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The truth is that more kids eschew the use of illicit drugs/alcohol than use them.
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<p>Bull. Provide a citation for that statement, please. It is totally baseless.</p>
<p>I have no problem believing that the majority (50%+) of residential college students use illicit drugs (alcohol is a drug and in most states using it under the age of 21 is illicit) but residential college students are a small subset of the kid population. When kids make good decisions parents attribute those decisions to a good upbringing so it is incorrect to attribute kids' poor decisions to something else, like peer pressure. This, of course, assumes parents consider illicit drug use by their kid a poor decision.</p>
<p>"I have no problem believing that the majority (50%+) of residential college students use illicit drugs (alcohol is a drug and in most states using it under the age of 21 is illicit) but residential college students are a small subset of the kid population."</p>
<p>Do you seriously believe that other groups of young people under 21 are less likely to drink? What evidence do you have for that belief?</p>
<p>By the way, dnt--how do YOU feel about abstinence-only sex education?</p>
<p>So what you're saying is you have no basis for your statement other than your entirely baseless belief. Gotcha.</p>
<p>(By the way, the peers I have who are not at residential colleges drink as much or more as those who are. Take that for what you will.)</p>
<p>Statistically though (according to mini) residential colleges have more drinkers than commuter colleges. </p>
<p>From <a href="http://www.alcohol101plus.org/downloads/CollegeStudents.pdf%5B/url%5D">http://www.alcohol101plus.org/downloads/CollegeStudents.pdf</a></p>
<p>72% (69% if under 21, 86% if Greek) of college students reported drinking within the last 30 days
84% (82% if under 21, 93% if Greek) of college students reported drinking within the last year</p>
<p>"Drinking among young people continues to drop. For example, the proportion of young people aged 12 through 17 who have consumed any alcohol during the previous month has plummeted from 50% in 1979 to 17.6 in 2002, according to the federal government's annual National Survey on Drug Use and Health...The proportion of college freshmen who drink continues to decrease. Freshmen entering college in 2003 reported the lowest rates of drinking in the 38-year history of the national college Freshman Survey. The proportion reporting occasional or frequent beer drinking dropped to an historic low of 44.8%, down from 73.7% in 1982. Consumption of both wine and distilled spirits also dropped to a record low." (Higher Education Research Center/American Council on Education. American College Freshman College Survey. Political Interest on the Rebound Among Nation’s Freshmen, UCLA Survey Reveals. Higher Education Research Institute/American Council on Education press release, Jan. 26 2004.)</p>
<p>...in the last month... among 12 to 17 year olds. This is a great example of cherrypicking statistics. Last time I checked this entire discussion was about college students.</p>
<p>There was a poster about 4+ years ago, who attended a well known school, who said that he could control his urges. He was found dead. Alcohol poisoning. You can probably find his URL from the virtual souses at Sinners Alley.</p>
<p>dntw- Could I sell you some ocean front property in Arizona?
What planet you on, boy?
If you are the parent of a teen/young adult, please congratulate them for me on successfully putting one over on you big time!</p>
<p>Well I did not think my post would generate so much controversy. Sorry about that! I guess everyone is different. My parents didn't drink or do drugs, so neither did I. My kids don't either. You are thinking "yea, right." Well think what you will but I know my kids. They don't drink. We all laugh at people who do. Or we cry, as my son lost a friend who died in a drunk driving accident. I feel that most parents these days are all to eager to give up responsibility for their kids so they can move on with their lives. We're a family and we're all in it together, not just until they're 18 years old. But to each his own. Anyway, in terms of college sure you can still get a 3.5 and drink like crazy. But doesn't mean you're learning anything. You're just cheating your way through school. Doing the minimum to get by.</p>
<p>If you want the most current data on all of these issues, look for the most recent data on college students in "Monitoring the Future" out of the University of Michigan (under the sponsorship of the National Institute on Drug Abuse). They've been doing annual surveys since 1975.</p>
<p>Welcome</a> to the MTF Website</p>
<p>The other best source of college survey data is Henry Wechsler out of the Harvard School of Public Health.</p>
<p>When I stated "drink yourself to death" I didn't mean they necessarily die as a college student. Alcohol usually doesn't kill you that quickly (although it obviously can). Usually it's a slow insideous death preceeded by years or torment, disease, ill-health, and disfunction. My uncle graduate top of his class at Notre Dame, a PhD. It took him 30 years to die from alcohol and during that time it destroyed his family and friends. They still pay the price today. And it all started with the innocent college drinking days. That is what I meant.</p>
<p>There is a huge difference between parents "footing the bill" for a kid that is screwing up at college...I rather doubt you'll find many people here that support that notion. I don't personally know a single parent that has NOT pulled the financial plug on a student that is on academic probation because of behavior. I also know a large percentage of parents here have had children that pushed the boundaries more or less. Whether or not a young person will become an alcohol or not is an entirely different thing. Obviously you have very strong feelings about it and personal experience - if you are a parent you can talk to your children and lead by example, after that at some point they will make their own decisions and choices. If you are a young person in a family with alcoholism then know that some studies indicate that addicitve tendancies may be inherited so you should be aware of your choices, decisions and behaviors. There are many behaviors that young people are engaged in like anorexia, bulimia, OTC drugs and probably some I'm not thinking of that are dangerous and harmful. I'm not dismissing your concerns, but hopefully by the time these birds leave the nest you've instilled your values...if not then by all means pull the plug, bring them home and hope you can retrain.</p>
<p>For all my son's flaws, he is learning plenty at college and is engaged in (most) of his classes. He has been chosen to write an occasional column for a major city newspaper and he was a recruited athlete (injured). He does drink and in my opinion, too much. How can you say these kids are "cheating their way through school"?<br>
Your family obviously stays away from alcohol. That's wonderful and I'm glad it works for y'all. However, you are NOT the majority and just because some of us might have kids who drink before they are 21 and party too hard in college does not mean we are bad parents. I am the first one to admit to making tons of parenting mistakes, but this is not one of them. My hope is that my son learns to drink socially and responsibly the way he has seen his family do. I don't expect him to become an addict, although it could happen!</p>
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[quote]
Death: 1,700 college students between the ages of 18 and 24 die each year from alcohol-related unintentional injuries, including motor vehicle crashes (Hingson et al., 2005). </p>
<p>Injury: 599,000 students between the ages of 18 and 24 are unintentionally injured under the influence of alcohol (Hingson et al., 2005). </p>
<p>Assault: More than 696,000 students between the ages of 18 and 24 are assaulted by another student who has been drinking (Hingson et al., 2005). </p>
<p>Sexual Abuse: More than 97,000 students between the ages of 18 and 24 are victims of alcohol-related sexual assault or date rape (Hingson et al., 2005). </p>
<p>Unsafe Sex: 400,000 students between the ages of 18 and 24 had unprotected sex and more than 100,000 students between the ages of 18 and 24 report having been too intoxicated to know if they consented to having sex (Hingson et al., 2002). </p>
<p>Academic Problems: About 25 percent of college students report academic consequences of their drinking including missing class, falling behind, doing poorly on exams or papers, and receiving lower grades overall (Engs et al., 1996; Presley et al., 1996a, 1996b; Wechsler et al., 2002). </p>
<p>Health Problems/Suicide Attempts: More than 150,000 students develop an alcohol-related health problem (Hingson et al., 2002) and between 1.2 and 1.5 percent of students indicate that they tried to commit suicide within the past year due to drinking or drug use (Presley et al., 1998). </p>
<p>Drunk Driving: 2.1 million students between the ages of 18 and 24 drove under the influence of alcohol last year (Hingson et al., 2002). </p>
<p>Vandalism: About 11 percent of college student drinkers report that they have damaged property while under the influence of alcohol (Wechsler et al., 2002). </p>
<p>Property Damage: More than 25 percent of administrators from schools with relatively low drinking levels and over 50 percent from schools with high drinking levels say their campuses have a "moderate" or "major" problem with alcohol-related property damage (Wechsler et al., 1995). </p>
<p>Police Involvement: About 5 percent of 4-year college students are involved with the police or campus security as a result of their drinking (Wechsler et al., 2002) and an estimated 110,000 students between the ages of 18 and 24 are arrested for an alcohol-related violation such as public drunkenness or driving under the influence (Hingson et al., 2002). </p>
<p>Alcohol Abuse and Dependence: 31 percent of college students met criteria for a diagnosis of alcohol abuse and 6 percent for a diagnosis of alcohol dependence in the past 12 months, according to questionnaire-based self-reports about their drinking (Knight et al., 2002).
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<p>No big deal?</p>
<p>Thomas, the point that you make that is totally silly is that a kid with a 3.5 and goes to parties isn't "learning" anything or "cheating their way through school". That is a very ignorant statement, irrational and without any substantiation. If you want to come on the forum and throw crap like that around just to rile people up then you open yourself up and there is a name for that behavior on forums.</p>
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It always amazes me that the same people who rant and rave about abstinence only programs with respect to sex try and peddle the "just say no" program for drinking and act like those who say anything else to their children are paving the way for the kids' destruction.</p>
<p>The reality is that almost all kids drink, smoke dope, or both (although, largely because I was a total nerd, I did neither in college). Continual harping on the total abstinence theme just prevents you from having sensible discussions about reasonable principles like "don't drink and drive" and "keep your partying to the weekends."
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<p>The difference is that sex usually isn't harmful as long as you take precautions with condoms/birth control and stay away from the wrong type of guy... whereas drinking, even if you keep it to the weekends, is actually harmful. Also, it's easy to promise not to drink and drive and mean it while you're sober but once you're drunk there's no saying...</p>
<p>It certainly pays to be cautious with alcohol, especially if there's a family history of problems. But to link all under age drinking with bad parenting is just completely out of line. At many campuses, the percentage of kids who drink is over 80%. Are these all bad parents? Wow.
Thomas, I can see that you have been affected by your family history, but you've gone out on the fringes man. Some of us can drink and be OK. I have history in my family yet I've been able to drink light to moderately all my life with no problem.
Caution makes sense...but it outrageous to be as judgmental and rigid as you have become...unless..as someone else suggested...you're just trying to stir things up here.</p>
<p>It is also ridiculous to assume that drinking in college leads to alcoholism leads to a slow death from alcohol (post #32). There are many more drinkers than there are alcoholics. It is true that one cannot be an alcoholic without drinking, but the converse is not true - one can drink without being an alcoholic. Even among college binge drinkers, the incidence of alcoholism is low.</p>
<p>And yes, we've tried the "abstinence" route - does the term "Prohibition" ring a bell? Didn't work then, won't work now. (And of course, it was a prime mover in the rise of organized crime, starting out as bootlegging.)</p>