Environmental for undergrad: Duke vs. Yale vs. Stanford

College Search & Selection
1

<p>I know that all 3 have very strong environmental programs. I've heard that Duke's Nicholas school slightly outshines the others...is this true?</p>

<p>Anyway, I'm deciding between these 3 (plus a couple others with less reputable environmental programs, such as Harvard)...</p>

<p>I'd like to preface this by stating that although I like Duke's location and friendliness (and especially its environmental school), I'm somewhat frightened by its frattiness and almost-biblical devotion to Basketball. Stanford, too, has its location going for it, although it is slightly lacking in the same kind of friendliness (politeness is probably a better word for it), and I'm afraid that the really spread out campus would lend itself to a really spread out social scene (which my sister, having attended Stanford, has experienced firsthand)...</p>

<p>With Yale, the location would be not so great (New Haven weather is apparently atrocious) and from what I've seen, its environmental program is the least reputable of the 3...is this true? I do, however, like how tightknit the social scene seems to be...and I feel like the social scene is going to be a big deal.</p>

<p>Basically:</p>

<p>-I feel uncomfortable with frats and big parties like that
-I think a happy and tightknit social scene would be groovy
-I would like to not freeze for 4 years (but I could probably deal with it)
-The environmental program is a big deal to me and I'm afraid that if I pass up on Nicholas (Duke) now, I won't be able to study there ever (given that I probably won't be accepted again as it seems competitive).</p>

2

<p>BUMP What should I do?</p>

3

<p>Environmental science is an interdisciplinary field; as far as sciences go, it borrows the most from chemistry, earth sciences, hydrology, and civil engineering. The school that is strongest is probably Stanford because it’s top in all of the above. Stanford has the #1 ranked environmental sciences and engineering program and it’s earth sciences/geology is ranked 5th by US News.</p>

4

<p>It seems, therefore, that it should come down to weather and social climate. From your comments, it seems you’d be happiest at Yale in terms of the social climate. As for the weather, it’s relative—you eventually adapt—and, social factors will be a bigger influence on your overall happiness with a school than the weather, imo. Also, New Haven does not have winter weather through the entire year.</p>

<p>All three schools could provide a solid education in environmental studies. You really didn’t specify your area of interest in ES. Each school offers several different ES programs.
At Yale, many of the course offerings in the School of Forestry and Environmental Studies are available to ES majors. One potential drawback of the program at Yale is that you cannot just declare an ES major; instead must apply for admission to it. At Stanford, you have a choice of several programs: Public Policy (with an environmental policy concentration); Human Biology (with an environmental emphasis); the Earth Systems Program (with tracks in Biosphere; Energy, Science & Technology; Anthrosphere; Oceans; and, Land Systems----each of which have subtracks); Geological & Environmental Sciences; Energy Resources Engineering; Engineering: Atmosphere/Energy; and, the Goldman Honors Program at the Woods Institute. At Duke, you have a choice of Environmental Sciences & Policy; Environmental Sciences; and, Earth & Ocean Sciences. Perhaps, if you clarified what ES area most interests you, it would make your decision easier.</p>

5

<p>Doesn’t Duke have a separate Marine Lab in a private island or on the beach where they do intense environmental research? I think my brother worked there for the summer.</p>

6

<p>Stanford’s campus is not so much “spread out” as simply “large.” It manages to be in the top 5 or top 10 across most disciplines, so it’s unsurprising that its campus is large. But it’s dense. It could be smaller if it built taller buildings, but the buildings are tall enough as it is.</p>

<p>As for the social scene, the dorms are clustered very close to each other. In fact, when you do the math, east campus (where most freshmen live) has a population density higher than Manhattan. So I don’t think you have to worry about the social scene being spread out or close-knit. :)</p>

<p>As for your interests, “environmental” covers a lot. Stanford has the School of Earth Sciences, which has lots of programs you might like. Ones not covered by zapfino: environmental earth system science (which offers undergraduate courses, though not a degree) and geophysics. Many of the earth science programs are top 5 or top 10.</p>

<p>[School</a> of Earth Sciences](<a href=“404 | Stanford Doerr School of Sustainability”>http://pangea.stanford.edu/)</p>

<p>[NRC</a> Rankings Overview: Earth Sciences - Faculty - The Chronicle of Higher Education](<a href=“http://chronicle.com/article/NRC-Rankings-Overview-Earth/124722/]NRC”>http://chronicle.com/article/NRC-Rankings-Overview-Earth/124722/)</p>

<p>As you can see, Stanford’s programs are way ahead of Duke’s and Yale’s. Some others:</p>

<p>[Best</a> Environmental Engineering Programs | Top Engineering Schools | US News Best Graduate Schools](<a href=“http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-graduate-schools/top-engineering-schools/environmental-engineering-rankings]Best”>http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-graduate-schools/top-engineering-schools/environmental-engineering-rankings)
[Best</a> Earth Science Programs | Top Earth Science Schools | US News Best Graduate Schools](<a href=“http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-graduate-schools/top-science-schools/earth-sciences-rankings]Best”>http://grad-schools.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-graduate-schools/top-science-schools/earth-sciences-rankings)</p>

<p>The School of Engineering also offers environmental engineering under the CEE department.</p>

<p>[Civil</a> & Environmental Engineering](<a href=“http://cee.stanford.edu/]Civil”>http://cee.stanford.edu/)</p>

<p>Another advantage of Stanford is that you’ll have the option of coterming in any of its many environmental programs; if you aren’t aware, coterm means that you can work on your master’s and bachelor’s at the same time, and you get your master’s with at most an additional year, so in the end you get both a BS and MS.</p>

<p>Various other environment-related centers and organizations:</p>

<p>[Program</a> on Energy and Sustainable Development (PESD)](<a href=“http://pesd.stanford.edu/]Program”>http://pesd.stanford.edu/)
[Precourt</a> Energy Efficiency Center (PEEC) | Stanford University](<a href=“http://peec.stanford.edu/index.php]Precourt”>http://peec.stanford.edu/index.php)
[Woods</a> Institute for the Environment](<a href=“http://woods.stanford.edu/cgi-bin/index.php]Woods”>Stanford Woods Institute for the Environment |)
[Stanford</a> University - The Global Climate and Energy Project - energy research, climate change, global climate, global warming, greenhouse emissions, greenhouse gases, hydrogen economy, hydrogen power, renewable energy](<a href=“http://gcep.stanford.edu/]Stanford”>http://gcep.stanford.edu/)

[Center</a> for Conservation Biology | Department of Biology](<a href=“http://www.stanford.edu/group/CCB/cgi-bin/ccb/]Center”>http://www.stanford.edu/group/CCB/cgi-bin/ccb/)</p>

<p>Stanford gives you hands-on opportunities also: the Hopkins Marine Station, where you can do research or study abroad at, and the Jasper Ridge Biological Preserve, a 1200-acre area just south of campus where students and faculty do research as well.</p>

<p>[Hopkins</a> Marine Station](<a href=“http://www-marine.stanford.edu/]Hopkins”>http://www-marine.stanford.edu/)
[Jasper</a> Ridge Biological Preserve](<a href=“http://jrbp.stanford.edu/]Jasper”>http://jrbp.stanford.edu/)</p>

<p>There’s also Sophomore College, which is a three-week program held for students before sophomore year. It’s basically 10-15 students working closely with a professor, on a specific topic. Several of these are tailored to environment-minded students.</p>

<p>-Environmental and Geological Field Studies in the Rocky Mountains, which actually includes backpacking in Wyoming;
-Natural History, Marine Biology, and Research, which spends time at the Hopkins Marine Station in Monterey Bay;
-Parks and Peoples: Dilemmas of Protected Area Conservation in East Africa, which travels to Tanzania;
-The Colorado River: Water in the West as Seen from a Raft in the Grand Canyon, which spends two weeks rafting on the Grand Canyon, with Pulitzer Prize winner David Kennedy, who you may know as the author of the textbook “The American Pageant” used in APUSH;</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.stanford.edu/dept/undergrad/cgi-bin/drupal_ual/sites/default/files/common/docs/SoCo11Cat_web.pdf[/url]”>http://www.stanford.edu/dept/undergrad/cgi-bin/drupal_ual/sites/default/files/common/docs/SoCo11Cat_web.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>There’s also one offered (the most popular one) every other year that spends two weeks in the Galapagos.</p>

<p>You can get involved in a number of student groups. A sampling:</p>

<p>[Home</a> | Stanford Solar and Wind Energy Project](<a href=“http://inversion.stanford.edu/swep/drupal/]Home”>http://inversion.stanford.edu/swep/drupal/)
[Stanford</a> Energy Club](<a href=“http://energy.stanford.edu/]Stanford”>http://energy.stanford.edu/)
[Stanford</a> Solar Car Project](<a href=“http://solarcar.stanford.edu/]Stanford”>http://solarcar.stanford.edu/)</p>

<p>I’m sure Nicholas (Duke) is great, but Stanford is way ahead in environment programs. To be honest, given that you want a warm location, awesome social scene, and great environment programs, Stanford seems to be ideal.</p>

<p>By the way, for what it’s worth (probably not much, but I’ll throw it out there), Princeton Review puts Stanford at #3 for happiest students, #17 for best quality of life (ahead of Duke and Yale, who are unranked or behind).</p>

7

<p>Just to add: Sophomore College is awesome. It seems like it’s insignificant, because it’s only a 3-week program, but really, it’s amazing. I had a few friends who went to the Galapagos, where they pretty much partied at night on a boat (where they lived), and during the day researched and took pictures of giant tortoises. For the one I took, we actually went to the headquarters of Google and Facebook, and I got to meet Mark Zuckerberg (founder/CEO of Facebook).</p>

<p>Also, forgot about the other study abroad opportunities: Stanford@Sea, where you spend half the quarter at the Hopkins Marine Station and half the quarter on a ship at sea. In another program, you spend the quarter in Australia studying the coral reefs and rainforests.</p>

<p>[Bing</a> Overseas Studies Stanford University](<a href=“http://bosp.stanford.edu/australia/osp_aus.html]Bing”>http://bosp.stanford.edu/australia/osp_aus.html)
[Study</a> Abroad with SEA Semester: Ocean Science & Sailing Program - Nautical, Maritime, & Oceanography Studies: Academics Collaborations](<a href=“http://www.sea.edu/academics/jointprograms.aspx]Study”>http://www.sea.edu/academics/jointprograms.aspx)</p>

<p>Students rave about these programs–definitely worth considering.</p>

8

<p>I’ve been planning on entering environmental policy, so many of these programs that Stanford offers are fascinating. Thank you for helping me out! I think Duke is now out of the running, especially considering Stanford’s program seems to be much superior (and Yale’s slightly so). Sophomore college looks really awesome too.</p>

<p>And I agree it may very well come down to how much I like residential life at each college.</p>