After one semester in PREP, I now know admission into the Division of General Studies - Pre-Engineering Program (DGS-PREP) is a trap for in-state Illinois residents. Few spots available in the College of Engineering for lower tuition payers, so highly-qualified in-state residents admitted into the PREP program instead. I’m guessing DGS created this program because of political pressure and/or to boost lagging DGS admissions. Program of study includes all difficult weed out classes while adjusting to life away from home. Unless you can GUARANTEE you will get a 3.0 GPA/2.75 tGPA in your first semester, this is a dead end. One bad grade or one bad semester under the stress of a first semester away from college and you will be kicked out of the Pre-Engineering Program. You can reapply, but highly unlikely you will get back in because of competition for this program. You are just a number at Illinois, and the U wants you out because of limited spots. Only option offered after one bad grade and one bad semester…pick another major. No chance at engineering at U of Illinois. Save yourself the trouble. Don’t accept DGS-PREP. Go to an engineering school that wants you.
I would definitely consider it to be a better option to attend another highly ranked engineering program over DGS prep if the costs were similar and there wasn’t a second major of interest at UIUC like Math, Physics, etc… For example, Purdue, Iowa State, Minnesota, IIT and Iowa could all be similar in cost after merit awards. For Illinois residents, Iowa State, UIC, Kansas and Nebraska are all likely to be similar or lower in cost for most qualified engineering applicants. You can always transfer back to UIUC after a year or two and apply to the engineering program of your choice to be certain, rather than wait with the uncertainty of DGS-PREP.
Does DGS-PREP at least make their requirements to remain in the program clear to applicants?
DGS-PREP administrators adjusted the rules from the time of admissions acceptance in Spring 2017. With any new program, you expect tweaking, but not blatant rule changes effective immediately. The Pre-Engineering program initially required only “progress in curriculum of interest” and “progress in technical courses.” In November 2017, DGS-PREP administrators added a GPA requirement to remain in DGS-PREP, changing the rules midstream for admitted students in the Class of 2021. Prior to November 2017, DGS did not mention of this requirement in admission materials, on their web site, nor was any announcement given to students at a November seminar on transfer, or any other communication with students. Now the website reads…"PREP students are expected to maintain a 3.0 overall GPA and 2.75 Pre-Engineering Core GPA (Technical core coursework+Engineering Coursework) to remain in good standing in the Pre-Engineering Program. Although promoted as a flexible 4 semester program of discovery, like others in the Division of General Studies, the pre-engineering program is certainly not that. Rigid transfer requirements into majors of varying capacity also limits one’s discovery of engineering majors. Competition is tough, but having one bad semester will limit all opportunities, including removal from PREP. Don’t accept admission into the University of Illinois’ DGS-PREP if you have direct admission into another engineering school.
I will agree with @illinoisx3. If an applicant doesn’t get accepted to Illinois engineering or CS, please please consider Iowa state. They offer automatic admission if the grades and test scores are at a certain level and plenty of automatic merit aid without essays and competitions. After the merit aid, their costs are even lower than Illinois in state. Don’t ever go to Illinois hoping to be transfer to CS or Engineering. It is nearly impossible. There are certainly some success stories but just a handful. Vast majority either transfer or end doing something else that they are really not interested.
I have few questions regarding PREP and transfer to Engineering.
- Do students enrolled in prep get AP credit or they have to take subjects again no matter what because they are in PREP?
- I know PREP was introduced Fall of 2017. Do anyone have stats on how many students are enrolled in PREP for 2017?
- When is student eligible to apply for transfer? End of first year?
- Is it possible for PREP student to apply to non engineering like Math+CS or Stat+CS or BS in Physics?
- Is PREP student required to take course that is not required engineering graduation? Common misunderstanding is that you have retake majority of your high school courses? Is that true?
Thanks
You posted this twice so I’ll put my answer here too for future reference.
From what I’ve heard, switching to another CS major from a CS major is still very difficult and not really any easier. Being in LAS instead of CoE is nice because LAS kids get more free elective hours, so they could take Linguistics classes on the side and maybe pick up a minor.
I don’t know a ton about PREP but I’ll try to answer as best as I can.
- You can take AP credit, just as any other student.
- No idea, I couldn't find any stats on students enrolled in PREP
- My guess is after the first year, but I can't find any info on that.
- Yes, I don't think you need to apply to engineering if you're in PREP.
- I'm not 100% sure what you mean. All courses you take are required for graduation since you need 128 hours to graduate. In PREP you take the foundation math/science courses (Calc, Chem/Physics), intro courses for your intended major, and then any gen eds. I know the university is big on having students get their Comp I gened done freshman year for example.
The nice thing about PREP is if you do well in your classes you’re guaranteed acceptance into a major (unless its the super competitive BioE,MechE, or CS).
Looks like EE and CompE have become more competitive in the last year or so, or at least more restricted.
If anyone get admitted to PREP (Pre-Engineering-Program), can try to help my best as my DC last year got CS deferred, accepted in PREP and now working hard to get into CS. Due to UIUC CS passion, Purdue CS was declined.
@KarlKing I am strongly disagree with some of comments you have made about changes (GPA was known before May 1st deadline of acceptance) as we are in same boat as you since last February 2017. We had few discussions over phone with admission counselor, Prep adviser etc. Even face to face meeting at UIUC. Fact is UIUC has weed out non-competitive eng students upfront by creating PREP. In the past DGS has 4000+ kids and wants to transfer into engineering college, at end of freshman year barely 500 would make it and rest will be in limbo. So PREP is created to identify the cream of DGS upfront and so far it has worked for us, no doubt it had changed the requirements for this year students (shuffle few programs bucket and tighten GPA requirement for some programs). My take is simple if kid is willing to take chance and feel confident about their abilities and passion, PREP is right thing to do as that is only avenue to get into Eng college, any DGS student would have to go through PREP b4 they can in any eng discipline.
@hdxil007 PREP student go through ICT process in Spring (2nd semester), my DC has just finished that, due date was March 1st. Its basically includes essays, other questions and your rational for eng discipline that you wanted to get in.
@hdxil007 My DC states that ~260 joined and lots of them dropped after 1st semester, most likely they can’t keep us pace with GPA. Flip side of that is if you are really confident and passionate @ what you want to do and think that a border line applicant, then you have pretty good chance to be in UIUC engineering after 1st year with eng classes in freshman year,
Thank you for sharing. My daughter was admitted into PREP for Fall 2018. She also received a scholarship. It is hard for us to turn it down but we are going to for these reasons:
- I asked the % of students transferring into engineering (she wants to transfer into Mechanical which requires a 3.75). The DGS office compared her stats to those of similarly situated DGS students (similar SAT/ACT/GPA at a large highly ranked suburban school to get the number - there were 23 kids situated like her) answer was zero.
- I asked the % of students staying in the Prep program after the first semester and while I didn't get a hard % number from the people I talked to it appeared less than 50%.
- When I asked about the number of kids who are getting the requisite GPA to transfer in (3.75 for the one my daughter wanted) I was told out of the 23 kids similarly situated to my daughter 13 -- did not earn a 3.0 and 19 - did not earn a 3.5. That is a really low number.
Please ask these hard questions of both the engineering school you want to get and and DGS if you are considering this:
(1) what are the average number of semesters it takes a PREP student to graduate from engineering?
(2) what is the percentage of PREP students that ultimately get admitted into Open Capacity engineering and Limited Capacity engineering?
(3) what is the number of transfer students admitted into Open Capacity or Limited Capacity programs v. DGS students?
(4) will students not in engineering but taking engineering courses (i.e. in DGS) have access to the same tutoring resources that engineering students have?
(5) what percentage of freshman and first year sophomore engineering students that achieve a 3.5 specialized GPA? Here, I am wondering about the do-ability of achieving a 3.5 in the specialized GPA courses. Is it a small percentage of students who achieve this GPA? Are grades handed out on a curve so that only a certain number get certain grades?
(6) does the engineering school have statistics on the number of transfer students accepted in through PREP? If so, how many are accepted in through this program – in both the limited Capacity category and the Open Capacity category?
My daughter got in to University of New Mexico, Iowa State, University of Iowa, University of Colorado at Boulder, Michigan State University and Arizona State University. U of C at Boulder and MSU are too expensive (money offered not enough). ASU is not what she is looking for and U of Iowa is less strong in engineering. So we have narrowed it down to Iowa State and University of New Mexico.
Thank you for this post!!
@PPofEngrDr see my post. Ask questions about actual number in similar situation to your student. My daughter is a top student with high test scores at a very highly ranked suburban high school and the large % of the 23 kids similar to her in DGS PREP are not cutting it.
Ask hard questions. Don’t assume that this can happen. 3.0 is for the entry level least popular engineering major.
@enginmom4 just quick response, my DC is also going for equally hard, CS that is as hard as Mech and Bio, requires dept review besides 3.75 GPA.
@PPofEngrDr that is wonderful – is your child starting fall 2018 or in the program right now? If in the program right now, has your child been admitted to CS?
@enginmom4
Here is detail for your original questions.
Here are my answers for your questions order.
- A PREP student can only apply for transfer in 2nd semester (Spring time). Decision comes around June, b4 you start 3rd semester. You also have 3rd semester as 2nd alternative if for some reason you didn’t do that well in 2nd semester after applying for transfer in 2nd semester.
- I believe these numbers not published as last year was 1st batch of PREP student. For Open capacity only requirement is 3.0 GPA which in my view shouldn’t be that difficult for engineering student.
- Students can transfer to Eng from PREP (technically DGS), Engineering Underrated (it is technically engg) or from another university.
- Yes PREP students have same course and resources as that engineering major. Of course professor can be different depending on class size. This the reason PREP students are being charged just like any other engineering student.
5.Grading is different from subject to subject. Believe my DC mentioned curve grading for one subject in 1st semester (tbh that is first time I learnt about curve grading), also curve grading being used for an exam only for a subject.
6.I believe those numbers should be available after 1st PREP batch transitions, to my knowledge my DC decision is expected to be in middle of June and has to select classes for 3rd semester sometimes next month in April (so you can imagine unless you know the PREP decision how can you select classes)? They do use override process that allows students to admit to specific classes relevant to their interest that otherwise not available. e.g a PREP student interested for CS may have access to CS class but not Mech class and vice a versa.
So PREP is certainly for students those missed the initial admission and very much know the route they are interested in. My DC didn’t accept UIC CS Honors, IIT CS, Purdue CS and decided to join UIUC PREP because of confidence and determination. So overall i agree PREP is not for everybody, especially Restricted Capacity (CS, Bio and Mech), unless you have that sheer determination.
@enginmom4 my DC join PREP last year, just finished (end of Feb) transfer process (they call it creating a portfolio) and decisions are expected to be in mid June. However based on GPA as of right now (1st sem 4.0 GPA, 2nd sem so far 3.93 GPA) and club activities and participation, we feel confident for upcoming June.
Also GPA requirement is overall as well as technical GPA (math, science, any other subject specific to major, for us CS classes)
@PPofEngrDr Sorry for the confusion, I already received answers from DGS as to my questions directly from the department, I was sharing in case others would want those questions answered. But I appreciate your answers and I wish your child best of luck. The admit/deny decision coming in June means that students who don’t make it in won’t be able to apply to another school for engineering, they are stuck at UIUC.
Above I referenced some data I was told, the numbers are too low and thus too much of a gamble for us to give up scholarship money from other schools – we will never have that scholarship money again and she needs the scholarships. Its a hard decision because I am a double alum from U of I, my daughter knows the school well having attended summer camp there for engineering. We have sheer determination but not enough funding to make sure she has other options if she doesn’t make it in. Good luck to your child.
@PPofEngrDr that is definitely inspiring!
@enginmom4 we are having similar questions last year before selecting PREP, we had few phone calls with various advisors, we have a f2f meeting at UIUC as well b4 my DC picked PREP. Based on numbers I have seen so far for PREP, its seems fear is overblown. When we learnt last year that there are only ~260 in PREP. Just think for a moment how many engineering disciplines they have among all 4 categories, about 14 so that 260 number is <20 students per eng discipline, as a student if you are willing to take that challenge for major you are interested in that is certainly doable. After 1st sem lots of students dropped from PREP, lets say ~100 for understanding, we don’t know the exact number either, but its kids talk. So it seems very competitive on surface at beginning and turns out in favor after 1st sem as now that competition is drastically reduced from <20 to <12.
My DC is at home for spring break if you are interested in detail conversation about this experience, we are happy to talk over phone as well.
I agree finance plays bigger role, as dealing with younger one right now for college admission for healthcare route.
GL to your daughter for whatever she decides at end.
I would LOVE to talk to you and your child over the phone. Oh my goodness! Can I direct message you? Thank you!