“You see yourself as compassionate. From my perspective, you are the one needing compassion, even though your judgements are offensive and without merit.”
When your worldview leads you to the conclusion that you are at war with me, someone you don’t even know and most likely will never even meet, just because I was born as a straight white male, alh I am sorry but it is you who need compassion.
Schools need to be MUCH more sensitive to how people feel. Any descriptive words or ideas at the very least should come with “trigger warnings”, if not avoided entirely. Even the word “trigger” needs to be avoided since people may be scared of guns or an old horse (who is probably dead by now).
{quote] you are looking at the world though white, male, hetereonormative eyes
[/quote]
How do you know what color his eyes are? Are you a wizard?
Who has white eyes anyway? Are you talking about their iris. which would be somewhat unique? Or their sclera - which is not at all unique to have a white sclera?
Since when do eyes even have a sexual identity?
Since when is it okay for people to attack people on this site?
“Not to be flip, but how would a blind or visually-impaired student face this assignment? Is there an audiobook equivalent?”
How would a blind student face any book assignment?
“even though your judgments are offensive and without merit”
Which ones? Retracing here. I judged that I am a male. Not someone who is male to a degree, but a male. I judged that it is possible to declare that I am one. I have attempted to update myself on recent changes in terminology used by the American Psychological Association. A list of mental disorders. I am not an expert in this field and wanted to be sure I was using the most up to date terminology. What else? I am beginning to feel that my existence as a straight white male is the real offense.
“Definitions become pretty important to us as we try to do that. For example, we have to determine who can adopt children, who should be able to buy a firearm, etc. We often limit the ability of those with a mental disorder in terms of their freedom to do such things. I am sure you don’t object to that, on some level at least? Don’t you think it is important too then that we get our definitions right, because they have to matter to us, at least in a grown up world?”
Right. I get where you are going here. However, none of that is relevant here - as Duke was not asking incoming students to reflect on who should adopt children, possess firearms, etc. They were asking incoming students to hear about a particular person’s humanity and life experiences, and to ponder how that made them feel, and whether there were any larger life lessons that might be applied to their own lives, either in the past or the future. That’s a very different brief.
@Loukydad “I am beginning to feel that my existence as a straight white male is the real offense.”
I don’t think that anyone here is offended by white males, or by a person because they are a white male. I see how you could infer that, but I do not believe it was implied.
I think that many of us actually are impressed that you are trying to engage in a dialogue. Times are changing and the better people can understand the perspectives of others, the better it will be for everyone.
At this stage, I feel the best thing for me to do is leave this thread. I really don’t want to be offensive to anyone, and I find myself incapable of avoiding it.
The only thing I really have left to say is that I agree with alh that the most valuable service these threads provide to me is the ability to understand the real environment at various schools and how my children might fit in there. In these terms, I think many who are in my shoes might find this thread very helpful.
Best to all.
I’m the daughter and granddaughter of white heterosexual males, and I gave birth to one myself whom I’d walk over hot coals for. I love them 
I’m just not seeing what’s so hard about reading a book by someone who is homosexual and references her love life. If the story is indeed how it’s portrayed here, it’s about all kinds of things - love and secrecy and mercy and compassion and family ties – none of which are exclusive to who one loves.
Isn’t it possible that you could personally be against, for example, gay marriage or gays adopting children and yet find something of value in this woman’s writings and life experience? Of course, you might read the book and not like it. I haven’t read it and it’s very possible I might not like it either. But that’s different from automatically assuming it has nothing to offer you.
“Retracing here. I judged that I am a male. Not someone who is male to a degree, but a male. I judged that it is possible to declare that I am one.”
Loukydad, I think this is quite the straw man you have inadvertently erected here. You’re 100% male and heterosexual? Great. I’m 100% female and heretosexual, I’m quite sure of that. That’s a fact about me, just like the fact that I am 5’4" and have green eyes. No revisionism possible on these things.
No one’s questioning that you are a male. No one. At all. The existence of people who may have different sexual desires from you or me, or the existence of people who may place themselves at different places in between male and female, doesn’t change any of that. One bit. I’m really not sure why you are acting as though your maleness is being questioned.
Variety is the spice of life. That goes for food, personality, and opinions, among other things. If you have additional input pertinent to this thread, please don’t feel like it would be unwelcome.
I haven’t said much here in a while, but the reading has been interesting. You’ve been part of that.
"I am beginning to feel that my existence as a straight white male is the real offense. "
Its not!
But what is not understandable to many is the suggestion that a persons sexual identity could even be thought to be threatened or be at risk if a book is read.
People who are comfortable in their own skins , AND who accept that others may be comfortable in THEIR own skins, even if they are different , are not likely to feel threatened by others who have different views .
Different strokes for different folks.
I checked on iTunes and a lot of classics (recent and older) are available in audio-book form. I couldn’t find one for Fun Home.
Are there Braille versions of most of these books? How would that work for a graphic novel? To me it’s more like trying to take a film class if you’re visually impaired.
It should also be noted that this book does not present its homosexual/bisexual characters in a uniformly positive light. It is not a “pro-gay” book. Bechdel’s father engaged in some very destructive and self-destructive behaviors, including relationships with underage students, shoplifting, and raging at his family. She presents a complex portrait of a man with a whole lot of demons. The question of why he behaves as he does would have made for an interesting topic of discussion.
@LOUKYDAD #274 wrote “Simple maxims are good…Unfortunately we grow up though and it just isn’t that simple in everyday life.”
You’ve left the thread and may not see this, but I’m actually quite curious how you square this with your claim that (if I understand you correctly) gender identity is a fixed binary. How isn’t it possible that gender just isn’t that simple in everyday life?
AFAIK, visual art is usually adapted for blind students by being described. (Unless it’s sculpture, in which case touch models are useful.) So with a graphic novel, you’d have someone read it to you and tell you what was happening in each panel, since you’d miss a lot with just a Braille text. This is done with films as well. Movies and TV shows can have audio description commentary enabled, which is like closed captioning but for the blind. A voice-over says “Jane smiles and hugs John” or whatever in between the dialogue.
Thanks, @Hanna. That’s helpful. I guess that wouldn’t really work for someone with religious objections then, or would it? I can see it being an acceptable accommodation for an observant Muslim (who cannot VIEW artistic representations of people), but maybe not for an observant Christian whose faith requires that he not be exposed to depictions of sexual relations in any form?
I only bring the question up because, in my experience, when you’re in a situation where you cannot reasonably participate in an assignment, you try to find a workable accommodation BEFORE you criticize anyone for choosing a specific work.
Another tantrum of students with “noble cause”…
Bible is “offensive”, too. These kids should go back to their mom’s comfy womb
Loukydad, for all his many posts and fuming and taking his football and going home, has completely failed to explain how Fun Home has anything to do with threatening his gender identity as a man, or anyone’s gender identity. Because it doesn’t.
The author’s stand-in does, as a young girl, go through a period of wanting to be a boy, but that is presented more or less as an immature, unsatisfactory response to her feelings. The mature figure always identifies as a woman. Gender roles are questioned plenty, the idea that girls should be girly and men manly, but always in a context that people know whether they are male or female, they just aren’t always comfortable with what other people think that ought to mean about their behavior and their psyches. It’s not that the book is hostile towards or negative about the transgendered, it’s just that the book (like most books) is about being cisgendered, and doesn’t have much to say directly about the transgendered experience.
The problem is that Loukydad – like young Mr. Grasso – thinks it’s appropriate to spout off about a book he hasn’t read. Not even the Cliff Notes, or Wikipedia. It’s not OK.