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<p>IT may not require math. But certain topics in CS, such as graphics and cryptography, do require math. Understanding algorithms and computational complexity, while it may not require specific math as taught in typical college math courses, does require the ability to think mathematically and logically.</p>
<p>Same situation here! It is hard, eh? The decision my S made is not the one I or my H would have made, but in the end I hope he made the right choice for him. He took the mantra “love thy safety” very seriously and that is where he is going despite getting in to three technically “higher ranked” schools (two with significant scholarship money, including one top tier that he rejected due to his perception of unpleasant weather, argh!). He was also admitted to a similarly ranked school as his safety (but in NYC) with a full tuition scholarship. He chose UCSB Honors over them because he wanted to be closer to the “top of the heap” and have a good, fun college experience that would prepare him for law school. I hope he doesn’t have TOO much fun but I have to admit UCSB’s campus is so beautiful and reputation good enough to make it hard to pass up, especially with in-state tuition. Still, coulda, woulda, shoulda…</p>
<p>One thing to look at is WHY a really bright kid chooses an “average” school (not pointing fingers at this school, just speaking in general). Maybe the child wants to fit in, have fun, not be as focused on academics any more. Also, some really bright kids are less intellectually focused and not interested in the stimulating environment of fast-paced classes. </p>
<p>If your child craved an intellectually stimulating environment, I would imagine that would be his driving force. If he wants to have fun for a while, he will probably find his way.</p>
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<p>Yup. Stories like this one abound, as do stories like the tale of Haystack and his brother (post #21). And like my story, which I stopped telling after my BF chided me for continuing to be defensive about my state U degree more than 30 years after graduating. (“Yes, dear, you did turn out okay.”) Don’t sweat it. Really. Also: Genius is as genius does. </p>
<p>In the small world department, I was buds with the Williams prof/Conn College alum when he was a grad student at UT Austin.</p>
<p>My son, a very bright kid who figured out a bit too late how to take care of his academic business in HS, wound up at what I think it’s fair to call a second-tier LAC, Goucher College. Two years later, he’s transferring back to the Boston area (BU is the front-runner at this point, though a couple of others are still possible), but not because he didn’t get an excellent education at Goucher. In fact he experienced exactly the kind of “big fish in a small pond” advantages that ordinarylives referred to in post #2 of the thread. Coming from a large, competitive, sink-or-swim urban HS, I think the kind of high-quality interaction and mentoring he got from faculty at Goucher was just what he needed; now he’s ready for a bigger, less nurturing environment with more opportunities.</p>
<p>Retention is partly abut money these days. </p>
<p>And I hope the op doesn’t go looking at schools with this not to be boastful, but my kid has a superior brain to all these other kids attitude. </p>
<p>I have a friend whose son is a math physics smartynpants as well. He had many options, including cal tech. After 4 years of hard higschool he wanted a less pressure cooked environment. He chose a small state school in California but with a strong physics department. As a freshman, because the cpmpetition was less, and he didn’t have to fight for each and every ec, he is very happy. He helps profs, he is working on the schools website, he as a 2nd year is tutoring, etc. </p>
<p>If he had been at a school where everything is a fight to get lab time’ prof time, etc, he would not be thriving and he would not be as ready for the real world.</p>
<p>So don’t dis the lesser schools.</p>
<p>My d was so sad she didn’t get into nyu. She thought their media program would be assume. Intead she went to another NYC school, was able to jumpy right into the schools radio station, as the number of positions was the same at nyu, but much less battle to get in the door. She is working for a national tv channel one.</p>
<p>So sometimes, smaller and less well knows works out well, if the student takes advantage of the programs.</p>
<p>To answer the question about Case - after looking into their cs program, we were not really impressed (it was his other safety). It seems to be a little weaker than their engineering programs. It’s also very engineering based, which S doesn’t want. S did get quite a bit of money there, but if it was a choice between Case and CMU, CMU would win, so we took it off the list and were left with 3 other choices.</p>
<p>I have to assume that there is some sort of difference between Haverford and Conn (Haverford is still an option, but it doesn’t have a very big cs dept., and Bryn Mawr may be a little weak in cs) because at Haverford 90% of their students were in the top 10% of their class. Conn only has 62%. But does that mean that the teaching will be better because the kids will pick up the material faster? There may be really smart kids at Conn, but there are more of them at Haverford according to percentages. So I’m just wondering if he’ll feel like he’s still being challenged or if he’ll feel like he does now in his regular English class where some of the kids are not at his level of thinking (he didn’t want to take honors). According to what you’re all telling me though, he will still be challenged if he wants to be.</p>
<p>I’m not by any means “dissing” the lesser schools - I’m simply trying to get information. I don’t have any “attitude” so I’m sorry if it sounds like I do, but the fact is that the kid has a genius IQ, and kids like that sometimes think on a different level than the average person. I’m concerned about the quality of his education and whether there will be enough kids like him to relate to (you know, the kind of kid that uses “ergo” and “indeed” in everyday conversation). I don’t know enough about the differences between all the schools which is why I posted in the first place. People here know way more than I do.</p>
<p>As for the math - he definitely will need certain things like linear algebra, algorithms, probability, discrete math, etc. He’s already taken through multi-variable calculus, but hasn’t had any of these. He doesn’t want to be in an IT dept - his dream is to work for a game designer or experiment with applications in virtual reality, so he’ll need much more than just cs.</p>
<p>We haven’t made any decisions yet, so nothing is really off the table. S will probably take all this month to pick one, and I have no idea which way he will go. I just wanted to have all the facts so I could help him sort through everything.</p>
<p>megan–as a parent of a child with a tested IQ over 5+ tests in the 180 range, it doesn’t matter what school they go to as long as they like the school. Our son doesn’t “need” intellectual equals as classmates but he wanted interesting programs and he found exactly what he wanted in a lowly state school that is probably a 4th tier in the real world and a 20th tier on CC. He is done with school, gainfully employed and happy while doing Beta testing as a hobby for several video game manufacturers on the side.</p>
<p>The reality is somewhere in the 90% range (ok, making that up but close) of high school boys want to go into video game design. There are jobs for about 10 of these kids (ok, exaggerating again, but not by much). Our son was looking at that as well and the cold, hard facts pushed him into a field where he could get a job and be happy and he can do the testing on the side. It was also suggested that he consider going into architecture in some schools in California and actually work in the movie field doing special effects for movies. He had no desire to move to CA though and want all that excited about the special effects.</p>
<p>Again, he is gainfully employed and gets to do what he loves on the side.</p>
<p>Remember that being smart and being in the top 10% of your class are not the same thing. Lots of kids (especially, but not exclusively, boys) are late academic bloomers who only figure out how to translate their intelligence into academic success late in high school or in college. </p>
<p>I’ll probably stir up a hornet’s nest here, but if you want to get a handle on the general “braininess” of a student population you’d probably be better off looking at test scores. Haverford’s critical reading middle 50% is 650-750; ConnColl’s is 620-710. So you could say the Haverford kids have an edge, but the overlap is so large that I seriously doubt you would notice the difference in a typical classroom. They’re all smart kids. It sounds like your kid might well be smarter than most of his classmates no matter where he goes. But I don’t think he’ll be so much smarter at either of those places that he can’t relate or enjoy class discussions. (If so, that’s probably a problem he’d have at Swarthmore or Princeton, too.)</p>
<p>Steve - you’re probably right about the game design. I have a feeling that he’ll find other things to do with a computer once he gets into college! He doesn’t have a lot of experience with them yet. I only mentioned the “intellectual equals” because it was mentioned to me by S. He’s a nerd and proud of it, and he likes to be with like-minded nerds!</p>
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<p>The essence of CS is the math. In fact, a CS major is really a Math major.</p>
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<p>Although many people think that CS is IT, no CS person would agree with that. Frankly, this is a serious misconception. The two fields are only marginally related.</p>
<p>And without saying anything about the schools in question, CS is most definitely not OK at any school. CS offerings vary greatly.</p>
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<p>Just curious: Why did he choose not to take honors English? Why not go to the higher level course where the material, never mind the “level of thinking” of his classmates, would be more challenging?</p>
<p>“if he’ll feel like he does now in his regular English class where some of the kids are not at his level of thinking”</p>
<p>He might, on some days, in some classes. But I bet it will be more the exception than the rule, and he might have a bad day or two at Haverford, too.</p>
<p>Megan, isn’t this your son who is shy and hasn’t really come into his own yet? Maybe instead of worrying if his peers are at his level of thinking, he ought to look at it as an opportunity to grow in ALL dimensions he will need in the world.</p>
<p>Just a thought.</p>
<p>Anyway, good luck. By thanksgiving of next year, most of these kids will be very happy with the school they chose and will barely remember the other ones they could have chosen, instead. Life is like that.</p>
<p>I like what poetgrl said.</p>
<p>Megan12,</p>
<p>My son attended Conn College in 2008. He found it to be very competitive and challenging. The small class size is very conducive to forging great relationships with professors. The only downside he found was the school was too small for him, no football games which meant a lack of community, and he didn’t love New London. In the end, he did transfer out after freshman year, but it wasn’t because of the academics. It is a challenging environment. You are correct about the internship possibilities and I believe they were paid. Not sure if that is still true as he left freshman year. It is a school that is very well-respected and has deep alumni connections in terms of job placements. As I said earlier, the school wasn’t the right fit for my son, but I know the kids that he met were brilliant and really nice. He still is in touch with many of them. Hope that helps and I am just telling you his experience.</p>
<p>Megan12-</p>
<p>Repeat after me, “He’s going to Connecticut College next year. It’s a great school and we are SO proud and happy!” “He’s going to Connecticut College next year. It’s a great school and we are SO proud and happy!” “He’s going to Connecticut College next year. It’s a great school and we are SO proud and happy!” </p>
<p>Not only will you start to feel better in your conversations with other parents but you’ll be sending your son the message that you anticipate a positive college experience for him.</p>
<p>p.s. It’s a great school and you should be so proud and happy! :-)</p>
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<p>In fact, fudging this distinction is an excellent way to see what a CS prof looks like with elevated blood pressure, as I have experienced firsthand.</p>
<p>Great advice from poetgrl and Sue22. To this:</p>
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<p>I would add that if they are not happy with the school they chose, it is very likely to be for reasons that have little to do with the things that might have seemed preferable about the schools they rejected (or were rejected by). My son’s first choice was Skidmore, which waitlisted/rejected him. BU wasn’t on his radar; he didn’t even want to visit. Now, BU seems like an excellent fit to him, and Skidmore would just seem like “same thing, different state.” But he had to experience what a small, laid-back, suburban LAC was like to appreciate the charms of a large urban university.</p>
<p>poetgirl - that’s exactly what I was thinking. He’s in a small private school now and loves it - I always thought that Conn was a lot like it only slightly bigger. And he loves the honor code, which is why he loved Haverford as well.</p>
<p>absweetmarie - he’s in a regular English class because it’s not his favorite (or best) subject. He doesn’t really enjoy all the reading and writing, which would have been more intense at an Honors level. He’d rather spend his time working on his own creative writing. In fact, it’s something he also wants to do in college, and CMU is actually a great place to do that - they have a strong program there. Once again, I don’t know about the other two. He’s actually fascinated with the dialogue and plots of the computer games that he plays as well as the music, so being able to mix his writing with the cs is very important to him.</p>
<p>talaria - thanks for sharing. I love hearing other kids’ experiences at the schools that S is looking at. My S is not a big sports guy, so he’s actually looking for a school that’s not that into their sports. Like I said - nerd.</p>
<p>oh, I almost forgot, Sue22 - I laughed when I read your post!</p>