<p>So I just arrived home to 5-6 of my mother's friends trying to convince me that there is no good in getting an engineering major, especially for a girl such as me. (One was a female engineer)</p>
<p>They brought up the price ceiling, hard work, stress, how money is in the medical field, how immigrants do engineering b/c it's less language-focused, how its bad once I get married and have children, etc etc etc</p>
<p>I have tentatively chosen Engineering (thinking about Chemical) but still remain highly undecided. Please weigh in. I'd like to see both sides of the argument.</p>
<p>Do note that medicine is a cartel where existing doctors try to limit the number of total doctors at all costs to push the cost of medicine as high as possible. Ask yourself this: are you willing to go to school for 10 years to make money off the suffering of others? If you’re into medicine for the money, just do finance or math and become a quant, there’s thousands of easier ways to make money for people that can do math beyond adding and subtracting.</p>
<p>If you’re into medicine to “help people”, note this: a surgeon can save 1 person. total number of lives saved per year is not going to exceed 700. a civil or chemical engineer can save millions by designing sanitation and water treatment systems and research on improved systems. 95% of medical research is statistical garbage.</p>
<p>The whole concept of predicting the future benefit of a given career path is absurd. Considering the abstract, and highly complex nature of the subject, I would really only value the opinion of someone who’s experienced this stuff first hand. So, has your “mother’s friend” experienced any of these things first hand? Is she even an engineer? If not, I wonder why she’s passing her third rate opinions off as fact.</p>
<p>For the purpose of helping you make your choice, let me address some of the things she has spoken about.</p>
<p>“They brought up the price ceiling” - Paid less? idk what this means.</p>
<p>“hard work, stress” - I guarantee any job you enjoy doing will not be harder or more stressful than one you don’t enjoy.</p>
<p>“how money is in the medical field” - Why consider medical when the real money is in arms dealing? Or kidnapping? It’s all relative. Doctors pay more up front for schooling, and get paid more to compensate (and because HMO’s are the mafia). That being said, I’d rather not make a living being around sick and dying people.</p>
<p>“how immigrants do engineering b/c it’s less language-focused” - There are a good deal of foreigners in the engineering field, but I don’t know if it’s because it’s less “language focused”. Besides, working well in groups and communicating are essential to getting any large endeavor completed.</p>
<p>“how its bad once I get married and have children” - lol what? idk what this means.</p>
<p>Do me a solid and throw a shoe at your mom’s friend the next time you see her.</p>
<p>This is what they were saying:
-price ceiling: good pay right when you get out, but it’s hard to raise your income past a certain level, i.e. you won’t be making bank ever. my dad, an EE, has brought this up as well.
-hard work, stress: will constantly have to learn new things, “carry a book in hand” esp. if i decide to do CS
-how money is in the medical field: not necessarily dr/pharmacist, but anything relating to healthcare, medicine etc. mom brought up medical information systems or something
-how immigrants do engineering b/c it’s less language-focused: this was brought up by the female engineer. she herself is an immigrant and has been working as an mech engineer her whole life. she said how first-generationers such as me should do better than their generation, esp. because we know the English language extremely well and do not have to do math/science focused stuff. she talked about the stress and hard work, and sexism. oh and outsourcing
-how its bad once I get married and have children- not sure what they were going on about</p>
<p>they recommended: math, architecture, pharmacist, accountant and some other stuff i forgot</p>
<p>About the immigrant lady: who says you had to work in the US? go where the money flows.</p>
<p>I’ll just tell you right now, as a former bio major: there is no money in medicine except for 5 types of people:</p>
<p>unionized nurses.
doctors.
pharmacists.
the CEOs of major pharmaceutical corporations.
the lawyers they hire.</p>
<p>that’s it. Pharma treats their other employees like crap. The lowest average salary among “sciences” (don’t know the proper term for biology now) is biology. I worked at a pharmaceutical company before. It used zero biology knowledge. All you need to know is chemistry, chemistry and more chemistry. Some basic engineering knowledge would be nice too but I didn’t have the training, thanks to my unquantitative and memorization based education.</p>
<p>Engineering and physical sciences expand people’s minds. Even if you end up scrubbing floors, you’ll be a better floor scrubber than the premed bio people or the liberal arts people. I noticed an immediate difference in o-chem lab between the chemists and chemical engineers who were there because they liked chemistry, vs. the biology premed people who go there because they want to join the US medicine cartel. the chemists and chemical engineers even wash glassware better than the bio premed people.</p>
<p>Pick a major that interests you not one that anyone else tell you is good. If your not really interested in the major your going into it will take a heavy toll on your grades. I know of plenty of kids who started at a major they were told was good for them only to have it drag their GPA down before they switch to another that they enjoy. </p>
<p>Especially the more difficult majors(Or time-consuming would be a description) will chew up and spit out kids who aren’t really interested in the major they get into.</p>
<p>^I’m not really interested in any major. I think that engineering type stuff would fit me best, but I don’t know. I’m good at math and science but meh. The thing is, if I want to switch into eng. afterward it would be hard if I didn’t enter in it, esp. at top schools.</p>
<p>Your mother bringing her gaggle of companions to persuade you in a decision that is yours and yours alone shows what level of esteem she holds. I dealt with the same thing.</p>
<p>Disregard females, acquire currency; please parson the popular culture reference.</p>
<p>Engineering is a tough major and you are correct, it is helpful to start that path entering college. The good thing about engineering is that it opens many windows of job opportunities especially for a women. There are countless jobs where engineers are used but in reality it is more of a project management, procurement or management role. I have two male nephews who both got aero-space engineering degrees, both had job offers prior to graduation and one of them took a job that has nothing to do with aero-space. What engineering shows employers is that you can solve problems. With that said it should be of interest to you, don’t go after the major unless you are interested. If you are good at math and science then you should do well. My daughter is currently majoring in mechanical engineering/minor business administration. She doesn’t want to do heads down design work but with that degree she can go technical or what she really wants is management and business. I work in a very large corporation and you can’t get your foot in the door even to do procurement engineering without the degree. The best thing is to talk with the colleges, find out how good they are at getting students internships. After completing internships you will then get a feeling for what type of job you would like. I wouldn’t get stuck on going after ‘the best engineering college’ out there but take into consideration do you like the environment, do you see yourself there. The other thing that is important is does the school have a rooming situation where they group women in engineering together? This is helpful. With my daughter in her first year of college almost every sad story I am hearing reference her friends are kids who went after the hardest school they got accepted to, as in top name school, and they didn’t take the time to really investigate if they liked the ‘whole’ environment. Good Luck.</p>
<p>Price Ceiling - Yes, there is a price ceiling for being a design/development/grunt engineer but then again, a senior engineer’s salary is way above the national average in the USA. Remember, you REALLY only need a B.S. degree and you can pretty much graduate from your “State U.” and get hired in engineering.</p>
<p>Hard work/Stress - I don’t know about that. Several engineering areas have been listed as LEAST stressful: systems engineering and software engineering. As far as constantly having to learn new things, that trait will be in almost every field. Again, I go back to only needing a B.S. degree for a mid-tier school.</p>
<p>Medical Field - Of course there is more money in medicine. You also need 8 years of schooling and super-high GPA’s just to get into the industry. On top of that, there will be more competition for jobs.</p>
<p>I know as far as speaking for myself, I like getting an offer for pretty much every interview I go on due to high-demand/low-supply in my area of I.T./software engineering. Is it doctor’s income or V.P. of sales money???..No, but I do not have the “stress” worrying about finding a new job either. It’s good knowing that as long as I keep my skills up to date, I have a check coming in every-other Friday (or 15th & 30th depending on employer).</p>
<p>Now they MAY be right about Math because with a Math degree, you can pretty much do most jobs BUT as I always say when the Math major is brought up on this board…I AM VERY BIASED, LOL!</p>
<p>I find it hilarious that someone would say engineerig is bad if you have a family and kids, and then turn around and suggest medicine. I guess they missed the part about being on call and working crazy hours and not seeing your family much as a doctor.</p>
<p>unihopeful, why don’t you ask all of the CEOs, VPs, and high level managers with engineering degrees about the “price ceiling”. You do realize that something like 21% of CEOs of fortune 500 companies have engineering degrees. Every career has a “price ceiling” and in fact, an engineer’s is higher than most other professions aside from maybe surgeons and certain areas of law.</p>
<p>The repsonse you got from your mom’s friends (aside from the engineer) is not surprising. Society in general thinks that doctors are the be all and end all and any other profession is useless. I blame countless TV shows and movies that unrealistically glorify the medical profession. To make it worse, the average person does not even know what engineering is. I kid you not, I know people that think a mechanical engineer is the same thing as a mechanic.</p>
<p>The suggestion to do accounting or architecture seems odd. Engineers out earn both of these professions on average so I guess they have an even lower “price ceiling”. And what about “immigrants” doing accounting or architecture or pharmacy, even medicine? This happens too you know. What makes you think accounting or information systems or architecture couldn’t be outsourced? I’m guessing most of the people telling you to not do engineering, wouldn’t last one day in an engineering class and probably don’t even really know what engineering is. </p>
<p>The bottom line, do what YOU want to do. If you enjoy engineering, then go for it. Engineers earn much more than the average person and an engineering degree by no means limits career opportunities. Everyone always seems to bring up the “salary cap” of engineers. The truth is people get paid what they are worth. You could start a company or become a CEO. Someone working as a general engineer their entire career will not be making a million dollars, but the average engineer makes more than the average accountant, architect, and practically any other undergraduate major. Trust me, engineering is not a bad major.</p>
<p>price ceiling: There is a “price ceiling” in every profession, and for engineering it is higher than most. At my company, I know of starting engineers making $60k+ with a BSEE, and senior engineers making $250k+. I consider that a pretty good ceiling. Want to go higher? MD, JD, MBA, entrepreneur, athlete, or performer.</p>
<p>hard work, stress: Depends a lot on the specialty you choose. My first engineering job was very easy and very laid back - work your forty, have a lot of laughs, go for drinks after. Other positions have had me working significant overtime, and studying the newest research whenever I had the chance. Again, this is not unique to engineering.</p>
<p>how money is in the medical field: There is great money in the medical field, but only in certain areas and often at a mugh higher cost in time and money. Plus (and this is very important) you have to want to do it - I have met very few people who were able to be financially successful in fields they didn’t care for. Conversely, a know quite a few people who failed in fields they chose for the money.</p>
<p>how immigrants do engineering b/c it’s less language-focused: It’s not a language thing. There is an issue with outsourcing and with foreign engineers coming to this country for jobs, but that does not mean that US engineers are screwed. There are many positions where they prefer or require Americans or at least native English speakers. Plus, as a domestic engineer you would be eligible for a number of programs - for example, there are doctoral fellowships available only to US citizens in engineering.</p>
<p>Wow, that salary ceiling sure is harsh on chemical engineers, eh? It sucks how people with all the other degrees are able to surpass engineers later on in their careers.</p>
<p>The “salary cap” is a myth perpetuated by business majors attempting to justify their choice of the easier path through college. What they are saying is technically correct - yes, if you stay an engineer your whole life, you may only reach 100k. However, most engineers don’t stay engineers forever: engineers are prime candidates for moving into management positions, and there’s really no limit to how far you can go. Saying “engineering has a salary cap” is the same as saying “being a medical resident has a salary cap” or “being an entry-level business associate has a salary cap” - yes indeed, they do, but unless you stay in that spot your entire career, your pay is gonna rise.</p>
<p>That’s primarily dependent on geographical location, Andrewsky. $100k in NYC will barely secure you a “working class” lifestyle while the same $100k a few hours west (e.g. Eastern PA) will provide you a “middle class” lifestyle.</p>
<p>Fortunately, in the US, any family making $200k or more will have a decent lifestyle. Unfortunately, the % of Americans earning $200k or more is small.</p>
<p>Architecture?!? Architects get paid LESS than structural engineers, and I can guarantee you their stress level is higher. And a lot of them end up designing residences, a thankless job. </p>
<p>By the way, I’m a female structural engineer, and it’s worked out really well for me. My husband and I run our company out of our home, so I can spend time with our kids and run them around to music lessons and sports practices. And a company just made my husband an offer well in excess of 100k, that he has counter-offered for even more.</p>
<p>NYC is an extreme case. There are only a few areas in the country that are that expensive, and it’s easy to avoid those! There are plenty of engineers around, even in rural states such as Maine.</p>
<p>Keep talking that way, Enginox! We have one of the best kept secrets in the country, and we don’t mind keping it that way. It’s an amazing place to live. Seriously, when I walk down the driveway to get the mail, I look around at the beautiful woods and think, “I can’t believe I get to live here!”</p>
<p>The correct term is “Mainers” or “Mainiacs!”</p>
<p>It did surprise us that the cost of living here is fairly high. 25% higher than Dallas, for example.</p>
We have one of the best kept secrets in the country, and we don’t mind keping it that way. It’s an amazing place to live. Seriously, when I walk down the driveway to get the mail, I look around at the beautiful woods and think, “I can’t believe I get to live here!”</p>