<p>I was looking at the Claremont Mckenna/Harvey Mudd dual degree program in economics and engineering, and it seems similar to most 3/2 engineering programs, but I feel like it gets rid of a lot of the cons of these types of programs. For example, instead of having to get up and leave before your senior year, you basically just move across campus. Also, you can begin taking engineering classes through the consortium prior to transferring, rather than having to completely overload your schedule with those classes for 2 straight years.</p>
<p>So what do you guys think? Just trying to make sure that I'm not completely off base here.
Thanks.</p>
<p>Oh and what is the difference between the management engineering major at Claremont McKenna and the Economics and Engineering program.</p>
<p>It was totally relevant! One of your questions was
</p>
<p>Yes, it does seem to negate most of the 3-2 problems. I don’t think most people know much about 3-2 programs. My son was interested in one, but only because he was so in love with the LAC. When Mudd accepted him, he dropped all thoughts of anything else.</p>
<p>Listen, dude, Mudd’s difficulty precludes even some dedicated majors from graduating on time or at all. Going into Mudd engineering (even as a 3-2) program half heartedly will get you destroyed.</p>
<p>And as an engineering alum, I’m trying to make you aware of the level of commitment you may be making. The curriculum is at an MIT/Caltech level, if not higher.</p>
<p>As for difficulty between the two… I didn’t even know that CMC had a engineering management major. I suspect that it is a management track, not technical track.</p>
<p>Wow. I read the question and was all set to launch on a comprehensive search of CMC’s site to pull up the EM curriculum and compare it with the 3/2 program… then I read your responses to rocketDA, a Mudd Engineering alum with a long and generous track record of helpful posts on this forum. I wish you luck, josh, but I don’t think I’ll be going out of my way to help you on this one.</p>
<p>Will tell you that Mudd and Mckenna are not different sides of a campus; they’re different colleges (though close to one another), with different curricula, grounds, and social structures. So you may be right about it being a little easier to handle than, say, moving across the state, but the transition between the two may have implications for prerequisites, room draw, social activities, &c. You have to get admitted to both colleges, which isn’t guaranteed. And as rocketDA pointed out, you may be underestimating the difficulty of jumping into Mudd Engineering without going through the preparation Mudders get as freshmen and sophomores.</p>
<p>Wow, guys. I’m glad we’re all being so mature about this. I came on here and asked a simple question, and all I got was some arrogant guy telling me about how difficult Mudd engineering is. I asked nothing about Mudd engineering’s difficulty. Nothing. Do you really think that anyone with half a brain would even consider attending a college which they knew nothing about? Mudd’s difficulty is the first thing that I found out about the school. Seriously, there are posts discussing how difficult Mudd is plastered all over this board. </p>
<p>Now I know that you think you’re being helpful, but you’re really not. Pointing out the obvious is really not helpful at all. As for me having a bad attitude, I definitely do right now, but before you posted that, I did not. I made one slightly sarcastic comment after you came into the thread and assumed that I was completely ignorant and that I was not truly interested in engineering without knowing anything about me, and you got super defensive about it. I’m sorry that you and geek_mom are so sensitive. Not to mention that afterwards I decided that I could probably have been a little nicer and thanked you for your post, but you just went right ahead and ignored that didn’t you.</p>
<p>Geek_mom, I really don’t feel like I was that rude to rocketDA. You mentioned that he has a track record of helpful posts on this forum, and I completely agree. Much of what he has said in other threads has been very helpful to me, but his response in this thread was certainly less than helpful. Also, I did not insult him nor do anything else particularly offensive. I made one slightly sarcastic comment about his (slightly rude and assumptive) post. Once again, I’m sorry that you’re so sensitive.</p>
<p>I apologize if this post sounds less than friendly, but I (and I assume most other people) don’t much appreciate people who make blanket judgments about other people without so much as a whit of information.</p>
<p>Oh and GeekMom63- Thank you. Your post was very helpful without coming across as arrogant or judgmental at all.</p>
<p>As a current Mudd frosh who’s taking hum classes off-Mudd (btw, I’m a CS major) I think this program sounds much better than other 3-2 programs because, as you said:
(1) You won’t have to transfer to another college
(2) You can take engineering classes in the “3” part</p>
<p>I know that other 3-2 programs have low enrollment because after doing the “3” part, few people are keen to do the “2” part. I think that if you’re considering both Econs and Engineering, going to CMC and taking classes at Mudd will be a good solution. After coming to college, you might even decide you want to be an Engineering major or decide you want to drop the Engineering program, and you will have good options for either path. I also think the Joint Science Program (CMC, Pitzer and Scripps) offers Engineering as a major – I know a Pitzer engineer. So you can major in Engineering through JSP or Mudd.</p>
<p>Unfortunately, it’s still likely you’ll be fairly overloaded with engineering courses. You’ll still have to take engineering 85, 101, 102, 106, 111, 112, 113, 121, 122, 123, and 124 with three engineering electives. I’m not sure what they mean by filling Mudd’s general education requirements too. It’s not possible to complete the entire core with those requirements, nor would you have the necessary knowledge to complete those courses without the core. I can only assume they are using CMC classes as substitutes, in which case you may be at a disadvantage to Mudd students.</p>
<p>Thanks fiona. Your thoughts about the option are basically identical to mine.</p>
<p>Braden- I may have overreacted to rocketDA and geek_mom, and I’ve cooled down a bit about it since I posted that, but I still think he was a little bit… well I can’t think of the word I’m looking for, but I think you get the gist of it.</p>
<p>Anyway. Yeah, it would still probably overload your schedule a bit, but I’m not sure it would be as bad as in a normal 3-2 program. Also I know that you can take at least a couple of those classes during your years at McKenna. Similarly to that, I’m fairly positive that you can take at least some of the “core” classes at Mudd instead of McKenna, though I don’t know how many. As far as fulfilling Mudd’s general education requirements, I believe that it’s just two extra humanities classes that you have to take while at Mudd. </p>
<p>I couldn’t find much to distinguish the Management-Engineering program from the economics and engineering on their website either. It did say the the Econ and Eng was an extension of their successful management engineering major, but there wasn’t a whole lot of information beyond that, which is why I was asking here and on the Claremont McKenna board. I was hoping that someone here might have some firsthand information for me. </p>
<p>“Wow, guys. I’m glad we’re all being so mature about this.”</p>
<p>Wow. Just wow. Be careful which bridges you burn before you even cross them.</p>
<p>“Braden- I may have overreacted to rocketDA and geek_mom, and I’ve cooled down a bit about it since I posted that, but I still think he was a little bit… well I can’t think of the word I’m looking for, but I think you get the gist of it.”</p>
<p>Well, I have a lot of things I could call you. </p>
<p>I’m going to put something out there: After going through a place like Mudd and seeing several of my classmates becoming depressed, dropping out, or taking 5 or 6 years to graduate, I think it is a little bit natural to be concerned about a prospective student who says that he is considering a management route or a joint engineering-management route. I have a lot of respect for CMC but I think it raises a red flag on the technical side of things… like would your heart be 100% into it when working 100 hour weeks at Mudd? If so, great! But I have no indicators in your post that that is where you heart is at.</p>
<p>Does this make sense? In as much as I am annoyed by your demeanor on here, I would rather not see you drop out of Mudd from not being revved up for it.</p>
<p>Which bridges I burn? Really? I can clearly see that you think you’re very special and important, but this seems to be taking it too far. Offending one alumni of a very small school on an anonymous message board hardly seems like it’s going to have much of an effect on anything. Especially when I could just make a new account and no one would have any idea who I was. And even if you knew exactly who I was, it still would not be that big of a deal. (unless you’re some psycho stalker, but I really doubt that)</p>
<p>“Well, I have a lot of things I could call you.”</p>
<p>Congratulations?</p>
<p>“But I have no indicators in your post that that is where you heart is at.”</p>
<p>Not to mention no indicators that that is not where my heart is at. Or anything about whether I’ve been accepted or even applied to either school. Anyone intelligent enough to get into either school should be able to make an informed decision about their major. In three years at Claremont McKenna, the person should have ample time to decide if that is where their heart is at, and if not, to do something else. Also, I’m sure they would have access to far more qualified advisors than yourself.</p>
<p>All I did was ask a simple question. You told me something completely unrelated to my question, assuming that I would not be intelligent enough to research the school myself. I made a joke about it, then felt bad and thanked you for your post. You could have taken the high road at this point, but instead decided to make your response very rude. This is exactly what I meant by your lack of maturity. You are a grown man, after all.</p>
<p>Oh stop it you guys. This is silly.
Why can’t either of you just ignore the other persons comment and drop it?
It’s not pertinent to the discussion anymore, and this is just an online forum after all. : )</p>
<p>neither of you didn’t really do anything wrong.
I say, blame the internet</p>
<p>When you write online, things can sound offensive when you didn’t mean to cuz you can’t hear the tone of the person (I had some experiences of such cases myself)
Just be as polite as possible online (that’s what i learned).
It’s very easy to offend people online.</p>
<p>From what I read, “Because that was totally relevant to my question…” doesn’t necessarily mean to offend anyone. It does sound offensive. But I can see that it probably isn’t on purpose. (cuz i’ve done something like that online by mistake once.) If i was in his shoes and got an angry response when it wasn’t meant to offend anybody, i wouldn’t be happy myself.</p>
<p>“Oh stop it you guys. This is silly.
Why can’t either of you just ignore the other persons comment and drop it?
It’s not pertinent to the discussion anymore, and this is just an online forum after all. : )”</p>
<p>Well at least someone has more maturity than me and rocketDA put together :P</p>
<p>Thank you too maruhan.</p>
<p>You’re both right and I’m done arguing. I don’t think there’s really a whole lot more to be said anyway.</p>
<p>Although one plus- the argument kept this thread at the top of the page and maybe I’ll get more people to read it and answer the question :)</p>
<p>Josh, sorry I know rocketDA can be brash, but you really are taking the wrong attitude to this, and this is as someone going to a totally different school but who has seen what serious students in engineering, etc do. Let me point this out:</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>This is NOT correct. You get into a school if it lets you in, that’s all. It means you probably had fairly good grades, etc, it does not mean you will not have tons of trouble navigating the school, and it does not mean you’ll not completely misinterpret the level of difficulty of a certain program and/or the reason it is so difficult. </p>
<p>When you’re comparing programs, one of which involves doing engineering at Mudd, I think understanding a successful engineering alum’s perspective on the difficulty and time-commitment is incredibly on topic, perhaps one of the most on topic things that could be said. </p>
<p>About changing your major – some people may attend a school specifically for a certain program, in which case it’s especially important to understand what you’re getting into.</p>
<p>I think a better thing to tell rocketDA to give details, since of course “Mudd engineering is difficult” is just a cautionary point, and contains no more info. I think an overview of what specifically distinguishes the program would be enlightening in making the contrast.</p>
<p>I don’t think you should worry about offensive vs. not offensive though that’s as maruhan said, unfortunate internet mania, but I do think there is a legitimate thing you should correct, which is that the comment about Mudd’s difficulty really shouldn’t feel out of place in context of what you’re asking, and no, people aren’t savvy enough to know what they’re doing just because they got in.</p>
that’s as maruhan said, unfortunate internet mania, but I do think there is a legitimate thing you should correct, which is that the comment about Mudd’s difficulty really shouldn’t feel out of place in context of what you’re asking, and no, people aren’t savvy enough to know what they’re doing just because they got in.</p>