Engineering and Film Double major?

College Majors Engineering Majors
21

Well engineering isn’t my “fall back” but I understand what you mean, my goal is to be able to purse both careers. But i truly enjoyed the advise @Lakemom. I just emailed 2 alumni and I’m gonna wait for their responses.

So just to clarify I want to get a BS in Mechanical engineering and a MS in Visualization in 5 years. I’ll talk to alumni about my situation and hear their input.

Thanks for everyone’s input. If you have any advise or problems i’m not aware of, please tell me ! I appreciate it so much!

22

That sounds good Good luck!

23

@lessonwitch2,

First, see below - you should not be looking at any job that says “technician”. Second, engineering firms don’t make a habit of hiring temporary engineers, it costs too much to bring them up to speed if you are just going to see them disappear in a year.

Yes. Technicians generally have associate’s degrees or less, and are more likely to be hired part-time. Engineering is almost always full-time work. I have worked as both, and they are extremely different.

Only if they really screwed up. Seriously, you are describing the worst case scenario, not the norm.

Yes, they will think you are waiting for your big break, especially if you have a double major or grad degree. If you have a grad degree, it is unlikely that anyone will hire you in a significantly different field than that degree. Bear that in mind if you go from a BS in engineering straight into an MS in visualization - you will have an extremely hard time getting an engineering job after that!

As a student you have a lot more flexibility in your schedule AND are probably not working in film making to professional standards and schedule. There is not a ton of work out there in filmmaking, and most of it goes to those who can drop everything to do it.

24

@Lakemom thank a bunch!

@cosmicfish

Okay, i see your point in avoiding work as a technician, but isn’t it a way to get into a company? By temporary, I don’t mean working as a technician for that company for only one year and leave. When I said “temporary” I ment will these kinds of jobs not exisit 6 years from now. I would hope that I could go from a part time technician to a full time engineer since i’m qualified for entry level engineering work |_____| Especially since I see some job listings that want an engineer to start part time and move to full time? I tend to see it in smaller engineering firms they their seem to be a good number of them.

Would It be a bad Idea to look for openings that ask to start part time and move to full time? Or perhaps if I get a job offer out of college, I request to start part time?

Also, about how long does it take someone to find their ideal career? How long did it take you after college? Because I wanted to prepare for the worst case. (Prepare for the worse, you know?)

Well, since I won’t go about the double major anymore (it was really only in the OP so I could get alot of people to come with the cool title) I don’t think I’d put on my resume the MS of visualization unless it is for an engineering design job. But didn’t you say yourself you didn’t know what a “visualization” major was? Since most people won’t assume animation. And if you google it you’d find things like architecture and construction sciences. (Since it is in the school of architecture) Because my ideal engineering job would involve a good amount of designing. Weather industrial design or mechanical design.

Picture yourself as an employer who has never heard of Visualization before. How would you response to seeing an engineer with it on their resume? A fully qualified entry level engineer?

"

  • Will my bosses think I’m waiting for my “big film break” if I have alot of qualifications to be an actual engineer? Like engineering experience, or a degree from a top tier school,or my portfolio of completed engineering projects

Yes, they will think you are waiting for your big break, especially if you have a double major or grad degree. If you have a grad degree, it is unlikely that anyone will hire you in a significantly different field than that degree. Bear that in mind if you go from a BS in engineering straight into an MS in visualization - you will have an extremely hard time getting an engineering job after that!
"

Visualization is an Architecture / Computer Science degree. Is it really that far off from a normal engineer? They just happen to have an animation elective track. (they also have construction, design, CAD etc…)

Really? It would hurt me in the job search just becuase my masters doesn’t say engineering? It is 4 classes away from being the same things as a non-thesis Computer Science masters. Its 6 classes away from being a non theisis computer engineering degree. Couldn’t I just not show my masters, but still put that I was working at an animation company?

If that is the case, would you reccomend I use A&M’s BS/MS engineering fast track to complete the 4 classes during my BS, and earn 2 masters? I’d take the same amount of time.

Quesitions summary

No way to summarize this part

I don’t think my schedule is flexible at all, but I have no way of knowing. If you want you can check my previous post to see just how air tight my schedule is. Your right their, I don’t know if I’m working on “professional standards”. But I do work. I do get paid. And regardless of if i’m paid for working on professional standards, the kind of film making i’m doing now, is the kind of freelance film making I want to do. I have worked on real full length feature film movies sets (not nearly alone, but still with credits) and half the time its hell, but the other half is really fun. And very little of the drama came from the schedule. Because aside from shooting, pre and post production seem to be flexible. All while maintaining a decent social life. I haven’t met a Pre or Post production worker who had to “drop everything to do it” before. What kind of situation would that happen? Normally the Editor (IDK about animator) gets twice as much time to edit the footage then to shoot it.(a 2 day shoot, means 4 days of editing)

What kind of situation would that happen? Where an editor must drop everything? (aside from deadlines, b/c deadlines could be handled with vacation days if it was really pushing it. Don’t a lot of editors(freelance and studio) work a 2nd full time jobs?

Summary of questions
-Would It be a bad Idea to look for openings that ask to start part time and move to full time? Or perhaps if I get a job offer out of college, I request to start part time?

  • Picture yourself as an employer who has never heard of Visualization before. How would you response to seeing an engineer with it on their resume? A fully qualified entry level engineer? (as you said, people won’t immediately understand what it is. And if you google it you see it is an architecture / computer science program. It takes a lot of research to find out that animation is even an elective)
  • Couldn’t I just not put the masters on a resume? Because the point of the degree is for the guaranteed job right after?
  • Would you suggest getting 2 masters (one computer engineering and one visualization) because it would take the same amount of time.
25

Generally, no. It is an almost completely different skill set with completely different qualifications and expectation. Doctors don’t start as paramedics, pilots don’t start as flight attendants, and engineers don’t start as technicians. I was an exception only because I got my engineering degree later.

If they offer and you want to try it, go ahead. But I would be wary of asking, as someone hiring I would question your dedication.

It takes as long as it takes. My wife got her degree in education, more than a decade later she abandoned teaching to get a grad degree in archaeology. You take your best guess, give it a good try, and if you are certain you want to try something else, go for it. Just be aware that you can only really do this a few times before educational and employment opportunities start to dry up.

I would ask what the heck it was, look into it, and wonder about your dedication to engineering. I would ask you to explain how that skill set makes you a better engineer for the work I need completed, and I think that would be a hard task in the interview. Again, someone who goes through all that work for another degree is sending a strong signal that they don’t want to be an engineer, and visualization is far enough from conventional software engineering that it would be a difficult match.

You could, but that would be difficult and would be considered dishonest (and a termination offense at some companies). You would have to explain the gap in your resume regardless.

I don’t advise degree-collecting. I advise figuring out what one thing you want to do professionally, and getting the degrees you need to do that. I can’t see any combination of degrees that makes your dual-career plan any more likely to succeed.

In my (secondhand) experience, films, be they short, long, artistic, or commercial, come with deadlines. Someone has to pay for it all to happen, and they have a schedule. Deviating from it costs MORE money.

Perhaps you could find some work that you can shoehorn around a typical full-time job, but it would be limited and difficult. I am sure that there are editors and artists who have full-time jobs, but they are at the lower end of the spectrum in pay and professional success, and that is not a great place to target.

26

(how do you guys make those quote boxes)

Would It be a bad Idea to look for openings that ask to start part time and move to full time? Or perhaps if I get a job offer out of college, I request to start part time?
If they offer and you want to try it, go ahead. But I would be wary of asking, as someone hiring I would question your dedication.

Even if I was being hired by the company I Co Oped at? You’d think they would know me after being there for a year. Is it unreasonable to say I’d like to build experience while working a 2nd job to pay down college debt straight out of College temporarily and I have no problem with working over time?

Picture yourself as an employer who has never heard of Visualization before. How would you response to seeing an engineer with it on their resume? A fully qualified entry level engineer?
I would ask what the heck it was, look into it, and wonder about your dedication to engineering. I would ask you to explain how that skill set makes you a better engineer for the work I need completed, and I think that would be a hard task in the interview. Again, someone who goes through all that work for another degree is sending a strong signal that they don’t want to be an engineer, and visualization is far enough from conventional software engineering that it would be a difficult match.

If you look it up, it is an architecture and Computer science degree that teaches to bring ideas and thoughts to life. IF they ask why, I’d say it makes me a better design engineer and point out the alumni who major in it to become better 3D engineering designers. (Since my ideal engineering job would involve a lot of designing) If they don’t trust it, I would direct them to A&M’s engineered “Robot army” that the visualization major will be working on till 2025. I’d also point out the double major engineers from A&M that gto a BS in Visualization, and an MS in engineering and how they are successful civil engineers. I could show them my thesis that would likely be about human interface and engineering graphics. (That is the research I want to do)

Would that be bad? at the very least it would get me an interview, just to ask that question right?

Explain the gap year? Dishonest? How? Do I put every certificate and educational milestone i’ve hit on my resume. I have an associate degree in biblical studies online at Liberty University. Do I need to put that there? I am a Adobe Premier Specialist, and a Cinematographer in training and Microsoft office specialist, do I need to put that there? Along with hwat ever jobs I work in college, along with my minors and stuff? Do I need to put everything I’ve done, even if its irreverent to the job? Could you explain how its “dishonest”? Because (believe me I tried) my engineering accomplishments alone are enough to fill 2 pages with a narrow margin. Do employees expect me to write everything? Or just what they need for me to do the job? (answer as many as you can)

And it take 6 monthes to earn this degree, and no other education events follow it. So how will they find a “gap”? Their is no educational event after it, so how would they know to look for it (unless they call up Texas A&M and I allow them to read my graduate experience) If they expect engineers to leave college with a bachelors, why would they investigate that 6 month gap? (but they would see my visualization minor)

Doesn’t this mean the employee may want to hire me if they will go though all that effort? At least want an interview? Because if they ask in an inteview, I would point out it is to help my career as a design engineer. But if they ask why its there, whats wrong with saying I wanted a guaranteed design job out of college? Its true and would explain the reason I would still be working at the animation company at the time of application… for under a year. Is that a red flag? Do employers look down on anyone who works in an industry out of their major even if its only for one year?

2 masters. Well that was more of a playful idea. IT was to point out how similar it fits into engineering degrees. The Idea was that if I did a double major, it would only put up the engineering masters. But I have no intention on doing that now… I’m still in high school.

I’ve been around full time editors and the reason they work 40+ hours is because they are working on 3-4 different projects at once. (I think that is disloyalty, but it pays the bills so…) I would only be working on one project at a time. And I won’t take ridiculous dead lines that I can’t meet. Such as if i have 3 days to edit 30 hours of raw footage. I would just never take that kind of job since its is ridiculous.(and any producer or director who demands that will understand that that is ridiculous) because that requires more than 90 hours of work in 72 hours ( 3 24 hour days.) The people I know that are in the industry say that the rule of thumb is that the editor gets twice the amount of time it took you to shoot the footage. And I won’t take a job or network with anyone who does.

Is their something wrong with me just not taking a job with a deadline I know I can’t meet?

27

How to make quotes in CC http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/community-forum-issues/319819-how-do-you-quote-someone.html

28

[ quote=lessonwitch2]Quote here [ /quote]

THats so cool, thanks @Lakemom !

29
30

Exhausting reading all this, just imagine the exhaustion of taking all these clases … I’m an ME, I don’t know how you would apply this to visualization other than I can make a few minute “movies” in my cad program that change color. graphics on computers is comp sci, possibly some work for graphics card designers (EE)s. We could design some sets or maybe that harness thing that let Sandra Bullock pretend she was in space in Gravity.

If your dream is the film industry, find a school that has a good program and go for it. ME is a really tough degree to get in 4 years with full focus … and then ME is not a backup degree to let you work for a few hours a week at $50 an hour, that would much more likely be programming. CAD modeling isn’t really an engineering job unless you are designing something using engineering principles. Coding skills … yes, part time work is possible.

To put it even more top level, while engineering is a creative field, in that you are seeking new and better ways to solve problems, most of us aren’t artists … or even particularly drawn to or skilled in creative arts. We use physics and math … does that really fulfill your creative needs.

The robot army will be 90% physics based with a tiny bit of effort to make it look humanoid. Robotics is a lot of EE and some ME … but are you building and then filming the robot army or just doing some virtual reality to build a robot army from a bunch of claymation things …

31

hey @PickOne1! I like your screen name!

I hope I didn’t make this sound like a yelling match. But after rereading the post, I’d like to apologize @cosmicfish I hope I didn’t seem too rude. I was pretty startled by factors about the job search that I was unaware of. and that was the reason I started this post, so I’m sorry.

I wouldn’t say working in the film industry is my dream. Its was just a hobby that I accidentally picked up while in high school and would like to continue it after. If salary and hours were ignored, I would still choose engineering as a main career. If I only worked in the film industry I would surely go crazy. It isn’t my passion, its just a fun hobby. And I’ve noticed that its easier be paid for the hobby if you shortly start out as a full time worker, and then move to freelance. hoping that I can work when I want to work. I hoped that freelancing would a good artistic outlet.

But It is a bit different from My dream is to be a industrial or material design engineer after going though other forms of engineering. My passion lies more in solving problems. I don’t love drawing, but I don’t hate it either. I REALLY love math and science. The problem was animating and film making has next to no real problem solving situations, so it can be tedious on occasion. That’s why I only would like to freelance it… The start of every project is really fun… but it can be seem boring after doing several back to back projects for too long… at least for me.

((probably should have said that in OP… live and learn))

@PickOne1

In that situation I’d like to be apart of the construction of the robots and deal with the production of the robot parts and I would still try to make it look humanoid. Not like a human replica, but similar to a crash test dummy.

32

When I was hiring engineers, I was looking for the best prepared graduates who really wanted to be engineers. That meant more classes than just the minimum for the degree (and also meant few, if any, double majors unless the double was really close). If I didn’t think you would stick it out long enough for my company to recoup it’s investment in you and then some, consider your resume round-filed. The investment was more than just the hiring and relocation costs but your taking up a more senior engineer to train you. I would say that about 90% of my engineering knowledge came from learning on the job, so the training my company invested in me was substantial. (it wasn’t because I did learn enough in college. I graduated from a top 5 engineering school. It meant that there is so much more to learn in engineering than you learn from any college)

Choose what you want to do and go for it. Don’t waste your time waffling about where you interests lie. The middle road is the road to nowhere.

33

I guess I need to try both industries a little bit more. However, my ideal situation would still be getting a engineering job to start part time, so I could get animating experience, and then shortly after move to full time engineering while freelance animating. Its always possible to start right out of college as a full time engineer while doing freelance animating, I just knew if I did I wouldn’t be paid to do it from the start. I would still do it in my free time just as a hobby.

@HPuck35

But now I’m hearing I shouldn’t do both period? I have to ask, if I want to be an engineer, am I not allowed (without my employer having trust issues) preform a non engineering hobby, regardless of pay? Should I rethink engineering as a career if an average employer would have issues with my non engineering activities?

34

Oh wait, 2nd Question,

I’ve always intended (for financial reasons) that after college, it would be wise to work a 2nd part time job for the first 1-3 years to help pay off college debt and save. Is that not a practical Idea for an engineer / animator / any-full-time-stem-career?

35

What does it mean that in all of my long life, in which I’ve heard of so very many things, that I’ve never heard of anybody doing this?

It means that it is unlikely to happen.

There is a danger: If you dabble in two areas it will compromise your ability to do well enough in any.

In case you don’t know it, engineering job prospects generally are far better than film job prospects. The Bureau of Labor Statistics predicts 0.6% growth for film and video editor jobs, 8.6% growth for engineer jobs generally - though just 0.9% for materials engineers 2012-2022, by far the lowest of all their engineering sub-categories* - http://www.bls.gov/emp/ep_table_102.htm. Understand, also, that those who teach film have a powerful interest in getting you as a student (it supports their own careers), but they will never pay your bills when they’re due. Don’t assume all is well for their film graduates on the basis of the claim that 90% get job offers (investigate the truth and quality of these jobs), and bear in mind you’ll still have to elude, even if their assertion is legitimate, being in the unfortunate 10%.

*BLS 2014 estimates actually suggest a rise in materials engineers and a fall in film and video editors during 2012-2014 (http://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes_nat.htm#00-0000).

36

I would just like to say 3 things. First…

@jjwinkle

Oh I’m sorry, that was in the original post to give an example of what I would find ideal for a career. That is a bad visual. Here is a better one. I have 3 problems at this point. But first…

My Ideal Career

  • to earn a Masters of Visualization (an architecture / comp sci degree)
  • work for 1 year in animation while (at least looking for) work part time as an engineer
  • Then move on to being a full time design engineer while freelance animating

1 ) Can I get a BS in engineeirng and an MS in visualization so I can start off as an animator for 1 year of work, and then move to a Design Engineer job

2 ) If I get a Masters of Visualization and a year of work experience an employer would question my dedication to engineering and think I’m waiting for my “big break” even though I have a BS in engineering and a year of work experience? ( Guess I though it wouldn’t be that bad to go from Mechanical engineering to animation to design engineering)

  1. {{{most important right now }}}If I do something outside of engineering(any hobby, not necessarily animation) , would my engineering employer question my dedication to engineering. Please answer yes or no and add why.

Why its titled called Engineering and film double major

(for those who just skip to the last post page like me) I wanted to do animation freelance, in my own free time, without wanting to do more then 4 or 5 commercials at a year while working full time as a design engineer. I don’t want to “dabble in both” I want a career in engineering, and to animate for fun… is that not possible

@jjwinkle

I didn’t believe it too at first. Its actually because a lot of animation companies hire 2 kinds of people: those with art or engineering experience. And since this program combines both, it makes the graduates are demanded by animation companies since they don’t need to hire 2 people when one person can do both jobs on their own. Since the program isn’t even 30 years old yet and has less then 500 members currently it makes sense that with connections to over 50 art studios they could get most of them a job. I also know some of them stay at the university and become researchers so that could be the missing 10%. It is a small major with few candidates and they mainly only take engineering majors with art experience and vise versa. It is a very difficult program to get into unless you had experience in engineering and art, so their is a pretty good chance I won’t get in at all

… that being said… back to my problem.

My new question is if I do something outside of engineering(any hobby, not necessarily animation) , would my engineering employer question my dedication to engineering? Regardless of pay. Because if it is that black and white, I may need to rethink a career in that area altogether. I don’t want to be working 60 hour weeks and not be able to do anything for myself without my employer questioning my dedication regularly. That is not the kind of life style I want to live, regardless of if I did animation or film editing.

37

  1. No. The odds of doing something like that are small. Your graduate degree will carry much more weight in terms of perception than your BS, and any hiring manager for an engineering job is going to see that your studies have vectored away from engineering and question that. This is exacerbated by the fact that you say you want a job as an animator before moving back into engineering. That’s an additional example of your studies and career leading away from engineering and leading to questions on the part of a hiring manager.

  2. Yes. See above. Your history will show that you aren’t really interested in being a dedicated engineer and that will cause questions.

  3. No employer is going to care what your hobbies are provided they aren’t illegal. A hobby is different than work history, though. Having non-engineering hobbies is great and just shows you are a human being. Having a graduate degree followed by a job outside engineering shows you aren’t really committed to being an engineer.

You basically keep asking the same question in news was and are getting the same answers repeatedly. Why do you think that by slightly changing the question you will get any different answer?

38

Thank goodness, thank you for telling me @boneh3ad. I almost had to rethink a career. The history of my other threads (except for when I re-posted this question it the film major thread b/c I wanted 2 kinds of perspectives) would show I really do want to be an engineer. I just found that I like my hobby and am curious if I could continue it post college and be paid for it. And when my dream school Texas A&M has an award winning masters for my hobby ( i was attracted by being able to complete it in less then a year ) I was interested. But not as a career.

Sorry If i’ve been asking the same question, But ** thank you ** @boneh3ad for giving me answers that don’t say I have to chose to do one as a career and never touch the other without actually answering the question. You can probably notice how alot of the answers were just saying to chose one as a career without directly answering those questions.

Now, 2 questions

1 ) Does an employer care if I freelance?
2 ) Would any employer care if I didn’t put on my resume the Masters of Visualization, and went from my undergrad straight into working as a full time engineer (with the 6 months in between to complete the masters) and just freelance animate? since the main reason to get it would be to make it easier to find freelance work

39

By the way, i am really thankful for all the responses I did get on this thread, they have been very enlightening.

40

In general, employers only care if there is an ethical/legal conflict or if it is detracting from your work performance. Bear in mind that this could be an issue for you if your films or commercials take on certain positions related to your engineering work or if they discuss competitors or customers.

This is trickier, because while they can’t care if they don’t find out, they generally will care when they do find out and will hold that dishonesty against you in some way, up to and including rescinding a job offer or firing you. They are likely to find out either when they ask about the 6 month gap or talk to any references and are certain to find out when they get your transcripts (same school!). They will be upset because people don’t get masters degrees for their hobbies, and they usually don’t keep lie about them on applications - that’s how people treat the career they want to have when they leave this engineering behind them.