Experienced Posters: Help Me Not Mess Up In Guiding My Kid Through The Next Three Years.

Parents Forum
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@thealternative I know that homeschooling laws vary by state, but are all the kids at this public school considered homeschoolers? If so, is each family in charge of their child’s high school transcript?

It sounds like this public school may not be a good fit. Have you looked for other homeschooling groups in CA your daughter could join?

@sbjdorlo may be able to offer some assistance if she is still visiting this forum: her son was a very advanced homeschooler in CA who matriculated to MIT. MIT granted credit for many of the classes he took at CA community colleges while he was homeschooling high school.

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Yeah, I think it’s too soon to think about MechE in undergrad or Design postgrad because who knows. You can cross that bridge when she gets there.

But, unlike many other subjects, math and languages should be learned young (definitely a window for them), so the AoPS suggestion is a good one. And quant skills are applicable in many fields.

Other than that, I don’t see how it’s possible for you to mess up. Do test prep for scholarships, keep going with the ECs, and encourage curiosity and exploration.

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OP’s daughter is going to be the one directing her path. Parents can give opportunities and encouragement. A lot can happen between now and college app time.

But OP can see where the parents and college possibilities are confined. What colleges that are possible for any kid, regardless of achievements are directly related to how much the parents are willing to pay, in relationship to what the colleges say they are expected to pay. I’ve seen many many top flight kids, whose parents had such high expected contributions that they could not attend theirfirst choice schools that accepted them. An early reality check on the cost of college and what’s available in merit and financial awards is very important.

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The transcript is considered a public school one. We did this due to lab science requirements.

Kevin’s daughter had the institutional/academic support of a clearly excellent boarding school. Her ability to take this support and run with it was impressive. Good for her! So Kevin didn’t have to do the “heavy lifting” of providing academic guidance. That was baked into the school. At a price no one would walk away from. So he didn’t need to ask similar questions - the school was on it. Interestingly, despite the strong school, he did the heavy lifting of seeking out a wider range of schools for college applications. Created the economic outcome he desired. Great thread.

At the moment, my kid is the one that is satisfied with her stated passion. It’s not something she discusses every day at all. She’s living her life - currently disrupted - and fortunately, once she’s wrapped up school this week, can pivot and spend time on other interests - even more reading, building, her skills with her hands. My kid is developing academic, athletic and artistic skills gradually.

As far as pigeon-holing - the kid will decide that for herself in the future, in the jobs pursued. She will probably be smart enough to understand that what she wants to do is impacted by: her education/abilities plus what employment is out there, or what she creates for herself. The kid doesn’t strike me as closed-minded.

It’s why the MechEng undergrad, should she stick to it, is practical (logical thinking), tailored to her desires (could change) and perhaps in keeping with futuristics, which I haven’t studied. Can’t see how this degree would get in the way of that.

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@thealternative what are you worrying about messing up? Paying for college? HS rigor? ECs?

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@cptofthehouse Exactly that.

@PurpleTitan Ditto. Except that right now, the goal is to prevent a shut-out to her (current, could change) dreams. The kid has no coding interest. Also could change.

Of note: the spouse works in tech. Attended a Waldorf school and didn’t formally do reading until Grade 2. Other parents we know have put kids in coding, debate camps at a young age. Our kid played with dolls for a full week, three years running. Along with more arty offerings. Had a blast.

@AlwaysMoving Course path/rigor, paying for college are the main concerns, due to ECs being an expense we pay outright.

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@thealternative, not everything has to be decided or planned for now- peel the onion. Front burner is mapping out high school courses. Plan on most rigorous and course correct in out years if necessary. Do this with your daughter so she understands the logic behind the plan. It’s good to make the connection on how their high school work can connect to college plans, but keep it as limited as that.

Because she is not participating in her sports this summer help her find a fun online course - STEM or design that can connect to future plans. Think about community service or leadership opportunities in the community. There are opportunities even in a pandemic.

For you, read and absorb on colleges, merit, and requirement changes as a result of pandemic.

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@Southoftheriver Yes. The optics of some of the conversation has been side-tracked because the kid’s ultimate aspirations have been mentioned. (And I have thought about the logistics of her accommodating her dreams. Lived through it myself.) Time and her decisions will be the ultimate judge.

The SIP means we’ve been chilling out even more than normal as she finishes her courses. Her language classes had marks frozen from mid-March due to issues of accessibility. Meaning if you had a B at that time, the mark was frozen for the rest of the year. Students could take the mark and do nothing for 2 ½ months, or keep working until they felt like it. There were three virtual classes in history, none for languages, some math videos. Just working from the textbook and handing in assignments for almost three months.

I have been planning the courses for the past few years, but it’s not been all straightforward with the school. Math placement was an ongoing issue. Don’t spend too much time dwelling on it with the kid, but yes, discussed how the progression leads towards college options.

This summer’s reset changes her original plans for sport, service and camps completely. The impact on her sport plans was particularly harsh. We have to research online options. Haven’t done that yet.

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@thealternative just wanted to support you and this thread. I completely get where are you coming from and questions you asking and concerned with. I am learning with you (and thank you for mentioning Kevin’s thread!!! I missed it somehow). My kiddo is 14 and is rising junior. Will graduate 3 month after turning 16. I’ve heard it all, what I am reading here too. Let kid be a kid, socialize, too early to “hole in”, too early to know what she wants, etc, etc, etc… Interesting, just like you, we had this heartbreak of her not getting in into the program (ended up waitlisted) where we did not have to start running this “rat” race of finding right EC’s, leadership positions, etc. since that program would’ve had this (part time) nurturing environment of professors that would help you research, enlist you in high academics world and all of this glory that looks fantastic on resume in addition to 4.0 GPA, great ACTs, APs. So now we are navigating the world of US game “how to get your kid into best college without living under the bridge while she is attending it”. Her high school counselor is nice but useless, her one of the best high schools in state (as one would expect “true peers environment ”) is full of high achievers running the same rat race and straggling to clinch this “hook” for admission time, but not really “exploring their passion”. We are first generation of immigrants (hence all these grammar mistakes:)) but yet in that “donut hole” and “not fist generation of college graduate” position. So long post short - hang in there. I would add - look for good summer camps (we found quite a few great ones) that helped our DD22 to explore different areas of her interests (CS), they actually were lifelines for her! Some of them look great on the resume and show her “passion”. Also, what helped us in choosing path is to map out all of her high school classes until graduation, to maintain a line of sight, that you can tweak later.

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French and Spanish should have other resources to help learn and practice. At the very least, she can practice reading with media in those languages. For example:
https://news.google.com/topstories?hl=fr-CA&gl=CA&ceid=CA:fr
https://news.google.com/topstories?hl=es-419&gl=US&ceid=US:es-419
Obviously, if you (the parents) speak those languages, speaking them at home can help with practice in speaking and listening.

However, in terms of high school course work, it looks like she is very advanced in math, French, and Spanish (calculus and level 4 in both languages for 9th grade) and normal level in other subjects. It looks like she should not have any problem getting a solid college-prep high school program into four years of high school, with some additional advanced courses and electives.

If there is desire to get enough subject credit and advanced placement in college to allow for graduation a semester or year early, or fit additional electives in product or industrial design into a four year college program, then, for a prospective mechanical engineering major, the following advanced level courses could be helpful:

  • Math: single variable calculus (or AP calculus), multivariable calculus, linear algebra, differential equations.
  • Physics: calculus-based physics for physics and engineering majors, including mechanics, thermodynamics, and electricity & magnetism. Note: AP physics C is less math intensive than these college physics courses and may be less accepted at some colleges.
  • Chemistry: general chemistry (or AP chemistry). General chemistry is often a peripheral requirement for mechanical engineering majors.
  • English: AP English or college English composition that is accepted for English composition requirements at the target colleges.
  • General education: college or AP courses in humanities, social studies, or (sometimes) biology. Note: knowledge of French and Spanish could allow her to take some interesting upper level courses covering material in those languages (e.g. French or Spanish literature) when she gets to college.

Of course, the basic college prep high school course work in other areas should not be ignored: http://talk.qa.collegeconfidential.com/high-school-life/2055289-faq-high-school-college-prep-base-curriculum.html

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Very helpful link, thanks. Many questions about APs versus DE. School has two semesters per year. Generally can take six or seven courses each term. What are some of the ways advanced students complete their classes? Do they take seven courses all four years? Also, so many students here know their exact grade marks, but this school strictly does grade level (A or B or whatever) for each semester, no plusses or minuses. Never understood the posts about how students think about an A- versus A+. This school doesn’t have that distinction - is it a CA state thing?

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Spanish and French AP results definitely should earn credit too.

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When California public universities recalculate high school GPAs for frosh admissions, +/- are not counted. However, transfer applicants’ college GPAs are recalculated with +/- as +0.3/-0.3 (except that A+ = 4.0, not 4.3) for transfer admissions.

Taking six or seven courses every semester should give plenty of schedule space for a high school student to complete any necessarily college-prep courses and typical non-overlapping high school graduation requirements (e.g. health, PE, …). However, a student who takes college courses while in high school may find that the college scheduling (and commuting time) for one college course may interfere with more than one high school class period.

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This is a very long thread and I am still not entirely clear on what the issue is. Our kids didn’t have adequate guidance counseling either. In 9th grade, kids were essentially tracked and most who were in the top track in one subject, were in the top track for the others. If this was not true, then they had scheduling problems in a small school. We ended up using online courses in that situation, though in one case, one of my non-STEM type kids dropped a level in math to make room for a humanities class she wanted.

It doesn’t seem that hard to figure out which classes to take each year. I have kids of varying interests and talents, and I don’t remember having much trouble over course selection, even with no guidance.

I am not entirely clear on whether the homeschooling is voluntary or part of the school’s requirements. Can you clarify? And in place of homeschooling, can you get some online courses approved by the school to free you up?

Once at college, many kids who are relatively advanced, and who got 5’s on AP’s, elect to take the class again at the college, so they experience the start of the sequence offered there, have a good foundation, and in many cases, to reduce the stress of freshman year. This tends to work out fine since in STEM, as others have mentioned, they tend to need at least 4 years for the required, sequential courses.

I would not think about grad school. It may very well be funded, either by the school or by work. It is impossible to know what level of grad school she might want, if any, as well. We saved by finding grad schools that offered funding, and many that have direct entry to PhD will offer funding as well.

The concern about having a family seems to be mentioned only by females. I have raised this issue in this forum myself. It is very very difficult for women, still, to combine academic and career achievements with parenting. Despite rhetoric about gender equality. And STEM is still heavily male. All I can say is at 13 she isn’t going to have a handle on this, that compromises will need to be made, and if she wants an established career she may need to wait a bit to have her babies. It is also a good idea to have a partner, and that may not happen on schedule either.The desire to rush things because of the biological clock is very very understandable but might be worth reconsidering.

Clearly your daughter has a rich life that presents many options for the future, which may or may not be mechanical engineering. I would caution against thinking about practicality so early, which you already know. It IS actually possible to go to college and major in whatever interests you (yes, art history, or music, or English) and make a living. I would try to detach academic interest and career path, but that’s me. It’s tough to do that with the cost of college and high cost of loans. But at 13, one hopes it is possible for awhile.

Is your daughter gifted in math? Why was she dropped a level? Was this a mistake or did she have any struggle?

I would think hard about graduating at 16. Social life and match with peers can change drastically over high school years. Your daughter may change too.

Glad that Olin is still in the mix! I know several who have thrived at WPI.

I know that this thread is part of an effort to shield your daughter from these concerns at such a young age, which is admirable, but I think you can spare yourself as well for a few years!

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The school has no advice or path recommended for students looking to get into highly selective colleges and programs? Highly unusual.

IMO, AP and SAT2 subject tests are more valuable in assessing students and when taught thoroughly cover the material needed better than some community college or other DE programs. There are a lot of exceptions. My kids, for example, took DE courses that at a known 4 year college , and there have not been issues about those courses meeting any college’s standards.

Community colleges can differ widely in rigor. I have a cousin who found himself woefully unprepared when he transferred into Penn State’s main campus meteorology program. The 4.0 he had from local community colleges and even a PSU satellite school clearly did not cover the ground that the students who started out at the main campus had. I’ve seen this happen many times with excellent transfer students. Many can take the hit and keep on going , but Med school and top law school aspirants have gotten crushed when prerequisite did not provide the necessary base. Certain 4 year schools, online schools can be just as inadequate. An AP course offers a standard colleges understand.

I’m not saying the above always or even mostly happens. My nephew took a college Chem course at the local Cc and with little or no prep got an 800 on the SAT2 and a 5 on the AP exam last year. Clearly, that course ( and I was a skeptic) hit all the right notes. But I’ve seen it go the other way too.

Also bear in mind that colleges, programs , some scholarships, grad schools, Med schools, law schools, professional schools , jobs even can demand you report the grades to ALL of your college courses taken, including those DE courses taken in high school. Life happens, things happen, and it is not unusual to “slip” and not do well in those courses. Those grade matrixes do not take into account that the student took the course at age 14 , 15. I know a brilliant young woman who got her law degree before she was 21 but did not get accepted to any of the top law schools,; a reason given were some Bs in courses she took as a young teen Whether that was so or not, I do not know.

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At this point I wouldn’t worry about specific schools or majors, it’s far too early ( this coming from an absolute planner). Most important thing is for your kid to take great strong classes and create a life outside of school. Many CC’ers complain that there aren’t enough/the right extracurriculars at their school, but there’s a whole world out there. Have her get involved in something she loves, let her dabble in some things and go deep. Make sure that these things are not so bland that every kid is doing the same thing. Tell her early how important class grades are and standardized tests.

Don’t limit her to AP’s/colleges. There are lots of great online classes. One of my kids taught themselves a language. Another did a fashion course in engineering. There’s a lot online.
I find it odd at best to think that your 8th/9th grader is going to go into the college major you have picked. And that you are worried about her getting a masters at this point.
BTW, I have very mathy/ STEM kids. We’ve always done things (not only STEM) outside of school. My kids attended public schools for many years. Now are in top BS’s and thriving. The younger one, who is the same age as your daughter received multiple near full pay scholarships ( not based on FA but earned) for high school. Kid had to write an essay for one. No big deal. How did this happen? Excellent grades and a kid that really knows what they like. We don’t push anything on our kids but we expect all that they do to be done with excellence. That’s it. It has worked out well so far.

The cost of education is sky high in the US. One has to make choices. My advice would be to stop focusing on a house you bought in 2005 and start thinking about how your daughter can become a great applicant and attend a great school for little money.
BTW< Olin is an excellent engineering college with very low costs. There are also many state schools and programs as you may have found. WPI loves women in STEM (but you have to try each school and see what happens).

The good thing is, your child has her entire high school experience before her. But it does go by fast.

Also, I haven’t read this entire thread. Hopefully, your expectations are in line with your child’s achievements. If you are looking for a full college scholarship, there will be lots of competition, even for a STEM girl. Have a budget, make a plan and see what the results are. And I wouldn’t overload your child. Kids who are doing too much, even strong kids will burn out. Balance is the key. ( Believe me, I spend lots of time talking my older one out of trying to do it all).

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For many parents , it’s a rude awakening to find out that no matter how strong their students are academically, even if they do gain acceptance, that schools like HPYSMC and the other highly selective schools are not options if these schools’ financial aid formulas deem the family able to may an amount, and the family will not or cannot. It’s even more painful when the studebt finds out sbd has to discuss the matter with parents during the application process. Ability and willingness to pay is a big deal in the selective school world.

So, yes, you want to know what the affordable and possible choices are to best support your students’ academic goals, and provide a good quality of life.

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Before moving onto course selection feedback, I would like to apologize if any of my posts were unclear. They’re already too long, IMHO, but deal with separate topics. To clarify:

Yes, balance is important throughout life. We all benefit from it.

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Current school is public but independent study. Student was advanced but placed in the wrong math courses two years running; eventually got back into the proper classes for ability.

The SIP order affected the once-a-week classroom sessions. For the past three months assignments continued from the textbooks. Math had lectures from previous years recorded or a couple of links to online sources, history had three streamed meetings, no lectures for science or languages. I handled two languages, spouse handled the other, along with math/science/history.

High school courses completed: Int. Math Ad. 1,2,3; French years 2 & 3; Spanish years 2 & 3; Physics. (Student earned a 33 Act English score and tested out of the district’s hs foreign language requirement at age 11.)

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I have a daughter who did two years of all de classes. She graduated high school in 2018 and finished her second year of college this year. She is not gifted but if you have de questions I can try to help.