I was sure that Barnard was my first choice, and if that doesn’t work out, I would apply NYU(CAS) for ED II, but as the deadline is approaching, I am hesitated. I plan on majoring in poli sci or history or both, and going to law school after graduation.
I love that Barnard is a liberal arts, but at the same time it is in a big city and shares resources with Columbia. The small class sizes and close relationships with profs offered in lac can really prepare me for law school. However, the one thing that I’m most worried about Barnard is that it’s an all women college. I’ve already been in an all girls high school for more than three yrs, so I definetely wouldn’t want to spend another four yrs without guys. I know Barnard is affiliated with Columbia, so there are guys walking around on campus. Also I read other posts saying Barnard women do make a lot of male friends from Columbia. Nevertheless, I am not really an outgoing, put-myself-out-there kind of person, so I afraid I would end up with other guys as mere acquaintances.
As for NYU, I love NYU! I love everything about it! I prefer the atmosphere in NYU over Barnard. Also I feel NYU has more resources and opportunities than Barnard.(correct me if I’m wrong) However, I am not that confident about its academics, since it is slipping down on the us news ranking and it is this huge school. I’ve heard students say they don’t get to see their profs much, instead TAs teach them. Is that true? Also does anybody know about the percentage of undergrad from NYU who went to law school? If the percentage is high, I guess I am fine with TAs teaching. In addition how strong are the poli sci and history departments there?
I would really appreciate any answers/suggestions/advices! A million thanks!
Why do you feel that you must choose now? Forget about ED. It is only for students who have an absolute clear first choice. Apply to both (and to some other places as well) in the regular decision/ rolling admissions/early action rounds instead. Then make your decision next spring when you have had a chance to compare all of your admissions and financial aid offers.
Barnard is literally across the street from Columbia, and you will take the majority of your classes at Columbia. It essentially is part of Columbia.
The people I have spoken with who have gone to NYU are not particularly complimentary about the academics or campus life there. However, the student in the acting school - Tisch - she is quite pleased with her situation.
Are your parents able to pay the full cost of attendance? NYU doesn’t promise to meet full need, so it is potentially disastrous to apply ED unless you are full pay. (Even someone with a 0 EFC might only get minimal aid from NYU).
My daughter’s had similar feelings as yours, preferring NYU slightly to Barnard – she was accepted to both, but NYU was unaffordable She also attended grad school at NYU-- plus had friends at NYU when she was an undergrad. In hindsight she is very glad that she attended Barnard, and thinks her one-time preference for NYU was naive and misguided— too much focus as a 17-year-old on social life, not enough on academics. She pretty much despised NYU during her 3 years as a grad student … basically the administration and bureaucracy was a constant frustration.
I agree with others – don’t apply ED if you aren’t confident of your choices, but on the academic end of things, you will probably find Barnard more challenging and rewarding, if you get accepted.
Financial aid won’t be a problem, since I’m not applying for it. As for the administration and bureaucracy at NYU, could you expand that a little bit? Thanks a lot!
Just that my daughter found it cumbersome and inflexible.
At Barnard she positive experiences with the administration & developed personal friendships with various Deans.
At Barnard the administration has 2500 students to worry about, and everyone concentrated on a small campus. NYU has 57.000 students, and buildings spread out over multiple urban blocks. So that alone will tend to foster a different type of environment.
Hey, current NYU student here. I feel like we sometimes get a bad rep. The facts are that yes, NYU is expensive and offers very little aid and yes, we are a GIGANTIC school, so obviously classes can be big. Also, because it’s so big, it’s true to say that nothing is quite as flexible.
Basically, they’re just vastly different experiences. Barnard is a lot smaller and not quite in the city the way NYU is, and that changes everything from class size to social life. Also, Barnard is a liberal arts college, whereas although NYU has a liberal arts curriculum, it functions as a big university.
Barnard is higher ranked than us, though. NYU slipped in the rankings this year due to a paperwork error but regardless, Barnard is ranked higher. However, that doesn’t mean that NYU isn’t a great school–our academics are still strong, believe me. Everyone I know is committed to their academics and excited to be here and learn. Even though I’ve seen it on CC a lot, I’ve never actually heard the thing about never seeing your professors from anyone who is actually here. Even in the big lectures, it’s always the professors who teach.
With the big school also comes a lot of resourcges. Our internship opportunities alone are amazing. That being said, Barnard is technically a part of Columbia, so you get Ivy-level resources and the Ivy name. That’s important.
Also, that difference in ranking is reflected in acceptance rate, so. Take that into account.
I know people who turned down Columbia for NYU, UChicago, Cornell, even Yale. It’s a unique university for a unique college experience that you won’t find anywhere else. You’ll get a great education either way, even if Barnard is ranked higher. Also, people aren’t kidding when they tell you it’s all about fit. Choose the college that you truly feel like you’ll be happiest at. If that’s really NYU, go for it.
ALSO: One last thing on the subject of law: NYU pre-law is pretty strong, since NYU Law is such a good school. NYU undergrads have opportunities to sit in on law school classes, talk and meet with actual lawyers, etc. I don’t know the exact numbers of how many go on to law school, but I doubt that it’s a low number.
This entirely depends on the major but is very likely untrue. The average Barnard student will take the majority of her classes at Barnard. Some Barnard students in certain majors - particularly math (which has a joint department with Columbia) and computer science (offered through Columbia) will take all of their major courses at Columbia, but major courses only make up around 40 of the total ~120 credits you have to take to graduate. Even CS and math majors will still probably take about half their classes at Barnard. A political science or history major would take most of their classes at Barnard, with the option to take some classes at Columbia if they so wished.
I went to a women’s college. Going to a women’s college - especially a women’s college across the street from a co-ed university - is very different from going to a girls’ high school. It’s a college, not a convent Barnard is in one of the largest cities in the world, so even if it was not across the street from Columbia you still wouldn’t be spending “four years without guys.” There will be young men all over the place. But given that Columbia is literally across the street, this is definitely not something you have to worry about. Seeing young men will be as simple as registering for a Columbia class or participating in a Columbia club or social organization. Barnard students can participate in almost all Columbia student groups and vice versa. You will see plenty of young men.
As a side note, if you are not a “put-yourself-out-there” kind of person, you run the risk of only have acquaintances of either gender. Making and maintaining friendships in adulthood is all about learning to put yourself out there a little bit and working to maintain those relationships.
Well, maybe. Barnard has lots of resources through being affiliated with Columbia, and being a strong LAC in its own right. But NYU does have some resources and opportunities you might not get otherwise, especially if you are interested in the arts (with Tisch right there) or some of the other things NYU offers that they don’t have uptown. So, it’s possible. But remember that opportunities are not just about quantity but also quality of what you want.
Don’t worry about USNews rankings…first of all, NYU is ranked in the top 50 universities nationwide. In a country with 2,000 universities, that puts them in the top 2.5% of universities. Second of all, U.S. News predicates its numerical rankings on very small differences in their scores. NYU is a school at which the average student scored between a 1330 and a 1520 on the SAT and had above a 3.5 GPA in high school. It’s an excellent school and a top research university.
Are you going to get a higher percentage of TAs teaching? Yes, because NYU is a research university. The professors are hired primarily to do research, and because there are nearly 60,000 students the classes are going to be large and they are going to need assistance with the classes. That doesn’t mean that the TAs mostly teach the classes, though; usually the way the classes are structured is that a professor teaches the lecture and the TAs may head discussion sections and lab classes (for science classes) that are smaller groups of 20-30 students. Sometimes, advanced PhD students may teach introductory classes in your major, while the smaller upper-level seminars are taught by professors.
But just because they’re TAs doesn’t mean the quality is poor. NYU has top 10 political science and history classes, and so the doctoral students there will be some of the best doctoral students in the world in your field. They are doing research and scholarship right alongside the top professors. The advanced doctoral students who may be teaching some intro classes are typically at least 3-4 years into their PhD programs and usually done with their coursework and exams, and are writing dissertations. Honestly, they are not that far from being professors themselves anyway. Some of them are very competent and caring teachers who will have more time for you than their supervisors.
This is not what you want to worry about. The percentage of students who go onto law school can be a result of a lot of factors - how many students even wanted to go to law school in the first place? For example, you may have one school where 30% of the student body goes to law school, but really 60% wanted to go and only half of them got in. Or you can have another school where only 15% of the student body wanted to go to law school, but 80% of all the students who wanted to go to law school were admitted to top schools.
What you are more concerned about is do students from that university go onto top law schools when they want to? Students from NYU go onto top law schools all the time.
Barnard is in one of the largest cities in the world, so even if it was not across the street from Columbia you still wouldn’t be spending “four years without guys.” There will be young men all over the place. But given that Columbia is literally across the street, this is definitely not something you have to worry about. Seeing young men will be as simple as registering for a Columbia class or participating in a Columbia club or social organization. Barnard students can participate in almost all Columbia student groups and vice versa. You will see plenty of young men.