being taught to these young warriors.</p>

<p>It's nothing but a meaningless EC that detracts from their training. :rolleyes:</p>

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<p>The Navy (i.e., taxpayers) only funds 65 percent of the budget for USNA. The remaining 35 percent of the budget is derived from fundraising. The Naval Academy would be a completely different institution without those non-appropriated funds.</p>

<p>I'm not home so I don't have the exact figures, but the annual budget is over 400 million and contributions are responsible for less than one tenth of that amount..</p>

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contributions are responsible for less than one tenth of that amount.

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</p>

<p>What were were told when called for a donation reflected what GA stated. Most state run universities also reflect numbers similar to GA's. If that is not true then I definitely will be withdrawing my support.</p>

<p>
[quote]
I would assume that all SWO's are required to have some type of weapons training (probably M-9 pistol) for boarding operations, which are probably happening a lot more these days.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Only SWOs on their ships VBSS team will ever board other ships, and in order to be on that team you need to go through months of training... (my old roommate is going through it right now)</p>

<p>I'm confident USNA69 is right on the money re: the USNA fund-raising. While not insignificant nor unappreciated, philanthropic giving is not the bread and butter of the USNA, and I'd speculate the budget line for this is very modest. In this regard USNA is minor leagues, probably A level. USNA is relative newcomer to this highly competitive game of private giving, and indignant donors will not hold up these or yet-to-come administrative changes. None wields the kind of clout Mr. Robitussin might at U. of Richmond or Coca Cola does at Emory. Politicians might be another matter as the USNA mash comes from the public trough. The Supe may undoubtedly be made ever aware of that which he already knows.</p>

<p>I believe that donated funds help with "things" (and I use that word loosely) beyond what tax dollars support. For example, Alumni Hall was, I believe, funded entirely with private support. I believe most, if not all, of the stadium improvements were made possible with private funds. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.</p>

<p>As for donating, if these changes (plankton on the vast food chain of life) cause you not to donate, I've got to wonder what made you donate to USNA in the first place. Was it really the ECAs? The fact 2/C got town liberty? Or that USNA is a great institution that produces leaders for our nation? </p>

<p>That said, change typcially causes some sponsors (who don't like the changes) to withdraw their support. And, if these changes trouble you enough, that's one way to voice your dissatisfaction. Invariably, however, other sponsors (who like the changes) will take your place. Always seems to happen.</p>

<p>^^^^^
35 percent for donations is the number I was quoted by RADM Bruce Grooms, the former Commandant. The renovation of Navy & Marine Corps stadium alone was $40 million -- all donations. Alumni Hall was constructed with half appropriated funds and half donations. USNA would be all haze gray without the non-appropriated funds (NAF).</p>

<p>The last fundraising campaign raised in excess of $275 million. The Naval Academy Athletic Association brings in lots of NAF that funds the athletic program at USNA. </p>

<p>And there is the Sailing Foundation that supports the sailing program. My plebe year I sailed on two IOR (International Ocean Racing) sloops that were donated to USNA. The first was confiscated by the Coast Guard for running drugs and the second was donated by a private citizen after being used for only one racing season.</p>

<p>I finished up donating for the Sailing Center not too long ago and then immediately started with a class project. We all have the choice to donate or put our money elsewhere. Whether I agree or disagree with some Admin changes, with holding my donation may be the best choice as the people I'm hurting are the Mids who are really the people I want to help. The sailing center makes a positive impact. Honestly, I don't remember what the class project but I'm sure when they called I had just come in from mowing the lawn or raking leaves or someother yard work. It's when everyone else seems to call and just said yes to support the cause. If I did decide not to donate to the general fund, remember you can always give a restricted gift to help with a particular team or event or club. I did that by donating directly to the wrestling team as they were seeking donations. There is always NAAA and they seem to not only help varsity athletes but helped get Mids to the big games. </p>

<p>If your mission is to help Mids, just consider restricted gifts, donating directly to an organization you want to help or giving to NAAA. Whether it's a total of 10% or 35%, each dollar is important.</p>

<p>Beat Temple.</p>