<p>Hi -</p>
<p>D2 has the option of taking AP Physics or a dual enrollment physics class with the Syracuse U Project Advance Program (SUPA). With dual enrollment, she will earn 8 SU credits that can be transfered to college when she enters...the program claims that 92% of the students enter college with accepted credit. The couse is supposedly the sames as Physics 101 and 102 at Syracuse. Does anyone have experience with this program and if so, what did you think?</p>
<h2>I know nothing about the Syracuse program.</h2>
<p>However, everyone should be aware that many colleges will not give credit for a dual enrollment class that is taught inside a high school building. The policies vary greatly from college to college. In PA, public colleges will give credit for these classes, but there are some public flagships in other states that will not. Many selective colleges will not give credit.</p>
<p>Also check with your high school to see if the class is calculated into your D’s GPA. My son’s school did not calculate a college class into his GPA so he opted for the AP class as he was competing for val and sal. As far as AP tests go and credit, depending on the university, your D may need a 5 to get credit for the Physics class but it will usually allow 1-2 credits in college or at least the ability to skip the intro class allowing her to take a more advanced class without having to take a pre-req class. My S won’t get credit at this college for Psychology but he does get the intro class requirement waived so he can start with a more advanced Psych class.</p>
<p>My son actually did both - for many of the CC classes he took, he followed up with AP credit. Some schools are more likely to accept AP credit than transfer credit. Also, the AP test “proves” the CC class.</p>
<p>So, her school is treating dual enrollment like an honors class - so they get a .5 boost not the full 1.0 boost towards GPA. In terms of the colllege credits, she would like to pursue business so I am hoping that the dual-enrollment course may satisfy a core science requirement. I think I will contact her target schools and clarify that.</p>
<p>GeekMom has an excellent solution - take the dual credit class and the AP test. That’s assuming that the class would cover the material that the AP test has on it.</p>
<p>What I’ve found is that AP’s and dc classes are very much unique to each college. Some may prefer AP’s, some are fine with dc, most now only take 4 and 5 scores. Too bad there is no hard and fast rule.</p>
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<p>According to [Syracuse’s</a> course catalog](<a href=“http://coursecatalog.syr.edu/search.aspx?cx=018015479555068583987:sr97mistwjc&cof=FORID:10&cat=2010&q=PHY+site%3Acoursecatalog.syr.edu%2F2010%2F&rst=c]Syracuse’s”>http://coursecatalog.syr.edu/search.aspx?cx=018015479555068583987:sr97mistwjc&cof=FORID:10&cat=2010&q=PHY+site%3Acoursecatalog.syr.edu%2F2010%2F&rst=c), Physics 101 and 102 appear to be low level non-majors’ physics courses (without calculus).</p>
<p>They are probably roughly comparable to AP Physics B (i.e. not useful as subject credit for any major that requires physics). Different universities have different policies on acceptance of AP versus other university credit, so you may want to check with each university if that is a consideration.</p>
<p>AP Physics C would be a more substantial course (with calculus), although not all universities accept even that as a substitute for physics courses for majors requiring physics courses. Another option along these lines, if available and the student has calculus, would by Syracuse’s Physics 211/212 or 215/216, with associated lab 221/222, as these are the courses for physics majors. Or similar courses may be available at a community college.</p>
<p>Are these online or correspondance courses? If so, how are labs done?</p>
<p>If the OP is in Boston, then there are a lot of options for in-person courses though they can be expensive. I know that Boston University offers a lot of summer undergrad courses in a variety of areas and I’d guess that Physics is included. Northeastern offers Physics too.</p>
<p>Just to clarify, the SU Physics courses offered through Project Advance are the same courses offered on the SU campus and there are high level quality controls in place to be sure the course content is the same in all important aspects. For a teacher to be certified to teach the SU course, he or she must meet the qualifications for adjunct status with the SU department, in this case Physics, and must successfully complete training in a content workshop for the specific courses being taught. The faculty member also visits the SU course(s) being offered in the high school once each semester and meets with the students and reviews work. </p>
<p>Regarding transfer of credit, students who successfully complete the course receive a Syracuse University transcript that indicates they were non-matriculated part-time students. While some schools do not accept college credits earned in high schools, our studies find that when students submit their SU transcript, 90% of them receive some form of recognition in the form of credit, placement, and/or exemption. I hope this is helpful in providing clarity for you. Please feel free to contact the Project Advance office if we can help you with any additional questions.</p>
<p>Sincerely,
Sari Signorelli
Associate Director
SU Project Advance</p>
<p>If you know that you will attend the school that accepts the credit, then it is worth the cost for dual enrollment, if not, and your child tests well, save $ and do AP. My kids had the choice in high school - even their sophomore chemistry class was a dual enrollment class - but we weren’t sure they’d attend school in our home state so we took the cheaper option and our gamble paid off for all the AP courses that were also dual enrollment. The kid scored a 4 or better and got credit for only the cost of the AP exam. The only course I now regret is the chemistry because it was dual enrollment but not AP level and S1 decided to attend flagship U instate. We did not pay the dual enrollment fee so despite his A in the course, he will not get college credit.</p>
<p>I would definitely do whatever one would guarantee you receive college credit. Some colleges, even the most lenient ones, require a high AP score to get credit for a course. Getting a 5 is tough to get on any AP test, and if your child can get the credit by taking the dual enrollment, I’d do that.</p>
<p>On the subject of not paying for the dual enrollment, I know some people who didn’t pay the money to get the dual enrollment and later regretted it. Summer science courses are very expensive, even at a local public university, and it’s better to pay the money now than later. A friend is paying 1900 at a local state public university for one science course. I am paying over 5 grand for a full summer of chemistry plus lab at a local private university. If son would have had a chance to take general chemistry plus lab as a dual enrollment class, even if his college wound up not taking the credit, I would take my chances and pay whatever the dual enrollment fee, especially if it was under a thousand dollars. I’d rather be out the money if he didn’t get the credit, than kicking myself later for not spending the money if there was a chance he could have gotten the credit.</p>
<p>I would say that she should take the class that her academic peers are taking. That will be the best educational experience for her. The credit aspect is a secondary consideration - the learning experience is much more important. And she will have the best learning experience with her academic peers.</p>
<p>Take the dual enrollment class and the Physics B AP test. Some colleges will not count college classes that appear on your high school transcript but just about everyone will count a good score on the Physics B AP Test.</p>
<p>Many top colleges will not accept dual enrollment credit, even some colleges ranked similarly to 'Cuse. And that is true even if the college ('Cuse in this case) certifies the course as equal to their other ones (post #9). The issue is that the course is not offered on the college campus and is not open to other college students; thus, the ‘curve’ is only other high schoolers. So, AP is more universally transferable.</p>
<p>But also beware, that dual enrollment grades count in professional school applications, i.e., med and law. Thus, B’s in dual enrollment courses can be gpa killers for top prof schools. OTOH, A’s can be gpa-boosters. :)</p>
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<p>However, AP Physics B is of little or no subject credit value in many cases. If the student intends to major in something that requires physics, better to take AP Physics C or a dual enrollment college/university physics course that can give better subject credit.</p>
<p>My D (at University of Texas, Austin) got 8 credits for a 4 on the Physics B test she took after a year of honors (not AP) physics. Two 3-credit classes and two 1-credit labs. This test is not useful for a pre med or someone majoring in the sciences but for a liberal arts kid who wants to take more classes in her major and minor - and fewer distibution/core classes - it’s great. (I know that some colleges, particularly LAC’s, are a bit stingy with which AP classes they give credit for.)</p>
<p>I think that if your major requires physics, you should take physics at your college. I wouldn’t recommend use of AP credit for a physics or engineering major.</p>
<p>ucb:</p>
<p>I would argue that specific AP courses are of little value for that major. Sure, a 5 in AP Lit may exempt one from frosh Writing, but the dept. is still gonna require 10+ courses for the major. A big benefit of AP occurs however, in fulfilling non-major GE’s or distributives.</p>
<p>Thank you everyone - we have decided that D2 will dual enroll and possibly take the Physics B AP Test. She is a candidate for the top schools but to be honest after going through the app process with D1 this year, I consider the top 25 “lottery schools” - great if she gets in but not necessarily where she will end up (even if she gets in!) </p>
<p>It looks like most of the 25-75 schools will take the credits for non-major requirements. D2 has already decided that she is not going to pursue sciences in college so this would probably satisfy a gen ed requirement.</p>
<p>Not exactly the same thing, but my D opted to take Calc 1 at the local CC this summer in lieu of taking AP Calc AB at her HS next year. She had a few reasons. First, both teachers who teach AP Calc AB at her HS are ones she’d rather avoid (the great teachers are teaching BC). Second, she’d also like to take AP Stats and it would be hard to fit both maths into her senior year schedule (and the stats teacher at her HS is fantastic). Third, she thought it would be nice to get a little college class experience under her belt. She’s not applying to elite schools and we know that the CC credit will be accepted at all the schools on her list. And it’s a sure thing, whereas she’d have to get a 4 or 5 on the AP exam to get credit from the AP Calc course.</p>
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<p>I will admit I don’t know much about most schools, but offhand I know of three private colleges in that range that will not accept DE. Just make sure that you double check.</p>