<p>Again, csifan, I don’t think you can generalize. The majority of kids on D’s team do not party. They are serious about their studies and their sport, and frankly drinking is counterproductive to both. One of the girls who did seem to like to go out a lot, recently quit the team because her life became overwhelming. Another girl was asked to leave the team because her excessive partying had turned her into dead weight. I don’t know what happens at other schools, but the athletes at D’s have worked extremely hard to get where they are academically and athletically, and most of them aren’t going to just throw it all away by drinking too much or too often. </p>
<p>The Div. 1 state schools around here seem to have a rule that there is to be no alcohol 48 hours before a game. With 2 or sometimes 3 games a week, that doesn’t leave much of a window for partying during the season at least. Apparently, a lot of coaches check up on their kids too. When doing her official visits, D found there to be more drinking at two of the Ivies she visited than at the non-Ivy Div. 1 school she selected. The student should really visit the schools, spend a night or two, and see for himself what the team culture is like.</p>
<p>Lastly, any social differences between Div 1 and Div 3 have nothing to do with the athletic league/level of competition and everything to do with socio-economic and educational factors. In other words, if the athletes at a Div 1 school drink a lot, it’s probably the culture of the entire school and its students more than it is the fact that they’re Div. 1 athletes. Not for nothing, but a different kind of kid goes to Williams or Swarthmore than attends Stonybrook or TCNJ. There would be less difference between a Williams or Swarthmore kid and a kid who is attending Duke, Stanford, or Notre Dame, yet they’re Div. 1.</p>
<p>Son is a junior and plays DIII tennis in the Southern CA conference. He has a heavy science lab major and does well academically. His team doesn’t travel very far so he misses very little school. (one of the many reasons he chose this school) He’s been in the lineup for three years. Every year he tells us he might not make the lineup but that he loves the coach, team, and game enough that he’d be honored to be on the team even if he only made the practice squad. Playing on the team has certainly enhanced his college experience.</p>
<p>We visit in the fall for the ITA tournament then a couple times in the 2nd semester when they have a high density of big matches. They spend spring break on campus to play the East coast teams that come around. Watching college tennis is much more fun than high school or junior tennis.</p>
<p>orthoman: College tennis coaches look at rankings on tennisrecruiting.net</p>
<p>The GFC- I did not mean to imply that all D1 athletes are heavy party types, but was just sharing what some of my older teammates are currently experiencing now that they are in college. On my club team, there are phenomenal swimmers who enjoy having a very good time. It hasn’t caught up with them yet…and two of them have signed with very prestigious D1 programs. I am so happy to hear that your child has had a fabulous experience and found a team that fits. I hope I will be as lucky. Each college swim program has it’s own personality…I know I am looking for one where the swimmers are into taking care of their bodies and like to focus on their studies and swimming. I actually love my sleep…prefer that to partying :). </p>
<p>I really don’t know much about D2 schools - our coaches tend to direct us to the D1 and D3 programs so to the person who asked about D2 …if you can recommend some schools to consider, that would be great.</p>
<p>Do you have a specific geographic area? Look for the DII schools in that area and start looking at their conferences, shedules, rosters among other things and see how you fit. If you’re looking for money then ask the coach if they have it at their disposal, because if that is a concern then you can cross that school off the list if they don’t offer scholarships. You must stay in contact with the coaches ( I & II) as NCAA rules apply. D III can call you all day. My S is down to two, Saint Michael’s and Le Moyne, no swim money but both nice schools.</p>
<p>For any athlete, there is a significant amount of sacrifice involved in playing any sport at the college level-D1 or D3.
For some, the time spent at practice and meets at home or away would be spent partying or frittered away But for many-our son included-it did include a shorter(1 week)break at Christmas, no winter break, and a meet at home or away every weekend form mid-November until the end of February. It’s hard to study on a bus or in a hotel room with 3 other guys.
It also meant that we felt it unreasonable to ask our son to work the 10 hours a week included in his fin aide package.It also meant he felt that he could take only 1 course with an afternoon lab.
He was highly discouraged from skiing in case of injury. He was often sore from trying to get his body to do new things, the level of workout, and making mistakes in his technique.
Nonetheless, he intends to continue. He finds the pluses out-weight the negatives.
For him, D1 was not an option-he wasn’t competing at that level in HS.
I’m glad this thread has exposed other hopefuls to the pluses and minuses of college sport, as well as instilled a little reality check-all the time, money, and passion spent-gladly by most of us(and them)-and then what does it all amount to?</p>
<p>My D is playing DI next year and here’s a few tips on what I picked up during this process.
Her sport is field hockey, though maybe this applies to other sports too.</p>
<ol>
<li>When looking at potential colleges check the current team roster for the sport. Almost all DI schools and many DIII schools have short bios for athletes. </li>
</ol>
<p>THIS IS WHAT THE SCHOOL IS LOOKING FOR. </p>
<p>Just like GPA and SAT & ACT scores, you need to be realistic on whether there is a fit.</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Develop a relationship with the coach at first through email, then a visit. The earlier the better.</p></li>
<li><p>If you have the athletic resume good enough for DI schools and excellent academic credentials (3.5gpa or better, 90% or higher on ACT or SAT) seriously consider DIII schools. In many cases you can get recruited at a academically superior school and receive far more scholarship money than at a DI school. They will call it an academic scholarship and is given with a wink and nod.</p></li>
<li><p>If there seems to be a potential match between your child’s qualifications and a target school, attend the summer training camp the college coach holds.</p></li>
<li><p>Less than superstar HS athletes who possess 4.0 plus GPAs and score in the 95% on ACT or SAT, can get recruited to top DI and DIII schools IF they play on a HS team that is
recognized for their sport.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>Hope this helps somebody in the future. Good luck!</p>
<p>Second what sandiegeo said. Great advice. This was our situation exactly and the strategy worked out great. I will also pile on and add my opinion that unless you are a potential professional or Olympic level athlete D3 has major advantages over D1.</p>
<p>Please list what those advantages are, ThanksToJack. And please distinguish between advantages specifically tied to the Div. 3 level of competition, as opposed to advantages related to the academic quality of the school. After all, the Ivies, Duke, Stanford, Georgetown, Notre Dame, etc. are all Div. 1 and are among the most selective schools in the country. Furthermore, the Ivies pride themselves on offering the student first, athlete second experience.</p>
<p>Good advice to look at the player bios on prospective team websites – as it not only tells you what they may be looking for, but will usually give you strong hints if freshman typically RS or maybe get to play and also how many Jr’s & Seniors are left on the team. The bios may also give you insight into the particular fields of study being pursued.</p>
<p>If you are concerned about the schools or coaches commitment to your ( or your child’s) academic success – look for press releases on the teams websites for athlete academic awards ( these could be sport or conference specific) - especially for upper classman and multiyear award recipients. Ask about the team GPA and what the school/team policy and cutoffs are (should me much higher than NCAA standards).</p>
<p>I don’t have enough data to comment on if 80% dropout is a realistic number … but from our limited experience (2 years of Field hockey ) – 50% certainly is. It may indeed be much higher at IVY and other non-scholarship schools.</p>
<p>The advice we were given I think still holds true:
Choose a school because you love the school first, sport/team second – of course if you are dependent on a large or full scholarship that may be hard.</p>
<p>A lot of folks quit because it just stops being fun, and for the small scholarship amounts involved for many, who can blame them.</p>
<p>GFG, sorry I didn’t mean to offend your sensibilities. I forgot I posted on CC where the only option to possibly consider is the Ivies and other super selective schools. Yes, the Ivies do pride themselves on an academics first approach (I speak from experience as an Ivy graduate and having competed in XC and Track while in college). As for advantages, given our financial situation, there would be no possibility of aid at an Ivy maybe I should thank my Ivy education :). Nor was my childs athletic ability at the level that would merit a full or near full ride. As is well known on this board, there are very few of those outside the major D1 football and basketball programs.</p>
<p>However she did earn nearly a full ride for academics at a top 100 USNR (horrors!) D3. So for us the key advantages of D3, and much of this is relative to her 14 team mates who went D1, are (1) she plays because she loves it and not because she needs to keep an athletic scholarship, (2) the academic / athletic balance is heavily tilted to academics, even more so than at the Ivies, and (3) she started as a freshman on a reasonably competitive D3 team. At any competitive D1 program she would have been red shirted practice fodder.</p>
<p>My comment and perspective was for the 99% plus of those kids who are not at the very top. In my post I made note of that athletically and should have stated the same caveat for academics. A net $10k or so annually for a school with a solid academic reputation was a no-brainer compared with $60k per year at an Ivy or other highly selective option.</p>
<p>You didn’t offend any sensibilities of mine, ThanksToJack. It’s just that on CC whenever people make statements about the advantages of choosing Div. 3 over Div. 1, often what they are really saying is that a student should choose the school with the better academics over the schools with the better athletics. They aren’t really commenting on the superior virtues of competing at a Div. 3 level rather than a Div. level, which is a separate issue that I think is best to keep separate for clarity. (Also, it’s not like every student athlete is chosing between Typical Div. 1 State U and Div. 3 elite LAC, such that the academic difference is a huge factor.) I could care less whether someone choses a different option than we did. For us, the Ivies and peer schools were a better financial deal, so those were the schools we focused on. The Div. 3 coaches didn’t show any interest in D at all, actually. It’s worth noting that D is receiving financial aid that will not change if she gets injured or decides to quit the team, so that scenario is also possible at a non-Ivy Div. 1 school. The Ivies offered her comparable packages.</p>
<p>Ca parent: I don’t understand how, after 5 + years of hardwork and passion for their sport, a parent would advise their child to choose the school over the team and coach.</p>
<p>My point throughout this whole thread is that these either/or scenarios being proposed are unnecessary dichotomies. It may be difficult, but it’s possible to find a strong academic school with a strong athletic program, AND a nice coach and team all in one school. It doesn’t have to be a choice between great academics or great athletics, or a choice between a great school or a great team and coach. I think you really can find a school that’s a suitable fit to your student in all three areas. My other point is that Div. 3 doesn’t have the corner on the market for these qualities any more than Div. 1 does.</p>
<p>I would certainly agree with your point that D3 doesn’t by default beat D1. There are clearly D1 options with both great academics and strong athletics. My original comment was meant to communicate my opinion that D3 is a better option for many (most?) but not all collegiate athletes because in general at the D3 level they are student athletes, not athlete students.</p>
<p>i confess i don’t know much about d3 schools, but ALL of the athletes from d’s high school are competing at d1 schools from UCLA to Harvard and the 30 or so colleges in between those two. And all of those athletes were in the top 20 percent academically of their high school. And I’d say all those colleges are highly academic as well.</p>
<p>ThankstoJack said…“I would certainly agree with your point that D3 doesn’t by default beat D1. There are clearly D1 options with both great academics and strong athletics. My original comment was meant to communicate my opinion that D3 is a better option for many (most?) but not all collegiate athletes because in general at the D3 level they are student athletes, not athlete students.”</p>
<p>I agree with that statement 100% but that is just my opinion. I was very adamant about D3 + engineering with my son, and he was very adamant about D1 athletics + engineering. Many, many long discussions at the dinner table about this topic. Our compromise was an Ivy situation after much research. Ivy is a D3 wrapped in a D1 for us…</p>
<p>What high school is this, Lake Woebegone High? </p>
<p>Sorry, couldn’t resist … :)</p>
<p>… but 30+ female athletes from the same high school, all playing in Top 30 Division 1 colleges? Most high schools would brag about sending “1” …</p>