Do I have a shot at any selective schools?

Chance Me / Match Me!
1

Hey CC, I made a chances thread a few weeks ago, but I was kind of general, left out some important information, and made it too specific for a certain school I was looking at. I’m going to just list my profile and am interested in my chances at selective schools in general, just tell me what you think I might be competitive for.

General:
Year: Junior
High School: Mid-size, public (1,000 kids)
State: MA
Intended Major: Finance/Econ
Gender: Male
Race: White
Income Bracket: ~150K

Objective:
SAT I (breakdown): 1390 (670 Verbal, 720 Math)
GPA UW: 3.97
GPA W: 4.45 (school is on a 4.5 scale)
APs: US History, Biology (Junior Year) - school does not allow APs before junior year, so I do not have scores for those yet
Senior Year Course Load: AP Calc AB, AP Econ, AP Eng Lit, AP Psych, Honors Spanish 5, Honors Physics, Accounting, tech elective
Major Awards: Harvard Book Award, Distinguished Community Service Award, Renaissance Gold Card Awards (all semesters - 91+ cumulative semester average)
Rank: School does not rank, but I assume top 5 because the HBA goes to one of the school’s “top juniors” - class size of about 240

Subjective:
Extracurriculars:
-Debate Club (Founder, President)
-NHS (Vice President - runs all tutoring services)
-Tutoring Initiative (started before NHS, created and ran tutoring initiative at elementary school to help kids with homework)
-DECA (Fundraising Coordinator), also qualified for states in Finance and attended ICDC conference in Nashville
-School Council
-NEASC (Student Contributor - sole student contributor to school accreditation review report)
-Cross country, winter track, spring track

Outside of School:
-Adjunct faculty research with local community college to investigate socio-economic trends in the area and local schools
-Seeking Alpha Financial Analysis Contributor - research and analyze stock trends and markets

Summer Activites:
-Work part-time at local hardware store
-Bentley Wall Street Program
-Research stocks and write articles for Seeking Alpha
-Research with community college
-May start small scale tutoring business where 30% of income goes to charitable organizations

Volunteering:
-80-100 hours total
-Summer Track Camp volunteering
-Tutoring
-5K road races
-Organized and delivered blanket drive to local shelter
-NHS community cleanups

Other: I know I’m not a “super-student” on here like many on CC are with 2300+ SAT scores or ISEF finalist, but I truly just love learning about finance and business, and I try to connect my clubs to expand my business skills, such as the tutoring program is like running a mini-startup, researching stocks and doing research with a college enhances my understanding of finance, doing community work allows me to use my leadership and organizational skills to try and help others. While I’m definitely not the smartest kid and don’t have absolutely amazing extracurriculars, I try every day to involve myself in something challenging and to do something “extra” that other kids in my school don’t that will help me learn more or give back or deepen my growing business skills. Whether it’s sending emails to college professors to ask about research, going door to door to businesses looking for internships, or running a tutoring program, these small events have really matured me over the past year and a half to have the confidence to go out and pursue anything.

Colleges I may be applying to: (Safeties) - Providence, Umass Amherst, Bryant ; (Matches) - Bentley, Villanova, BU ; (Reaches) - BC, Babson, Northeastern ; (Super-Reaches) - NYU Stern, Dartmouth, Cornell, Harvard

2

You seem to have balanced list of schools.

3

This appears to be a very well thought list so congrats on that to begin with. A lot of kids (me included) don’t know how to make a good balanced list so props to you. Your gpa is amazing I would say either take SAT again or try ACT to boost your chances at your reaches. Best of luck to you!

4

Bump

5

You seem to have strong credentials, something you already know. So I will expand on what about your post seems important. Long but I hope worth a read:

“While I’m definitely not the smartest kid and don’t have absolutely amazing extracurriculars, I try every day to involve myself in something challenging and to do something “extra” that other kids in my school don’t that will help me learn more or give back or deepen my growing business skills.”.

Gaining admission to college is rarely about how hard you try. Most top students are similar in terms of the extent to which they “try”. I do find it interesting that you note that you are not the very top student yet your list includes schools that accept only top students. That makes me think that your mention about not being top or smartest is really a humble boast. If so, you need to be more realistic. Your credentials are good. Are they great? Great is what schools like Harvard are looking for.

Your statement that “-May start small scale tutoring business where 30% of income goes to charitable organizations” makes me think you are trying to game admissions to the very top schools by scoping out what you think may appeal to admissions officers at those schools. Starting that at this point will make it seem more so. In other words, you give the appearance of checking off the categories you think schools look for-and you may think you are short in the “charitable” category. Harvard isn’t looking for students whose involvements are primarily related to applying to college.

You have been involved in some ECs at a notable level. The fact that you attended the ICDC conference is notable. Winning would have been more so since about 10,000 students attend. More importantly, the fact that you were selected by your school to participate in the accreditation process means they view you among the strongest students and view you as someone who represents the school (and the student body) well. So you will get good support for your college application. The ECs do give the appearance of your trying to fulfill all categories such that the danger is looking like a dabbler without a level of involvement in any that is exceptional. You have covered research at a university, tutoring, running for school office, varsity sports, requisite volunteer hours, etc.

For Harvard, fewer ECs but a notable outcome would have been preferable. Being careful and making sure you cover it all will help you for many schools. For the very top schools, one exceptional achievement, say a peer reviewed publication in an academic journal that reflects sustained commitment to that research lab, or varsity running that puts you at a highly competitive and recruitable level, or winning DECA or…well you get the picture-showing sustained commitment and exceptional aptitude in a field would have been preferable but you would have had to put more eggs in that one basket rather than spread them around. Had it not worked out, you’d have been left with a weaker looking set of credentials-that would be a big risk you would have taken. The preference for one exceptional achievement over loads of good activities is important not just because it is a notable achievement. Its importance rests on the value of showing that you can take risks rather than playing it safe. And remarkable achievements are made by those who take risks not those who safely check off boxes they think colleges want to see. This will impact on very few schools but Harvard is one such school.

With respect to your writing, be careful to distinguish between articles in Seeking Alpha and instablogs. As you know, Instablogs are not peer reviewed. You mention writing articles. Have you published articles in Seeking Alpha. If so, you should note that rather than writing about it as you have.

You seem to have a pretty big jump between your “Super Reaches” and your reaches. If you don’t plan to apply for aid, you might want to add a couple of schools that are surer bets like Wash U, Lafayette (due to your interest in business) or Tufts. Your 670 (91st %) Verbal could be problematic for the very top schools because you don’t really have any remarkable ECs to offset it. It would be good to have SAT2s in the high 700s (especially in the humanities) to offset that score.

All told, you have very good credentials. You have obviously been a hard working student. As you have read 100s of times, the very top schools are intended for very top students. There are only 13,899 slots in the freshman class of the Ivy League schools. If you are among the top 13K scholars in the world, you will probably get an offer to attend one of them. Will it be Harvard? Odds are against that. Will it be a great school? Odds favor that you will gain entry to a great school.

6

Hi @lostaccount , thank you for the very in-depth and honest feedback. I definitely understand what you mean by it seeming like I am trying to check off boxes for admissions, and I will definitely be more careful to not give that impression. The tutoring startup was just an idea I had for the summer, but I am unsure of whether I will pursue it. I think I will focus more on training for fall sports, studying for standardized tests, and writing for Seeking Alpha, which I did publish an article on, not an Instablog.

I need to be careful not to spread myself too think, it’s just that the more I have involved myself in, the more I have gained experience in organizing and leading through both my successes and failures. Besides the clubs and extracurriculars I mentioned above, I have been in a few others, but I have actually dropped those clubs to try and narrow down my interests and focus on things that are more relateable and interesting to me.

I agree I don’t have one “remarkable” extracurricular, which is why I put Harvard as a “super-reach.” It would be an amazing opportunity to learn with some of the most motivated business students in the world, but I am being realistic about my chances and have created a balanced list of schools.

7

Bump

8

Bump

9

Looks like a very reasonable list to me. Keep up the good work and I’m sure you’ll get admitted to a great school that fits you!

10

Just FYI: I helped a friend’s kid with his application this year. He desperately wanted to attend Yale and I tried to dissuade him from applying SCEA bc although he had top grades as you do, his SAT was a 680 math, 720 critical reading, 780 writing. He was applying as a physics and English double major and didn’t take the honors track in math, which however led to AP cal AB (Honors at our school ends in BC). He didn’t have any remarkable ECs, except he was one of the co-editors in chief of the school paper. PS: he was deferred from Yale but accepted RD. Also accepted to Cornell and JHU. Rejected from Georgetown and Columbia. I learned that you don’t need to be extra special to gain admission to a top school. An excellent GPA and good essays can be enough.

11

@RenaissanceMom Hi, thank you for the feedback! Those SATs are below Yale’s average but still seem very strong
(2180). I will be retaking SAT this saturday and taking the ACT in the fall, but I am trying to focus on things that matter to me more than standardized tests like college essays, researching economics/stocks, and being active in my school.

12

@mclaughlinm34 the scores that are most important are the math and critical reading, not the writing, mainly because it’s those scores that are used by USNWR ranking. For Yale, according to last year’s common data set, that probably put this unhooked guy accepted this year from westchester, NY at roughly the 17% for math and at the 25% for reading in his incoming class. Despite having scores that weren’t exceptional for an ivy, he was still accepted. His grades were excellent, around an UW 96 GPA. And he had some good in-school ECs…besides co-editor in chief of paper, he ran cross country (but not recruitable), he did model UN, and was in orchestra. In the summer, he worked as a camp counselor. Nothing like national/regional/state awards. What I learned is that while you need some luck and a well written app, you don’t necessarily need exceptional scores and out of this world ECs & awards.

Years ago I heard a Q&A in Scarsdale, NY with the newly retired head of college counseling at Horace Mann, a leading private school in NYC & top school in USA. He said that for an unhooked kid coming out of westchester, an over represented region for elite college admissions, to have a decent shot at a school like HYP, a kid needs to score at least 750 on all 3 sections of the SAT, or at least a 2250. Well, this kid just proved that wrong. He’s got great grades, I’m assuming excellent teacher/GC recommendations, and one big leadership position together with other common school ECs. And that was enough for Yale class of 2020. So, I think it’s worth you taking a shot too.

13

Current Princeton student here who was accepted into most of HYPSM.

  1. Your academics for your super reaches will pass as average, perhaps slightly above average
  2. Most of your subjective is great as an individual and for your future development, but in terms of admissions, come across as scattered and average, many of these super reach applying students are presidents of 2+ clubs
  3. Volunteering is also great, but in admissions will come across as common and not distinguishing since everyone spends hundreds of hours volunteering for their local community
  4. Your one distinguishing thing, as you mentioned, is finance/business and the mini-startup you’re working on. THIS is absolutely key. If you write the right app, you can stand out with this and possibly have a decent shot at your super-reaches.

So my questions are (only regarding your super reaches)

  1. Have you prepared yourself for an interview? These if done well can really make a big difference
  2. How strong are your teacher recs and how are you getting them?
  3. What are you writing your essays about? These are super super key.
  4. What persona are you crafting? This will be supplemented by the essay. How are you handling this?
  5. Also depends on how your regional kids are portraying themselves. If everyone is exactly the same as you, this makes it a little harder. How do do 3+4 to differentiate yourself.

It’s a lot to think about. Feel free to message me if you want some help regarding these. Good luck!