If I didn’t believe people still grow and change quite a lot after age 18, I would have said this: I predict you’ll transfer out of your “lesser Ivy” not because of career prospects but because you don’t seem to fit the vibe of either Brown or Dartmouth, both of which are very laid back in different ways. You do not come across as laid back.
But I’m not saying that, because I’ve seen how we all do change a lot during the college-age years, even in ways as banal as becoming more like the people around us. In four years, maybe even one year, you may become a person who laughs kindly at the naïveté exhibited by your former self in this thread. Or maybe you will not. Maybe you’ll never forgive the (solicited) advice given here by those of us who have attended the schools in discussion (from HYPSM to lesser Ivies to (oh the horror) other colleges). And have entered fields including finance but also including law, academics, medicine, and a myriad of other things that believe it or not, require some not insignificant measure of intelligence.
Since you are academic minded, you may enjoy this intellectual challenge: what does it mean that our society so values economic achievement that our self-proclaimed brightest young people believe it is the pinnacle of mental rigor to move other people’s money around?
Did quite a bit of hiring for a BBB. At the entry associate level it was your BSchool record (and which BSchools we chose to recruit at), your work experience prior to BSchool, and your undergrad major and record, pretty much in that order of importance. Where you went undergrad would be noted, but your record and experience was the only thing that really mattered (as well as interpersonal skills). For lateral jobs (VP and higher), it was all about experience and skill level and personality fit. At that point grad and undergrad records mattered little, and where you went undergrad not at all.
Where going to a prestigious school matters is at the entry level jobs where there are a ton of applicants. Businesses use the selectivity of a school as a first level filter, e.g., if the kid had a decent GPA at a T20 in a relevant major, most likely they are hard working and have the brain power to do the work. Let’s see if they fit now through the interview process. We don’t have to work so hard to find the diamonds in the rough that we might in other colleges, although exceptional students from less selective colleges can stand out. As between HYPSM and B/D (or other highly selective schools), there is no difference.
If you see a numerical difference in the number of alum of certain schools at certain firms, it is likely a function of the size of the graduating class and the percentage of students seeking such a career. We can take Wharton undergrad as a good example. Lot of Wharton grads in consulting, IB, PE, etc… because kids that chose to go there tend to have those types of jobs as their goals from the beginning.
Okay, I can’t resist the trap of replying to what is clearly meant as clickbait. But honestly, we’ve been here before. Every five or six years (since I’ve been on CC) Malcolm Gladwell or someone of that ilk will write a piece debunking the importance of college rankings or prestige on career outcomes. It’s all a matter of self-fulfilling prophecies. Someone cherry-picks a data point and chooses a college based on that. Pretty soon the college is attracting a disproportionate number of matriculants with the same exact career interests.
And we see the ramifications. Everything from Harvard admissions litigation to the phenomenon of “fly-by” applications is based on the premise that the school is instrumental in producing future hedge fund managers rather than the truth: that it’s these future Masters of the Universe that are having an outsized effect on the colleges they attend.
Thank goodness for places like Brown, Dartmouth, Wesleyan, Swarthmore, Haverford and a dozen other places where one can still meet a variety of other students while still pursuing one’s own career goals - whatever they are.
Both banking and consulting interviews processes can be long…multiple interviews with multiple people over weeks, sometimes months. Some of the interviews are technical in nature too. The boutique consulting firm I spent much of my career at has really increased the technical/quant testing portion of the interview process over the last decade or so, after hiring some folks who were fine doing qual work but the quant work, not so much. The stories I could tell!
Yes, my kid went through the analyst process a few years back. Resume with cover letter submitted online. On line video interview with computer generated questions. In person video interview (I think it was with an HR type - might have also been with a junior banker). Full day process at company headquarters with multiple people.
For associates in my day (might be dated now with tech), in person screening interview at BSchool. Fly back to headquarters for full day of interviews with multiple bankers.
D’s BF just went through this for consulting out of BSchool. The interview process seemed pretty exhaustive, including individual and group settings. For both IB and Consulting entry level, most hires come from summer internships, so in effect your summer internship is one long interview and work test.
I agree- but it’s not a dozen- it’s DOZENS. You think you’re destined for law school, except you end up at Muhlenberg in an “artsy” dorm, so even though you aren’t talented in the least in the performing arts, you start out helping your roommate with social media for a performance group and then find your calling in arts management. You think you’re destined for med school, but a random statistics class at Brandeis shows you that you’re really destined for a career in public health. Or you start out in Econ at Wellesley because that’s the path to a banking career- but your anthropology professor is so captivating you realize you want a pivot to ANYTHING but banking.
Dozens and dozens of colleges.
OP-- you’ve fallen for the capitalist manifesto if you honestly believe that the only career where you’re work with smart people is in the capital markets system!!! Forget the “fit trap”- that’s a trap you won’t emerge from!!!
I was going to send you a PM about this, but your profile is private so I cannot. In finance, many jobs in trading and asset management fit into this category. Trading because they work around market hours, which in the USA is from 9:30 to 4:00. They get in by 8am to prepare for the day, and are usually wrapped up by 5:30. Asset management firms vary a lot, and while some are intense, many are pretty relaxed.
If you have more questions, PM me, since this is somewhat off-topic.
Exactly. OP is right that some people from their school will be gunning for IB/MBB/FAANG jobs from Day 1 by focusing on having strong grades, meaningful ECs, participating in appropriate programs, getting summer internships starting after freshman year, etc.
OP will have to find a way to stand out at a school where just about everyone had high rigor and nearly straight As in HS. The ones that didn’t have top stats have other qualities that are also important in the post-grad world…legacy connections, the ability to excel in sports and lead a team, etc.
So as a general note to everyone, focus on the OP. As it is, the thread might not survive long before being locked, as it seems to be going around in circles with many of the OP’s responses falling into the “yes, but” category.
I would also ask that one not simply post questioning the veracity of the OP without also providing helpful feedback. The OP may be an under-the-bridge dweller or may simply be misguided.
My kid from a lowly LAC landed a nearly six figure job in her senior year. She would have worked with a deity from Harvard and a demi-deity from that “lesser” Ivy, Columbia. Interestingly, those two people were not very godlike, and she was confused that they seemed ordinary.
I suspect legs are being pulled, but I hope the OP is able to move past this self-prediction of doom and enjoy going to college, even if it’s a “lesser” college than he/she deems worthy. Imagine if the strategy to aim as high as possible had resulted in having to attend a safety.
OP, I find it hard to believe this is real, but just in case it is, I am not sure what you are trying to get out of this thread. If you are looking for affirmation of your thinking that your future is doomed because you are going to (*checks notes), a lesser ivy, then you are not going to get it here. If you are looking at CC posters to just boost your ego and give you support then I am not sure how a bunch of anonymous posters can help you with what I believe is a deep psychological problem. Continuing to look at other people without stopping for a second and appreciating what you have, is a recipe for a miserable life. You will never be satisfied as there will always be someone at a better school, a better job, in a better house, and driving a better car than you. I sincerely suggest you find a therapist that can help you with these issues while it is not too late to change your behavior.
You aren’t caught in a “fit trap”; you are caught in the prestige trap.
Brown and Dartmouth have plenty of clout and strong networks. You would have to study hard/network/do internships regardless of school – nobody is just going to hand you a lucrative job.
If you chose Brown or Dartmouth based on fit, you did a great job, and you are fortunate to have been admitted. Now just go and make the most of it.
Both are very old and do carry the prestige of their history and their association with the athletic league in which they dwell. So while I think that putting a lot of emphasis on prestige is foolish, if it is important to you, you need not worry.
@asfdve, based on 2nd / 3rd hand information, percentages and likelihoods, and with zero 1st hand information, you are stating that having a good fit at Brown will matter less than HYPSM on your diploma and you will never be able to achieve what you could have if you had gone to HYPSM. You rubbish all of the many posts offering facts and examples of first-hand experience that suggest otherwise with all the unfounded certainty of a teenager.
Despite acknowledging that you regret not doing your own research earlier, you are lost in a sea of ‘buyer’s remorse’ before gathering your own information on what Brown will be like for you.
This is all sturm und drang about "could be"s. Go find out for yourself, in your own real life, if Brown actually is a good “fit” for you, and whether in reality your options are in any way constrained by the name of your school.
OP, what would you say were the elements of Brown/Dartmouth that initially convinced you it was a good fit? Are you outdoorsy and enamored with the idea of hiking/skiing in rural New Hampshire? (No indication of this, but maybe.) Do you have lots of varied interests and passions that require an open curriculum to fully explore? (This does not really align with the stated laser-focus-on-prestige-jobs thing at all.) It seems like there may have been a fundamental misunderstanding of what it means to find a good “fit” from the outset - this whole process as described feels more like a calculated effort to maximize prestige that just didn’t quite achieve that goal. Which is very different from searching for the right fit.
