<p>My son has been offered (so far) a couple Research Experience Undergraduate opportunities this summer. Each is a 10 week program. He's leaning towards the bio-med engineering one. </p>
<p>What do med schools think about these? Are they "good" ECs?</p>
<p>Curmy…BDM…Kristin…WOW…Miami…others…I thought you’d have an opinion to share.</p>
<p>:)</p>
<p>I am not sure what could be a better EC. If they are at his college he may stay with that research group and get published as an additional perk. Always a good thing.</p>
<p>Here is my opinion. Take ANY paid position. I believe that these are paid very well. My D. did not get into one like this in our city, but it is not possible to find anything in our city, so she was interning at her college (not paid). She also had an awesome job at college (although paying close to min.). Are there any disadvantages / other opportunities? D. had trouble finding even volunteering positions at home, some had waitning lists so long that it was no chance for her in a summer. So, she had to do everything at school during school year. Unless, there is much better opportunities, he should do one (or both?) of them. Congrats! My D. could only dream about this.
I do not know anything about publishing, D. did not publish anything. She has stayed with her Research for several years though. She loves to be in lab and had previous experience during HS.</p>
<p>I think any research experience is good thing. And I think that’s good to move outside one’s home lab/campus if the opportunity presents itself. It exposes the student to a broader range of opinions, attitudes and philosophies about research (All labs are not alike! All PIs are not alike!) It may also expand the students repertoire of techniques and skills and allow him to see a new or different application of those skills he already has.</p>
<p>Re: publishing–it’s unlikely that student will get a publication credit from just a summer in a lab. Not enough time to contribute anything significant to the project. He might merit an acknowledgment depending on what he contributes to the research, but not a co-author.</p>
<p>Generally a co-author makes a sustained, significant contribution to the project. And there is a definite ‘pecking order’ to co-author listing: PIs, post-docs, grad students, lab manager[s], undergrads, paid technicians, acknowledgments. Within each group, there is still an additional pecking order. (Which I can explain, but I doubt you’re really interested.)</p>
<p>D1 was 4th author on a paper based on a project she worked 2+ years on and wrote most of computer code to do the data acquisition. The paper was over 2 years in the referee process and won’t finally come out in print until this fall–more than 2 1/2 years after her last active involvement with it. (BTW, 4th author doesn’t sound like much, but in high energy physics, papers typically have a dozen or more co-authors and it’s not unusual to see papers with 200+ co-authors.)</p>
<p>D1 was asked about her journal article during her med school interviews. One of her interviewers had an UG degree in EE and found her journal pub topic fascinating.</p>
<p>D1 was telling me that her med school requires all students to write & defend a research-based thesis. I’m not sure how common this requirement is at other med schools, but it’s something to consider. The more skills/techniques/experience one has makes it easier to find a lab where the student will fit in.</p>
<p>(D figures with her extensive math/data analysis/computer programming skills she’ll have an easier time finding a lab to accept her than most students.)</p>
<p>D2 has spent 2+ years in the same research lab already (and will definitely get a journal pub out of it) and wanted to expand her network of contacts/change fields/learn new lab techniques so she applied to variety of summer programs and was accepted into 3.</p>
<p>Student can do an REU in their home school lab and get excited about that research. Said student, if valuable enough, can then continue working in that lab throughout the year/years and have the possibliity of getting published.</p>
<p>So an REU can possibly lead to a published paper as it did for my son. That is all I was trying to say.</p>
<p>This REU will be at an OOS university.</p>
<p>Housing and good stipend and travel money provided. </p>
<p>It’s for 10 weeks in Biomedical Engineering.</p>
<p>I’d say he ought to go. If nothing else it’ll be an adventure.</p>
<p>D2’s summer program offers the same–housing, travel expenses, meal allowance and stipend. Her program lasts 9 weeks and is in pathology/neurology (brain cancer).</p>
<p>mom2, of course I have an opinion to share :)</p>
<p>First off, I did not do anything that could be construed as an REU. Neither did most of my friends; the one who did the closest thing to the experience you’re describing did an REU at our university. All of us have done research of some sort. We have MCATs ranging from 28-35 and GPAs >3.7. All of us got into medical school first try.</p>
<p>So do I personally think an REU is crucial to your application? Nope.</p>
<p>But I do think research is, and I think an REU seems like a great way to get involved with research. Even if he’d be doing research somewhere that isn’t his university, he’ll still be learning plenty of valuable, translatable skills during that experience. With some research experience he may be able to jump into a not-so-intro position in a lab at his school when he returns. As a result, it might be easier for him to find a meaningful research position at his university.</p>
<p>So in my opinion: it won’t make his application, but it certainly won’t hurt it, and it will almost certainly help it because he’ll likely have an easier time getting involved with research at his own university. Plus, I think it sounds like fun!</p>
<p>Thanks all! :)</p>
<p>*D1 was telling me that her med school requires all students to write & defend a research-based thesis. *</p>
<p>Wow…didn’t know MD schools do this. Is this typical?</p>
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<p>This is not typical. That said, I know Yale does this. Duke may as well, I know Duke requires students use the 3rd year as a research year, but I don’t know if students have to do a thesis.</p>
<p>So, does that mean that those who can somehow demonstrate superb writing strength would have a nudge (not a big advantage…but a small consideration)?</p>
<p>Not at all.</p>
<p>I don’t know if superb writing skills would give them a nudge in terms of that thesis paper, but superb writing skills pay off in terms of great personal statements and essays.</p>
<p>A 3-mos stint in a lab is pretty short. No matter how productive you are during those 3 mos it is highly unlikely anything significant will result (papers, posters, etc. all take time to submit and receive approval and relationships require time to build). If it is at his school, that’s one thing, but if it’s elsewhere, I would suggest it, really.</p>
<p>If it is at his school, that’s one thing, but if it’s elsewhere, I would suggest it, really.</p>
<p>???</p>
<p>Typo: would NOT suggest it. Basically, there’s not pt in spending a summer building a relationship w/ a faculty member and beginning a project if continued work is unlikely and continuing research from a distance, while sometimes possible (e.g., cooperatively writing a paper w/ a prof), it’s quite tough and tends to be less productive, IME. When you list something on AMCAS, they’ll ask number of hrs/wk and months of commitment. A 40 hr/wk, June-Aug 2011 (12 wks * 40 hrs/wk = 480 hrs) commitment isn’t a commitment, it’s a summer camp. And it will be viewed as such. 10 hrs/wk Sept-May * 2 semesters (~32 wks) = 320 hrs. While the 2 semesters at 10 hrs/wk is less time, it will be seen more favorably due to the commitment aspect as well as showing the student can do this level of work while also acing classes, holding down a job, etc. Additionally, this allows the professor to get to know the student over time (which looks better on paper). Continuing to work full time through the summers is, of course, even more ideal.</p>
<p>apumic;</p>
<p>you make an excellent point, but what about all those that attend a LAC, which essentially closes down for the summer – no research available? Retail/volunteering at home instead?</p>
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<p>mom2, this REU program, funded by NSF, should be one of the best way to do research, get paid, and try to get a paper/Poster/ or at least an Abstract out of it. The PI will have to file a report with NSF including your child’s project. SO, even that NSF report may be construed as partyour child’s contribution.</p>
<p>Research is one of the important components in medschool app. If a paper is published, then its an excellent accomplishment (two papers NCG says is superb for medschool app). </p>
<p>In short, REU is a funded program, the PI will have thought through the 10-wk project for your child and thus have more chance to produce RESULTS that can lead to publication, and will be paid. That BioMed project sounds good.</p>
<p>Any other research experience, other than REU, the student will lilely be paired with a grad student on an on-going project, which is also good. But your child should be prepared to work as volunteer, unpaid. So, the REU is an excellent opportunity for the summer, and fully supported.</p>
<p>bluebayou,</p>
<p>I’d keep working my correspondence w/ the prof. You don’t necessarily need your advisor right there every step of the way. If you began a project in Sept and the advisor goes on a one month vacation in June, you should already have had enough foundation in place to keep doing plenty. It’s all about initiative. While class may be out of session, I doubt the faculty are getting those 3 months completely off.</p>