<p>S enjoys many subjects but is passionate about music. He wants a BM in music which we're fine with, but we ask that he double major in math or one of the sciences he loves. He's agreeable. But the BM is huge at most schools and we find ourselves scrutinizing the curriculums of the colleges he's been accepted to trying to determine how he can squeeze it all into 4 years. He leans toward the private schools (we're in favor; most have offered him nice merit scholarships). I'm concerned that we are forcing him into a restrictive education whereby he takes exactly the courses he needs and isn't free to explore much. A 5th year would solve the problem, but merit aid disappears after the 4th year and the private schools are expensive. I think what's making me second guess myself is the fact that he too has now become concerned about cost and curriculum. It seems unfair when he's such a diverse, inquisitive, and motivated young man. I'd appreciate an outside perspective. Please don't be harsh--we both have family members who studied the arts and ended up unemployed. Nor do we want to spend more than we budgeted, esp. with a second child to educate.</p>
<p>Music and math probably is a doable double major, but that can be a tight fit, which would leave little room for free electives (though some breadth requirements not fulfilled by music and math would give limited room to explore). Other sciences may be harder fit in as a double major with music, due to more required courses and time consuming lab courses. Also, biology and chemistry would not really do much to improve job and career prospects ((applied) math, physics, statistics, computer science, or economics would help).</p>
<p>Perhaps major in one and minor in the other would give more “breathing room” in the schedule?</p>
<p>You and he may want to review career surveys of graduates:</p>
<p><a href=“https://career.berkeley.edu/Major/Major.stm[/url]”>https://career.berkeley.edu/Major/Major.stm</a>
[Graduate</a> Status Survey index - Career Services - Cal Poly](<a href=“http://www.careerservices.calpoly.edu/gradsurvey/]Graduate”>http://www.careerservices.calpoly.edu/gradsurvey/)
[Office</a> of Assessment Fall 2010 Career and Salary Survey](<a href=“http://www.assessment.gatech.edu/2011/02/17/fall-2010-career-and-salary-survey/]Office”>http://www.assessment.gatech.edu/2011/02/17/fall-2010-career-and-salary-survey/)
[Post-Graduation</a> Survey Results-Career and Professional Development Center - Carnegie Mellon University](<a href=“http://www.studentaffairs.cmu.edu/career/students_alumni/post-grad-survey/]Post-Graduation”>http://www.studentaffairs.cmu.edu/career/students_alumni/post-grad-survey/)
[Graduating</a> Student Survey - MIT Careers Office](<a href=“http://web.mit.edu/career/www/infostats/graduation.html]Graduating”>http://web.mit.edu/career/www/infostats/graduation.html)</p>
<p>Have you looked at the University of Rochester, which includes the Eastman School of Music? They have a “Take Five” program where the fifth year is free. In addition to that, there are no distribution or core requirements except for freshman English, so it frees him up to take the courses that he wants. I know a young lady who double majored in vocal performance at Eastman and another major that I don’t remember at Rochester. Even if he does not audition successfully at Eastman, he could still attend Rochester, take lots of performance and other music classes at Eastman, give a recital, join ensembles, and have a great experience no matter what his major is.</p>
<p>I think a BM/Math double sounds like an excellent plan. And unless the school is small, a double-major is definitely doable in four years. (Both of my D’s finished science-science double-majors in four years.)</p>
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<p>Not a B.Mus. + a second major. Certainly a B.A. in Music + another major would be doable, but the B.Mus. and core courses will take up all 120-128 academic hours, or all but a handful of them. I understand that the student in question has already applied to and auditioned for B.Mus. programs and is now in the process of selecting one. Take a look at the number of required hours for the B.Mus. and the required core at each school and see if one makes a double major more feasible than another. There are a handful of colleges with Schools of Music that overtly encourage double majors - Bard, Vanderbilt, Peabody at Johns Hopkins, Furman for example. But at most schools, you may find that it is indeed asking too much. At Carnegie Mellon for instance, he would take one math course, one English course, and a short computer seminar. All the rest of the four years would be music and nothing but music.</p>
<p>My D is a recent grad of Case Western U in Cleve. A biochem and music major. Doable but with 21-22 credits every semester. Most music classes in cunjunction with the Cleveland Institute. Terrific internships in science, but some hits on the GPA with all of those credits. Gainfully employed in a science field!</p>
<p>Thanks everyone. Gadad, you are right: the BA is much smaller than the BM. Ucbalumnus, he could indeed reduce one of his majors to a minor (or even reduce the BM to a BA in music at several of the schools). I think we may be putting too much stock in this current majoring plan. 50% of students change majors anyway. We should probably not be trying so hard to figure out exactly how his 4 years will go.</p>
<p>The double major is frequently discussed in the music majors forum. Just a question–are you asking about a music performance major at an auditioned required school? Are the merit scholarships music performance related? We know a few students who have done the double major route at UCLA. Virtually all of them (that we know) have been BA Music and BS Science or Math and all took 5 years. One of the impediments that rears its ugly head is the music theory sequence that both BMs and BAs require are to be strictly adhered to and scheduling can wreak havoc. (thus the 5th year) This is the sort of thing you might want to discuss with each music dept…</p>
<p>It is more doable in 4 years if the student takes classes over summers, eg, at a local college and transfers credits back.</p>
<p>The importance of knowing the difference between a BA and a BM is crucial, but choosing one over the other CAN be a potential detriment to one bent on a performance oriented career. The private instructor, the peer level of musicians all play a part in development of a musician aspiring to a professional level.</p>
<p>In general, the most seamless dual paths are at Oberlin, Lawrence and Bard. Many schools will pay lip service, or openly support this, yet the applied instructor or departmental philosophy may present roadblocks. Peabody admits very few as music/non music dual candidates annually, Rice fewer still.</p>
<p>Music and a science is one of the toughest to schedule, as lab requirements, course sequencing, ensemble obligations and studio/rehearsal time slots often conflict. There are options around this (summers/evening classes if available, yet remember most schools do not offer music coursework in the summer; larger university based programs often have much of the general elective/required academic lower level courses available as late afternoon, evening classes, especially those catering to a professional or adult student body portion).</p>
<p>If you haven’t already done so, please read this [Peabody</a> Institute - Conservatory Admissions: The Double Degree Dilemma](<a href=“http://www.peabody.jhu.edu/doubledegree]Peabody”>http://www.peabody.jhu.edu/doubledegree)</p>
<p>For some, ANYTHING is possible. A BM is an extremely time and credit intensive degree, and at a few places a BA/music can approach the intensity of a BM. The reality is anticipate at least 5 years, and a few summer courses here and there.</p>
<p>As musica said, we’ve beaten this horse countless times in the music major forum [Music</a> Major - College Confidential](<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/]Music”>Music Major - College Confidential Forums). If you’re willing to divulge your son’s list of schools, there are most likely current students/parents with “kids” at or out of these programs who can detail specific experiences.</p>
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Not so in the case of music credits. Theory is virtually nontransferable, much of the other applied coursework is subject to a pretty intensive review. Academic coursework may or may not transfer fairly easily. General ed requirements are normally not an issue.</p>
<p>Please don’t be harsh–we both have family members who studied the arts and ended up unemployed.</p>
<p>That’s why you’re right to be concerned. This has happened in many families. I have two family members with pricey art degrees who are living on the parents’ couches.</p>
<p>Can you child “lighten” his load with AP credits and summer classes?</p>
<p>GAdad’s suggestion of a BA is really good!!!</p>
<p>musicamusica, yes he auditioned at his school (for composition). He received substantial merit awards for academics and additional awards for music. This brings me to violadad’s discussion. Last year, I read the Peabody article on double majoring and convinced myself that S was one of the kids who truly loves both subjects. I just re-read it and realized that it isn’t true. He is a “Howard,” someone who lives for music. Unless something drastic changes, he will want to pursue a music career. So that was helpful violadad, though not necessarily the answer I was looking for! mom2collegekids: yes, he has APs and some college courses he took over the summer while in high school. He is more than willing to take summer school to help fill the GE requirements. That will help, but if he had 5 years he could also take those philosophy and physics courses he would love along with the double major. But I guess we don’t have to make the decision of paying for a fifth year today. Thanks everyone, for your help.</p>
<p>Well if it’s any consolation, the “howards” tend to be driven AND they tend to do well in the job market. Senior year my DD juggled a good job with an Engineering firm while finishing her BM and she is currently juggling three jobs (all music related) while finishing her MM. We know plenty of her contemporaries with pricey business degrees who are living on their parents couch, while she owns her own couch in her own apartment. It is about passion, focus and commitment. Three things you can attain if you are pursuing a degree in something you truly love. I do, however, think it wise not to accumulate debt in an arts degree —while you are starting your career after college , debt can be especially burdensome and affect your job choices.
Your mileage may vary.</p>
<p>My family is an arts family, and I agree with Musicamusica. Avoiding debt is the main thing. After that, I think your son should pursue his real passion. There is plenty of time for compromises later. My husband was a theater major in college. He is not famous, but has made a steady living as an actor, and been the primary bread-winner for our family for many years. He’s never had a “straight” job. It does happen. My kids have grown up in a quirky, idiosyncratic, fun, creative environment.</p>
<p>By the way, Powayparent… I grew up there, but this was back at the dawn of time when it was a really small backwater town with sheep ranches. Heck, there wasn’t even a high school there when I was an elementary student. By the time I reached high school age there was the one there on Espola Road.</p>
<p>Worth the read if you haven’t seen it <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/460187-how-many-music-voice-performance-majors-find-jobs.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/music-major/460187-how-many-music-voice-performance-majors-find-jobs.html</a>.</p>
<p>I have a number of friends who were arts majors and are working in fields not related to their college fields of study. The same with many liberal arts and other majors. My son has a BFA, and though he is now actively doing the starving artist route, he is open to looking for other types of jobs if he isn’t where he wants to be in the next year or so. </p>
<p>Unless you can find a school that actually has kids doubling with a BM and another degree in something like math, I find it a difficult thing to do. My son had trouble finding voice and acting programs that could be cobbled together. He ended up in MT for that reason. Though in theory, schools were quick to say it could be done, one glance at a sample semester schedules showed that it was physically impossible to do much of the time. </p>
<p>I know a young lady who did get a BFA in music performance with her instrument and also a BS in business at CMU in 4 years. It was a rough go for her in terms of scheduling. She could not do it with any other major, is what her mother told me. </p>
<p>My oldest son is 27 and has had a rough go finding the type of work he wanted at a living wage and he is not in the arts. Many of his friends in the arts are employed now in fields other than music, and seem to be doing just as well. It does seem to work out. Other than those kids who majored in disciplines known to be good for employment like engineering, nursing, accounting, a lot of young people with all kinds of majors have had a rough time finding gainful employment and it’s been a lottery in terms of what they have ended up doing.</p>
<p>Did you look at schools with open curriculum. A double major like that is completely doable without gen eds</p>
<p>USC students can earn a BM from the Thorton school of Music and a BS or BA from the School of Arts and Sciences or from another School- such as the School of Engineering. USC actively encourages capable students to double major/ minor and has a special recognition program for those who have 2 majors is diverse areas- the Renaissance Scholars Program. Doing a minor in Music and a major in a Science is doable, with forethought and advance planning.
[USC</a> Renaissance Scholars](<a href=“http://www.usc.edu/programs/ugprograms/renaissance/]USC”>http://www.usc.edu/programs/ugprograms/renaissance/)
The strength of the Thorton School of Music School and the Vertibi Engineering Program at USC is the reason he decided to matriculate there.</p>
<p><a href=“http://undergrad.usc.edu/renaissance/[/url]”>http://undergrad.usc.edu/renaissance/</a></p>
<p>Tufts has a BM/BA double major program with NEC. Otherwise, violadad covered everything I was going to say. I second the recommendation of Oberlin and Bard. At Bard, conservatory students are required to do a double degree, and at Oberlin it is optional.</p>
<p>Just want to add what I often post on the music major forum. Music majors can end up doing many different things, in music or in other areas, just like any other holder of a bachelor’s degree. Music majors as a group have the highest acceptance rate to medical school, in fact, at 66% (perhaps an old statistic, but you get the idea).</p>
<p>Is your son going to school for composition or is he an instrumentalist? If a composer, that gives a little more flexibility, and a BA in music might be enough. He can take some music classes, and take some math classes, and explore some other classes too, and then decide.</p>
<p>One other thing. Our daughter is a composer, and she has gotten two wonderful internships, one for the spring, one for the summer and school year 2011-12. She is not particularly a go-getter, either. I don’t want to divulge details, but both employers have well-paid staff who seem to love what they do, and both are related to music.</p>
<p>I live in a town with a major music festival, and last week we held a panel for parents and students, with a variety of people who make a living related to music: critic, piano tuner, music educator, festival director, grant-writer, etc. My daughter also spoke. The whole point was to reassure parents who are worried that a music major will lead nowhere.</p>
<p>Your son has a passion and, no doubt, a talent. Let him explore it, and have faith in his future options. Your worries may be limiting him in some ways. Just my two cents.</p>