Families entering the BS world with eyes open: know the DOWN SIDE

Prep School Admissions Prep School Parents
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<p>We had the “if I don’t do X I won’t get into a good college!” conversation with DD over parents weekend. I don’t think it’s really about college at all. What it’s about is being exclusively surrounded by extremely smart and talented people for the first time and wondering what you will or can bring to that. I don’t see this as a downside of boarding school, it’s a part of the adjustment.</p>

<p>What I wonder is how the college pressure for students at boarding schools differs from the college pressure for kids who stay home. I’m not convinced that the kind of parental involvement in the college admissions race that we see today is 100% good. I expect that teachers at boarding school have a better perspective on this than parents, and that one thing that kids have a chance to learn in boarding school is how to make their own choices and understand their own needs. </p>

<p>On the empty nest topic, I’m dreading tomorrow evening when I get home from work and DD is back in school. I miss having her around the house so much. I fully agree with ExieMIT and others that this isn’t a reason to keep a kid from going to boarding school if it’s right for them, but let’s face it, it does kind of suck for us parents.</p>

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<p>Friendly, you make a really good point about kids in boarding school learning to make their own choices and understand their needs. Once the initial shock of being surrounded by OTHER “big fish” wears off, the better stuff can set in. And self-advocacy is such a huge skill. I don’t think it’s a bad thing to have goals early in the high school process. But the panic… well, perhaps that’s part of the process, too!</p>

<p>Not looking forward to tomorrow night, either :frowning: – even though the long drive buys me a couple of hours (in one direction, at least).</p>

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<p>Interesting comments. Just shows how different experiences can be.</p>

<p>As an aside, didn’t an Al Pacino movie use Emma Willard as a location shoot ?</p>

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<p>So true, Axelrod. And yes, “Scent of a Woman” used Emma’s campus. “The Emperor’s Club” (Kevin Kline) was shot there, too.</p>

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<p>Back at work after dropping DS at the airport at 5:30 this morning after a week off doing nothing but relaxing, enjoying, eating, hugging, watching movies (“Lincoln” was wonderful), and talking about nothing in particular. If ever there was a downside, it’s the airport drop-off. My heart hurts. He’ll be back in three weeks for the long winter break, but that brings up another downside—the cost of flights, especially two round-trips within three weeks of each other.</p>

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<p>^ ^ yes, ChoatieMom, I have been thinking about the long flights, during expensive times of the year (Thanksgiving and December), being so close to each other. Personally, I’d love to see them combined, or have a long Thanksgiving weekend and a bigger chunk in December. So much back and forth!</p>

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<p>Part of the “get into a good school” is peer pressure. Remember there are - on every campus - kids who come from families still thinking that boarding school is the express train to an Ivy League education. And there are always a handful of faculty wanting to plump up school stats. Many kids enter boarding school and get “grade shock” in the first few months - then implode because they begin to doubt themselves or think they’ve washed away their college choices by switching to a harder academic environment.</p>

<p>And I can’t emphasize enough how parent pressure can play a role. I spent an hour talking to a friend of my daughter’s whose parents thought he’d ruined his Ivy League chances because he scored 2200 on the SAT’s and a 34 on the ACT’s. I began to tease him, called him brain dead in mock derision, and he laughed and said I was channeling his parents word for word. I knew because I’d heard it before - a lot. Similar language leveled at students who get a 98 and not a 100 on a test. So I finally convinced him that his scores were fine, he should relax and work on his outside interests, then passed him off to my husband who then said almost identical things for the next hour (the kid is applying to my alma mater and my husband’s). He’s much more relaxed, though I’m sure his parents now hate us :)</p>

<p>We gave our daughter permission to fail. Because when students know they won’t get torn apart - and that less than perfect doesn’t necessarily derail college matriculation, they take more chances and present with more interesting applications.</p>

<p>But BS is what it is - high pressure for high achieving kids. Putting the right kid in the right school will help alleviate some of the pain. For many, college adjustment will be a piece of cake in comparison.</p>

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<p>Regarding “families still thinking that boarding school is the express train to an Ivy League education” from post above. The train has not been carrying that number of students since the 1980’s.</p>

<p>Take a look at the Phillipian (Andover’s online student newspaper). In June, 2012, more students polled thought Andover HURT their chances of Ivy League admission than helped, the first time this result has been found in many years of polling.</p>

<p>Reviewing Exeter’s stats, it appears to me that a handful (one handful to each school) of students get into HYPM based on academics alone (the Exonian student newspaper lists early cum-laude, which is top 5% of class - their matriculations are listed later in Exonian as well). That is 5/300, or the top 1.7% of the class to Harvard for academics, for example. The other handful (to make a total of about 10-12 students per school) are likely athletic/legacy/hook admissions. </p>

<p>Arguably, you have a considerably better chance of Ivy Admission being a star in your local school.</p>

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<p>“Arguably, you have a considerably better chance of Ivy Admission being a star in your local school.”</p>

<p>This is a point that continues to get made every year to each new crop of applicant families, though I still think some think Andover = HYPS+M matric. Sigh.</p>

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<p>My D is not liking her BS very much. Actually, she likes a lot of things about it but the sheet volume of work is incredible. It’s not so much the pressure, she can distance herself from the more driven and vocal students, and she is content not getting straight A’s.</p>

<p>But here is her schedule - up at 6 to catch bus (day student, obviously). School then EC and off the bus at 6:30. For SIX days a week. She has homework every night until at least 11 and then we make her go to bed. Sunday all day is homework.</p>

<p>She has NO downtime, ever. If she boarded it would be slightly better but not much. She has told me that kids routinely stay up until 1 or 2 am doing work.</p>

<p>She is just not willing to sacrifice that much of the rest of her life/health. We have talked to the administration who admit that kids do burn out regularly, but that this is the “game” that BS and other elite schools have created and it’s hard get off the machine.</p>

<p>D is now considering alternate schools. While there is much we love about her BS, I don’t see that her education is that much better than the education my S got in our local public school. She just has smaller classes and a more nurturing environment, but the end result for both kids is looking very similar.</p>

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<p>

FWIW, the Choate class of 2012 did not send any students to Harvard (at least none listed in the 2012 matriculation list). Two students accepted Princeton, ten Yale, three Stanford, three MIT. Hope no one is too shocked. Of the 220 students listed, here’s my breakdown:</p>

<pre><code> Male Female Total
</code></pre>

<p>Ivy 23 16 39
LAC (top 50) 29 37 66
MIT/CM/Cal Tech 6 0 6
USNWR Top 25 17 15 32
USNWR Top 26-100 28 27 55
Regional 6 1 7
Foreign/Unranked 5 10 15
Total: 114 106 220</p>

<p>(sorry for the crazy lineup; don’t know how to format)</p>

<p>As to the workload, we see what @surf describes, but each student has to decide what’s most important. For those who obsess about grades, the treadmill can be brutal. Our son has decided to step off the machine occasionally and take a few academic bumps in order to devote time to a sport and a passion. He isn’t focused on top grades, but on getting the most out of what interests him at his school. We’re sure he’s going to do just fine wherever he lands.</p>

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<p>@surfcity: Are you willing to name your daughter’s boarding school so that others can be aware of the workload ?</p>

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<p>I’m sure a heavy workload is common at all the usual suspects and others farther down the list. Also, it depends on how much a student takes on–a lot of the load/stress is voluntary. There ARE ways to manage the workload to avoid death by academics. I think most applicants are looking for a challenge which is why they consider BS in the first place. Good counsel in navigating the curriculum to meet a student’s goals is readily available as is help along the way. Don’t let individual tales of academic nightmares sway you from a school you or your child is interested in.</p>

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<p>Still curious about the school.
I’ve heard the most high-pressure academic anecdotes about one boarding school over the past several decades. Curious to hear about any others’ perceptions & experiences.</p>

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<p>While I will consider naming the school here, I do kind of feel it is a universal problem for BS. I really do love the school - the administration is accessible, responsive, nurturing. The classes have been fine, although not that much different from what I have seen with my public school S, just that they are smaller in size which is what my D needed.</p>

<p>I think a lot of the workload issues stem from how BS operated many years ago. You had all these kids on campus and you didn’t want them to have too much down time after class or on weekends, hence the Saturday classes and required sports/ECs.</p>

<p>As we all know, the rigor of classes needed to get into top schools has increased and kids at all types of schools are spending way more hours on classes and ECs and fewer on just being happy and healthy.</p>

<p>My D’s BS offers many clubs, but the irony is, there is no time to actually MEET! Some students will write for the paper or plan a fundraiser during a free period, but my D chooses to use that time to get a jump on her homework.</p>

<p>I really don’t want to encourage her to stay up til 1 in the morning, but apparently some students are that motivated or driven that they can keep up that pace because the prize (Iy admission?) is worth it to them. It is not to our family and I don’t think she is an Ivy kid anyway but she will do fine in the long run.</p>

<p>We are actually looking into a day school that has a more holistic approach to grading. Instead of 40 multiple choice questions to assess World History (“what year was the Ming Dynasty?” “Which one of these is not a pillar of Islam?”) their tests lean more towards demonstrating an understanding of the material (“Describe the importance of the Ming Dynasty” or “Compare the pillars of Islam to the tenets of Christianity” etc) I don’t care if she memorizes all the years and dates in her history book, i care that she can discuss the deeper implications of the reading. Not that the BS doesn’t do that, but the testing does skew towards a lot of minutiae and the homework can skew towards busywork, so that the kids are, well, busy and so you can see who can “make it to the top” and who stays stuck in the middle.</p>

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<p>It is not universal.</p>

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<p>ONe reason I don’t necessarily want to highlight the school is that I do think it is a good fit for many kids. Maybe that is part of my D’s issue. I do think Jr/Sr years can be almost easier because the required classes are out of the way and you can choose classes that are more to your strength.</p>

<p>And I do know that many kids in the very highly ranked affluent public schools around here are just as overwhelmed. I have an acquaintance who is a GC at a prestigious public and she tells tales about 9th graders with ulcers, etc etc. It is a universal problem.</p>

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<p>Although not universal, it is subjective. Still curious though.</p>

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<p>"…this is the ‘game’ that BS and other elite schools have created and it’s hard get off the machine."</p>

<p>I would say that this is NOT universal and agree that much depends on the school, the student, the peer group, and the parents.</p>

<p>We received grades before Thanksgiving Break, and my questions to her advisors about whether or not 7Daughter could be doing anything better/different were met with something like “She’s got Honors grades in pretty much all her classes on top of an aggressive schedule…don’t stress, she’s doing fine.” I felt like the biggest idiot/pushy dad.</p>

<p>And this is not the first time the school has talked me off the semi-TigerDad ledge, and I am truly thankful for that. My wife is even more thankful!</p>

<p>To touch on surfcity’s “Two roads diverged in a wood but both paths seem to lead the same place” thought…I could easily see this happening, especially if you live in an area where the public school system is very strong/the overall culture is very high-achieving. </p>

<p>But some of us do not, and I doubt that my kids’ experience/growth/worldview would be the same had they attended our local public school instead of a private day school an hour away and now, for my older girl, boarding school.</p>

<p>Another thought about “end result” being the same…which I interpret to mean they’ll both get high school diplomas and get into similarly selective schools: I have always felt that kids who are “Ivy material” are “Ivy material” [insert whatever degree of selectivity you want here] regardless of where they go to HS.</p>

<p>However, I know (at least in our experience so far) that our kids are far different people for the educational choices we’ve made for/with them so far. Not to get all corny about the “transformational power of great schools” but I do think it can make a difference that is tough to measure, but easy to see.</p>

<p>That said, I don’t know if I’d stick with BS if my daughter was in your daughter’s shoes.</p>

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<p>For PelicanChild, BS has been an eyeopener both to not be one of the top two or three kids in his grade without doing much at all, but now also, to be living in an environment with a significant number of grind students. As he notes, these students are not “brighter” than him, but they are willing to put in an extra 10-12 hours of work a week to cross the bridge between B+ and A- or A- to A level work. PelicanChild, bless’im, is not. But what I like is he can see the sacrifice and the result for himself, and make his own choices, and he seems comfortable with pushing himself beyond the prior expectations at his last school, but he is not so competitive or driven to need to attain perfection on every assignment. Is he “Ivy material”? Likely not. But was that our motive in sending him to LC? Absolutely not. Some kids are just ready to spread their wings and test their independence, to learn from living in close quarters with their peers, and able to take advantage of the ability to form close relationships with the adults who fill so many different roles in a BS environment. So far he seems to be coming into his own, but I wouldn’t hesitate to reconsider if he was expressing overt anxiety, isolation, etc. I think that’s why the parental role is still important with BS kids–we know who they have been. Even as we support them in flying off to become who they will, we can (at intermittent intervals) remind them of who they have been.</p>