NusaDua, you are fortunate they caught in 3rd grade. I was also fortunate in the school began testing in first grade and then every 3 years as part of his IEP. They tested him again as a senior so he could bring the full battery of tests to college.
I have one dyslexic and one slow processor. Sounds to me like this kid is more likely a slow processor and perhaps inattentive ADD rather than dyslexic. But good testing will tell you what’s going on.
While expensive, you need to spend the money to get the private testing done and documented. Without documentary back up, it will be tough or impossible to get accommodations in HS, college or standardized testing. With the documents, we got accommodations for both kids for everything (ACT and SAT both).
The SAT and ACT accommodations aren’t that hard to get – if you can show testing and back up going back several years. The reason why most people fail to get them is because they don’t have the necessary back up.
You should check out David Flink’s book “Thinking Differently.” Highly recommended.
I don’t want to hijack this thread so will start a new one if this doesn’t seem relevant. In her original post, @PurplePlum mentioned the possibility of a visual processing issue.
I have wondered the same about my D. She showed various reading quirks over the years (processing whole words, not sounding things out, skipping words and lines…) that didn’t seem like classic dyslexia. She managed well until junior year IB classes overwhelmed her with the amount of reading. I tried to have her evaluated at the local U, but they couldn’t take her and I hesitated to pay $3000 to have it done, given that I couldn’t find much information about what could be done to help her even with a diagnosis. She is taking reading intensive classes now and they just wear her out. I’m again looking into having her evaluated.
Does anyone have experience with positive results from Vision Therapy and what kid of symptoms a person who would benefit would exhibit? Could this apply to OP’s D?
@PNWedwonk: My DD did have a positive experience with Vision Therapy a few years ago to help with really bad headaches that she was getting. Though her vision was fine, the eye doctor did say there was an issue with how the eye tracked I think (though my memory is dim here–I’ll have to double check with DD when she gets home). And he suggested the Vision Therapy which she did and which did seem to help her and did correct the tracking issue. However, this was all before we realized that she most likely has some kind of processing speed issue or some such LD–though I definitely would try it again for my DD, depending on what the results of her LD evaluation are.
I came across this you tube video on visual processing disorders and it was on my mental to do list to look into it further…you may want to watch it…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6nke_oPAJOg&feature=youtu.be
I like the phrase that you used–reading quirks–that is how I would characterize what my DD had up till this year when it become a more serious issue.
@PNWedwonk give her a paragraph and tell her to circle all the e’s
See how long it takes compared to you, assuming you have no issues. That’s a very quick and dirty test.
My youngest son (S17) did a 9 month course of vision therapy in 4th and 5th grades. I can’t speak highly enough about the doctor and the program. First, she figured out that the very highly recommended and rated pediatric ophthalmologist we had been using for years had averaged his incredible nearsightedness in one eye with the incredible farsightedness in the other eye and given us glasses that fit neither eye! Poor kid. He didn’t KNOW what it was like to see properly, so he never said anything. He just figured mommy and daddy took me to the eye doctor and got me glasses, so this must be what it’s like to see. If the developmental optometrist did nothing else for my child, she got him properly fitted glasses, He has been wearing bifocals since 4th grade and now has prisms in them.
Within two days of getting his proper glasses, the blinding headaches that had tormented him for years vanished. The neurologist we had consulted could find nothing wrong and we never attributed it to the glasses being wrong - after all, we brought our child to the top specialist to get them.
With proper glasses and vision therapy, his reading went from 2nd grade level to 9th grade level in just a few months. By middle school, he was reading at high school level. In 7th grade, he was finally diagnosed as dyslexic, in large part because the vision therapy made it possible for him to be properly tested.
His processing speed owes points but with extended time on the ACT, he got a 32 on reading.
The thing about vision therapy is that it’s non-invasive so it can’t hurt in the least. My son was able to tell fairly quickly that he could see and focus better and it was also obvious very quickly that his reading skills were improving rapidly, his headaches were gone and his behavior and sleep were functioning much better.
My poor kid thought that everyone saw multiple copies of letters and that phonics don’t make sense to anyone.
I had tears in my eyes when 11 year old D got her first set of glasses and just stared at the trees, marveling at all of the individual leaves. She always passed the school eye exams. I think she just listened to the kids in front of her in line and memorized all of the possible answers. 
Hey guys…just wanted to update you on what is happening and wanted to get your input.
So, we had DD formally assessed for learning disabilities. It was expensive and thorough and took the better part of two days. The psychologist concluded that DD’s results were “all over the place” and while she saw “seeds of a learning disability”, there was not enough evidence in the results to officially conclude that DD has a LD. She gave us numerous reasons in her 20 page report to support this conclusion, but could not really explain to my satisfaction, why DD scored in either the gifted or high average level in many areas (such as Visual/Spatial, Knowledge, Reasoning, Memory, anything having to do with math, etc), yet low to super low in some other areas (such as rapid Letter Naming, Rapid Digit Naming, Rapid Symbolic Naming, Reading Rate/Fluency, Paragraph Comprehension, etc.), and yet has no learning disability. Timing for DD was definitely an issue and she could not finish certain sections, though the parts she finished demonstrated high knowledge. The psychologist feels that while DD struggles with reading and writing, that this may be a function of what she termed as DD’s “significant giftedness” in other areas and her possible frustration that all areas of her brain do not work as adeptly (whatever that means). She recommended that we bring DD to a dyslexia reading specialist, even though she has not been diagnosed with dyslexia, to get some reading help. Unfortunately, without a definite diagnosis of dyslexia, I can not access Learning Ally and the like.
Quite frankly, I am even more confused and am wondering if I need some other “authority” to review the test results to give us an opinion. I am wondering if and how to locate someone who has more experience with gifted kids and LD’s. Though I vetted the psychologist that we used carefully, I am concerned that perhaps she did not have the exact experience that we needed and I am not pleased that we are are no closer to knowing what is wrong and how to address it. With no formal LD diagnosis, I can not get her an extra accommodations in school, have no access to Learning Ally or other online textbooks, yet she still has reading issues and timing issues and is pretty miserable in school.
The psychologist we used was very sweet and seemed qualified and came highly recommended, but she was at a loss to explain to us exactly what is wrong with DD. She seemed almost as puzzled as we are.
Thoughts?
Did you use an expert in 2E issues (gifted and LDs). Giftedness can cause there to be results exactly like you describe.
Mom2aphysicsgeek: You know, it’s funny that you ask that because after typing out my update, it occurred to me exactly what is bothering me. Its not that I think the psychologist did a poor job administering the tests per se, but I think she did a poor job in analyzing and interpreting the results. She was too baffled to have been an expert in 2E.
In answer to your question, I was not able to find an expert in 2E per se in my area–though I described exactly what I was seeking to a very credible organization that educates, trains, and certifies LD therapists. This woman was recommended to me but she did not hold herself out as a 2E expert, though she did say she had experience dealing with gifted kids and LD’s. Apparently, that may not have been enough though.
I am wondering if I can get a copy of the physical tests results and see if there is a 2E expert somewhere in the country who would look over the results and give me an opinion as a consultant. I am not sure how to find a reputable 2E expert though. I’ll have to do some internet searching to see what else I can come up with.
I don’t know if it is possible to do what you want, but I do know that testing 2E teenagers w/o expertise in 2E is not worth the paper it is printed on. They have developed coping strategies precisely bc they are gifted.
You can try starting here: http://2edb.info
Have you had your kiddo specifically assessed for dyslexia? There ARE folks who specialize in this. They are usually specially trained special educators, not psychologists (although some psychologists might be trained as well).
I would suggest that you look into an assessment specific to dyslexia.
The neuropsychologist who did the testing will likely not release the actual test data to you as it can be misinterpreted by someone not qualified to do so. However, she may be willing to release a copy of the testing data to another neuropsychologist with a specialty in 2E, so long as you sign a release of information form allowing her to share the data.
@PurplePlum – there is no common, agreed standard for diagnosis of dyslexia. That is, different evaluators may uses different assessment instruments and arrive at different results, even different labels – as well as disagree on the meaning of the same set of testing. There was a huge amount of debate over this a couple of years ago with the DSM 5 revisions, and in the end the basic standard adopted by DSM 5 (for a learning disability, as they decided not to use the term dyslexia) would probably preclude diagnosis by many students in your daughter’s position, because they incorporated a standard that requires that the student skill level be significantly below grade level.
That doesn’t mean that you can’t or won’t get a diagnosis – it is just that it can be a hard path to negotiate, as even very severely dyslexic individuals may score too well on tests to qualify for a diagnosis when a narrow definition is employed.
Years ago I couldn’t get the schools interested in testing my son because he just didn’t perform badly enough --his standardized test scores in elementary school were in the 40-50% range, and the school was telling me that the special ed procedures were meant for kids performing in 30% range or below. (That really wasn’t correct info legally, but probably accurately reflected local practice). When we got help allowing my son to overcome his problems (primarily reading, at least that’s the part we addressed at the time) – his test scores shot up to 99th percentile. He’s actually very good at standardized tests, ended up a NM Finalist based on an un-prepped PSAT score. (No prep because knowing that he was dyslexic, it never occurred to me that he would score that well).
Given your d’s high ACT score – I’d expect the same is probably true for her. Her high scores make it difficult for psychologists and educators who are working with students who are struggling just to get the basics to understand that she could also have any sort of barrier – but the barrier is real, and keeping her from excelling to an even greater extent. The “perfectionist” argument doesn’t hold water.
In these matters you really need someone experienced in each specific diagnosis. I agree, it’s tough to find qualified practices.
I had a family member go through testing with similar results. This may be a little out of the blue and off track, but the problem was finally determined to be a “memory” issue which likely occurred from a previous concussion. You said your daughter is very active, could this be a possibility? She went to a neuro-psychiatrist and although had been diagnosed with ADHD previously, the bigger issue was the short term memory loss - she wasn’t able to retain much without significant extra time, writing down what she heard or read, etc.
As with dyslexia needing a specialist, have you gone through the ADHD testing? Again, it’s important to seek out someone who specializes in it. Hard to find. Check out add.org. for info about ADHD in general.
I agree with @calmom about the difficulty getting a firm dyslexia diagnosis in an older child. I could not get any help from our school district’s psychologist or reading specialist because they said they view dyslexia “educationally.” By that, they meant that they provide services for someone who performs very far below grade level, not someone who can compensate enough to perform at grade level on reading tests. As a high school freshman, my D said the school reading specialist tested her on a passage about earthquakes right after D had had two years of earth science (at two different schools). She said, mom of course I could answer the questions. I called around to various licensed psychologists who did educational testing and none said they tested for dyslexia. I finally found a local company that specialized in dyslexia tutoring and partnered with a psychologist. But still their report was couched in language about “probable dyslexia.” Plus they were in the business of selling dyslexia tutoring so I felt that gave them a bias in favor of diagnosis. But as a practical matter D performs much better if she has audio assignments or text-to-speech and I was finally able to get the school to put language in her 504 saying she should have that “when possible.” With that in her 504 I was able to get the College Board to agree to allow her MP3 audio or a reader for PSAT, SAT, AP’s. D had to take one of those Accuplacer tests for a dual enrollment trig/precalc class. The first time she took it she didn’t have accommodations and scored poorly. The second time (two weeks later) she took it she had a reader and her score tripled. I’m still not sure we have the most perfect, accurate diagnosis but at this point we’re trying to focus on what works for her.
@mom2aphysicsgeek: thank you for the link! It was extremely helpful. I am going thru the list of 2E experts now and it does seem like some indicate that they will consult/review tests already administered. I just need to absolutely make certain that the person I select is definitely, positively, an expert in 2E, as you have advised.
@thumper1–the assessor who tested DD had dyslexia assessment credentials–so I think she administered the correct texts. DD underwent a battery of assessments for dyslexia, ADHD, etc.–around 9 hours of testing. I think the problem is that DD’s results were so screwy and all over the map that I need a 2E expert to help me unravel what is going on. Now, the assessor did recommend that DD see a dyslexia reading therapist to see if that helps and that seems reasonable and I figure that could not hurt–so I am looking into that.
@Fishnlines29: Interesting point about the concussion. She has never had one as far as we know, but she does play soccer and has headed the ball obviously, so who knows if she’s ever had a mild one. DD was tested for ADHD as part of her recent assessment and she does not have it. I will bring up the concussion issue with whomever we get to look over DD’s recent results and will ask about memory issues.
@crossfitmama: you are spot on–I just heard back from DD’s assessor, who stated that she can’t release the tests to me; however, she said she would be happy to forward them to another health professional.
@calmom: thank you for your detailed post. I suspect that I will have a hard time getting DD’s school to take me seriously as well. Like your son, DD scores high and does not “appear” to have a problem. The biggest shocker to us came when we got back her PSAT10 results. She scored in the 1400’s (99 percentile) with absolutely no prep.–she got an almost perfect score on the math and of course the reading and writing was where she lost her points. Truthfully, I did not expect her to do as well as she did on the reading/writing sections. She gets all A’s and has perfect or close to perfect scores in math and science (currently 100 average in Chemistry and something like a 97 or 98 in PreCalc) and she does not study for these subjects. Her struggles are with English and history, where she busts her butt for A’s. She hates history because she says it’s all memorization and she says “she stinks at memorizing”. She is a concept-based learner. Give her a concept to wrap her mind around and she gets it immediately. Tell her to memorize a bunch of facts, and she is miserable. Of course no one at school sees her struggle with reading or trying to comprehend what she is reading in a quick manner. Until we find a better solution, I have been reading her history text book to her whilst she takes notes. If she has to read it and take notes on it, it takes her FOREVER and she is up till midnight. Her APWorld reading load is heavy (no surprise), and it is the bane of her existence (or so she says).
@Corinthian:I did not realize there was an MP3/audio accommodation for the SAT, etc. I wonder if it is too late for that for DD since I thought that I read that the 504 accommodations need to be utilized and in place for a certain amount of time prior to requesting an accommodation for standardized testing. I’ll look into that…
@PurplePlum Take a look at my post on a thread about College Board accommodations on the Learning Differences subforum: http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/discussion/comment/20228530/#Comment_20228530. I was seated next to our school’s 504 coordinator while she was online with the College Board SSD system uploading our request to reconsider the prior denial of Mp3 audio. All she did was upload the revised 504 which she had clarified slightly. I didn’t notice anything asking how often the accommodations were actually used or for how long. In practice, D has been getting audio books on her own or using a text-to-speech app for reading assignments, but had not actually had audio accommodations in classroom testing situations except when she had the Accuplacer test. Nevertheless, just by resubmitting with a slightly clarified 504 she was given the accommodations with about a 10 day turnaround on the request.