Does yield-protection exist?

Grammar police alert. That headline from The Williams Record is not a good advertisement for the English language skills of those who write or edit the publication.

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If a college prioritized both high yield and high predictability of yield over other “building a class” aspects, it could increase the percentage of the class filled by ED admission (or equivalent, like QB NCM). That would be more reliable than playing the “level of interest” guessing game, and would not lose those “overqualified” applicants who really do see the college as their first choice.

@DoingOurBest . Oh, I think it is VERY obvious from what you’ve related, that yield protection was most definitely involved in your son’s case. Deferred from EA, but then accepted into honors with a high merit award? After he wrote them a lovely and detailed letter of continued interest, that indicated that he really WAS interested in them?

Out of curiosity, did he wind up there?

This is why I say that if schools are going to play that game of rejecting highly qualified applicants because they’re trying to massage their “yield” numbers, then students are TOTALLY justified in sending supplemental essays to each school detailing exactly why each school is their first choice, if accepted. Make the common app essay a thing of beauty that “shows, not tells” about the applicant’s drive, determination, grit, without any specifics that would limit them to certain schools. And then tailor the supplemental essay for the individual school to explain exactly why that school’s program is the best fit for the applicant, and how that school is the dream school for the applicant, for each and every school. Visit the school if possible, reach out to a professor in the intended department, do everything to make it seem that the student will attend if admitted. And then decide from the acceptances received.

I could just see my kid saying, “But that’s not fair! That’s not right! That’s cheating!” Well, when colleges reject applicants, not on the basis of their credentials, but in view of massaging their “yield” numbers to look more attractive to future applicants, they most definitely are not operating in good faith. In light of that, the kids are perfectly justified in telling each school, “I love you best.” After all, are the schools telling the kids, “Don’t bother applying here if you are overqualified and could possibly be admitted to a more selective school, because we will reject you, unless you convince us that you truly intend to choose us.”

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I’m not convinced yield protection exists. I am QUITE convinced that there are lots of kids who “phone it in” when applying to their safety school, who do not proof- read their “Why Brandeis” essay so that it starts with “I’ve wanted to attend Brown my whole life”, and who don’t bother to correct obvious misfires in their application to those safety schools (like tailoring their application to a major which the safety does not offer). I’ve heard of kids sheepishly admit that they wrote about majoring in engineering when they forgot that the safety didn’t have an engineering program, or writing about their interest in the college’s “Study Archaeology at our campus in Athens” when the college doesn’t HAVE a campus in Athens.

Do the parents know or admit this? I haven’t a clue- but to the parent, this becomes “yield protection” because who could imagine that a lowly safety school would reject little Susie?

I don’t think it’s a game. An Adcom is doing his/her due diligence by accepting students who have a reasonable chance of wanting to attend. I’ve interviewed PLENTY of kids for Brown as an alumna who told me that they really, really, really wanted to attend (fill in the blank more prestigious college) but their guidance counselor insisted that they “cast a wide net”. Is this a kid I’d want as my roommate?

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Of course, in reality, lots of college students are not attending their first choice colleges, because they were rejected from their first choice colleges or could not afford their first choice colleges. Does this makes them any less worthy as college roommates or classmates?

Also, an actual safety should not leave any doubt for admission (and affordability). Colleges which consider subjectively graded application aspects (at least for the applicant in question) can at best be called “likely”, not “safety”.

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Most kids don’t attend their first choice college. But to APPLY with the taste of sour grapes already in your mouth is a mistake, in my opinion. As I’ve posted before, we insisted that each kid find “something to love” about every college we visited- even if it was something relatively trivial- before moving on. I know kids who have trudged off to such phenomenal schools as UVA, Georgetown, Middlebury, Wesleyan, U Chicago.

Enabling this attitude with “yield protection” doesn’t help the kid move on- whether he or she ends up at a local commuter college due to finances, or a fantastic private U which became more affordable than the “dream college”, or a solid public U which was the fallback when the “dream college” was a deny.

Pre-Covid, kids had the luxury of rejecting colleges as “not for me” because the tour guide was “too preppy” or “wore Birkenstocks” or the upholstery in the admissions office was tattered. So it was easier for the parents to proclaim “Tufts Syndrome” than to help the kid understand that not every single element of every single college might be to their personal preference.

Who goes in to an interview already setting the stage for “this place is not for me”?

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He is still in the process of evaluating all his acceptances so I will let you know soon!

I also want to add that when my son wrote his NU LOCI he was very careful with his words. NU was not his absolute number 1 choice at the time so his sense of honesty stopped him from writing that it was. Instead, he went into detail about all the things he respects and appreciates about NU’s program. He painted a vivid picture for them about how he would fit into their student body should he attend.

Also, for those that don’t know, NU has no supplemental essays so he definitely didn’t cash it in when he initially applied. They got the exact same common app essay and application as every other school he applied to.

In retrospect, I think NU was looking for more demonstrative signs that he was very interested. Perhaps reaching out to the AO, attending virtual events, sending a pre-decision LOCI, etc. But, as we’d already been on two tours, plus the separate engineering tour, we didn’t feel we needed more info. He was already interested.

At the end of the day, they gave him a great offer but I’d be lying if I said the initial EA deferral didn’t sour things a bit. If they had showed him the love from the start things might be different. I guess we were looking for NU to show more demonstrated interest in him. :wink:

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This I don’t get. He got accepted with a great offer- what “love” are you expecting?

I’ve interviewed for jobs where it was clear that I was not the first choice-- i.e. several weeks go by after the final/final/final interview. And then an offer- yeah! And a great offer, for a wonderful job with a company I’d love to work for. Do I stand my ground and take an inferior offer from a company where I was clearly the first choice or swallow my pride and take the “career-making” offer? Does it matter that they offered the job to someone who turned it down, and then ended up hiring me? Do I walk the halls with a giant “Second Choice” stamped on my forehead?

I’d encourage ANYONE who gets accepted but doesn’t “feel the love” to get over it really quickly. Like in the first five minutes. Accepted is accepted. Wait listed and then accepted? Take the win and don’t look back…

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I totally agree with this attitude. Friend’s kid desperately wanted one high stat public U - got deferred. Meanwhile, got accepted with merit to another school. Then got accepted to the Public U. But he was offended, so he didn’t go there. Go figure.

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@blossom As it turns out, the colleges that did accept my son early had two additional months to show him why their school is the best place to be.

That’s just the way it goes. NU traded in that opportunity so that they could make extra extra extra sure my son was interested in them.

Why is it ok for colleges to demand that kids show early and frequent interest, but kids can’t expect the same from colleges?

In the end, two of the schools that accepted my son early are the #4 and the #6 engineering programs in the country. I understand your job interview analogy but, in our case, it doesn’t quite apply as the schools that wanted him “first” certainly aren’t the inferior options.

Anyway, my opinion is that NU would have more luck pulling the highest stats kids to their program if they didn’t make them jump through the deferral LOCI hoops. Accept them early, use merit money, and spend the next few months showing them why honors at their school is the best place to be.

For the record, my son is still considering NU’s offer.

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@DoingOurBest

It could also have been that it had very little to do with your son or his LOCI. It’s easy to think that because that’s the piece you saw and controlled, , but maybe the school realized that he would be a good addition only after seeing what their RD pool looked like. Maybe they thought they’d see better versions of your kid – whatever that might be to them.

I totally agree that the “early” schools get more time to show applicants what they have to offer.

And I will share that one of the CC at our school confessed that there was a school that had in some way not done right by her kid and that she continued to harbor a dislike (even though her kid had very much moved on!). So yeah, very much a parent thing!

The cold reality is that some schools need to sell themselves and some schools don’t. Simple supply and demand. Schools like Northwestern have an abundant supply of qualified applicants.

I absolutely agree with this :slight_smile: It “felt” like yield protection but could have been something else entirely! Like I said above, we will never know!

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This is not how admissions works. But whatever. Best wishes to your son as he makes his decision.

If you’re going to assume you know the unknown, then I won’t argue the ensuing conclusions.

Colleges that practice yield protection will never admit it. Transparency isn’t in their DNA in the first place. Certainty is never a possibility.

All colleges admit it, INJ. Is there a college in this country that encourages kids who aren’t interested in attending to apply? Even the Harvard/Stanford’s want to build a class filled with students who want to be there.

Exactly what type of transparency would meet your criterion?

Even the “rack 'em, stack 'em” public U’s which publish their admissions grids-- a few years ago there was a stink in my town about the Val who hadn’t been admitted to our state flagship. I knew the kid- who admitted to “friends and family” that he hadn’t sent his transcript, since he was so confident that one of his reaches would pan out. This is pretty low intensity-- put a college on the list for your GC to send a transcript (i.e. push a button).

So even a “we admit by the stats” public U actually requires- y’know- some sign of interest- before writing an enthusiastic “Welcome to our university” email. Some call that yield protection I guess.

Admit that they practice yield protection? I don’t think Tufts ever admitted it.

On the issue of overall transparency, some publics are more transparent in their admissions but most other colleges aren’t.

I don’t mean issuing a public statement saying “we practice yield protection. We admit it, and we apologize”. But they ALL communicate that the best application strategy is to understand what the college offers and to make sure that it fits with what the particular student is looking for, i.e. “if admitted, there is a chance that I will attend”. THAT’s yield protection, and even Harvard with sky high yield isn’t coy that they want to admit students who want to be there.

West Point/the academies- no. But that’s a completely different beast.

We visited Princeton the year they had a breakthrough of some kind on their yield (I don’t recall the particulars, or which kid we had with us at the time which would help me date the year). I remember arriving at the admissions office and a nice admissions officer asked for our names (which we provided) and then handed me a clipboard and said “can you sign in?” (with a smile). I asked why… we were about to join a big tour, so this wasn’t some customized visit, we weren’t big-wigs or alums or potential donors. He smiled again and said “So we know that you were here!” I replied, “I registered for the tour in advance, don’t you already know we were here?” and he laughed and said, “You registered in advance, you showed up, and we’re going to track whether or not you eventually apply”. (kid did not).

Why would a college at the top of the yield heap care if someone visits and doesn’t apply? Or someone applies without ever visiting, or emailing for information, or logging on to a virtual Q&A? That’s called demonstrated interest, which is the first cousin to yield protection, aka admitting students who show a “more than modest” interest in actually showing up if admitted.

What’s the mystery here- does Neiman Marcus send credit card applications to people who have bad credit and only shop at Goodwill? And if they do- they’re running an even WORSE business than their creditors think…

I don’t know how long ago you visited. Princeton, along with a handful of other colleges, no longer ask you to sign in if you visit, to explicitly demonstrate that they don’t track your interest. Most other colleges still do.

I agree that yield protection manifest itself in different ways. There’re different degrees of yield protection. Some colleges, however, may have crossed a line if they reject (or defer, or waitlist) a student only because they suspect s/he may have a “better” option elsewhere and may be less likely to enroll if admitted.