Financial Aid is what decides it all....Rice vs Canisius College..Help!

Paying for College
1

<p>today i got accepted to canisius college, with the following financial aid:</p>

<p>Cost of attendance = 40,137</p>

<p>Trustee's Academic Scholarship Accepted $17,000.00</p>

<p>Federal Direct PLUS Loan Offered $18,500.00</p>

<p>Fed. Direct Subsidized Loan Offered $3,500.00</p>

<p>Fed Direct Ford Unsub Loan Offered $2,000.00</p>

<p>all of this = 41000</p>

<p>now, rice university gave me these numbers</p>

<p>cost of attendance = 47,871</p>

<p>Direct Subsidized Loan Offered $3,500.00</p>

<p>Direct Unsubsidized Loan Offered $2,000.00</p>

<p>Federal Work-Study Program Accepted $2,500.00</p>

<p>Rice Tuition Grant Accepted $20,771.00</p>

<p>Total $28,771.00</p>

<p>What the heck do i do? </p>

<p>I don't understand which package is better because idk what kind of loans are those, and which ones are good or not. </p>

<p>i figured out that counting only the free money that each college gives, canisius is cheaper than rice by 4000 dollars.</p>

<p>i need to make this decision asap, any help is appreciated, thank you</p>

2

<p>We need to also know the breakdown of each schools’ COA to see if there is much padding is there that could be cut to minimize borrowing/gaps.</p>

<p>Are your parents going to be taking out the Plus loans or are you an independent (over 24 or married or a vet, etc). Can they afford to do this for 4 years? </p>

<p>What is your EFC? Is it about $20k? How much are your parents contributing each year?</p>

<p>I would ask Caniseus for some work-study…at least $2500-3000.</p>

3

<p>hmmm ok
Rice’s COA =
Tuition $33,120<br>
Fees 651<br>
Room and Board 11,750<br>
Books 800<br>
Personal Expenses 1,550<br>
$47,871</p>

<p>Canisius’s:</p>

<p>Full-time Resident
Tuition $27,100
Fees $1,057
Board $4,160
Room $5,990
Direct Educational Costs $38,307</p>

<p>Books/Supplies $700
*Board/Room $0
*Personal/Recreation $700
*Transportation $430
Cost of Attendance $40,137</p>

<p>My parents are going to be the ones taking out the Plus loans…ifthey can afford that for 4 years i dont think so.</p>

<p>my efc is 19300, which sucks cuz we really can’t afford to make that much ofa contribution…</p>

<p>most likely im doing a work study program for canisius. they talked to me about it, now i just gotta tell them i’m up for it.</p>

4

<p>*My parents are going to be the ones taking out the Plus loans…ifthey can afford that for 4 years i dont think so.</p>

<p>my efc is 19300, *</p>

<p>I’m not sure what you’re saying. Are you saying that your parents can’t/won’t borrow or pay $80k for their contribution for your four years in college. If that is true, what are you going to do after the first year? </p>

<p>Have you sat down and talked to your parents about years 2, 3, & 4? Have you asked them how their EFC is going to get paid during those later years. I’m concerned that they may qualify for the first Plus loan for the first year, but then either get declined when they go to borrow more or will realize that they can’t afford to borrow more. That is NOT unusual. Often parents qualify for the first loan, but don’t realize that they will be expected to qualify for the following years as well. And, some parents don’t “do the math” to see how much these loans will cost them each month to pay back.</p>

<p>IF your parents borrow $20k per year for Plus loans, then their monthly payments are going to be over $1000 per month for TEN long years. Do you have any younger siblings that will be going to school during that time? </p>

<p>My concern is that if your parents can’t pay much towards their EFC, how will they have the money each month to pay back HUGE monthly loan payments??? That doesn’t make any sense. You say that they can’t make a big EFC contribution, but then you’re expecting them to pay out a lot each year to pay back loans. Do you realize that? If paying their EFC is not doable, I don’t see how paying back big loans will be.</p>

<p>It looks like both schools have similar personal expenses, travel, and books, so no obvious differences there.</p>

<p>What are your less expensive options? where else did you get accepted to?</p>

5

<p>Either way your parents will pay about $20K and your loans would be similair at both schools. So go to Rice, it’s a much better school and your job prospects will be brighter.</p>

6

<p>Agreed. Rice will pay off ten-fold down the road. And its a gret school!</p>

7

<p>my parents have a big income (90000) but this doesnt mean anything because our debt is huge (50000) already :(. they really cannot pay back 80,000 if they borrowed it…they have enough monthly payments to make and we really dont have that much extra money in the bank. </p>

<p>i have just one younger sister, she’ll be going to 6th grade next year.</p>

<p>mom2collegekids, thats exactly my problem with financial aid. we really can’t pay our efc but are always given that financial aid package because of our high income. i cant do those kinds of loans that the parents have to pay</p>

<p>the rice financial aid package that i told u is actually not the initial package they gave us. we negotiated with them, talked about our huge debt, and thennn we got that package. </p>

<p>i didnt apply anywhere else, but i can still apply to my state schools, which are around 19000 already, counting the low tuition and the room/board cost. shud i just do that?</p>

8

<p>Looks like your EFC was met.</p>

9

<p>Sounds like you can’t afford either school. But you’re kind of stuck between a rock and a hard place because the state schools will see you as not having need as the COA is less than your EFC. So any way you slice it, unless you just go to a community college, your family will be borrowing significant money. You need to talk to your parents and see what they can realistically do. Rice is a great opportunity to turn down over a few thousand dollars. </p>

<p>I would figure out what you can make summers, what cash your parents can put in, what they and you can borrow and see where you land. Good luck!</p>

10

<p>Looks like either way you’ve got the max in Stafford loans (which will come out to about $27,000 after four years assuming they don’t raise the limits while you’re in school) and your parents will be borrowing aroud $19,000 per year. If these are the only two choices on the table, given that they will cost you about the same amount with the financial aid packages, you should definitely choose Rice.</p>

<p>The FAFSA doesn’t take into account personal debt load. They assume an average expense set given your family’s income bracket (which includes what they consider average debt) and then compare that with what your family makes and their assets, and that’s where your EFC comes from.</p>

<p>You should apply to your public universities (you should have already!) but with the date being so late in the year you may not get adequate financial aid. If the difference isn’t that big you’d be better off going to Rice anyway. I disagree that $80,000 for your parents is “a few thousand dollars,” but I do agree that if the difference between what the public university offers you and Rice’s offer is not significant I would choose Rice even it it were slightly more expensive.</p>

<p>And you should sit down and realistically discuss with your parents what they can do for you and what they can pay. For example, even though the school has offered you that PLUS loan, your parents have to qualify. If they don’t, you’ll really be in a bind, because the increase in Stafford loan monies to dependent students with denied parents won’t be enough to cover the gap.</p>

11

<p>All this advice is really helpful guys, thank you very much.</p>

<p>Man I’m really stuck…</p>

<p>Do you think I can just forget about my parents taking out a loan for me, and apply for student loans?</p>

<p>My parents are able to take care of 7000 of the 19000 that they have to pay. So is it possible for me to take out a 12000 dollar student loan for every year? </p>

<p>I’m fine with paying off my debts when i get out of college and medical school.</p>

12

<p>

</p>

<p>SUJ, you already have the maximum in student loans in those packages! The Direct Loans (subsidized and unsubsidized) will be in your name - they are also known as Stafford loans. The maximum Stafford loan is $5500 for freshmen, $6500 sophomore, and $7500 for juniors/seniors. The interest on the subsidized loans will be paid by the government while you’re in school. Unsubsidized loans will start accruing interest immediately at 6.8% per year but you can pay the interest every month/quarter while you’re in school if you choose to. By taking the maximum Staffords each year you will have $27,000 in debt (plus interest, if you don’t make any interest payments). That will leave you with a monthly payment around $300-350 for 10 years, starting 6 months after graduation under the typical loan repayment plan. </p>

<p>Plus loans are in your parent’s name(s) and require a minimal credit check to make sure there are no recent bankruptcies or delinquencies over 90 days. Interest is fixed at 8.5% and payments can be deferred while the student is in school, but there is no interest subsidy. To borrow an additional $12K/year in your name, you would need to have a credit-worthy cosigner and arrange the loan privately through a bank. That would involve a more extensive credit check and the interest may be better or worse. The cosigner would be impacted by having the loan on his credit report until it was repaid, or he was released from his obligation by the bank. Meanwhile, he would be on the hook for any payments you might not be able to make. You would have $75,000 in debt, plus interest, at the end of 4 years…that is WAY TOO MUCH for an undergrad degree.</p>

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<p>Believe it or not, there are doctors who have trouble paying off their education loans and regret their borrowing decisions! If you want to go to med school, you should try to minimize your undergrad debt. Med school is very expensive and, though there are expanded loan programs for med students, you don’t want to have to choose your specialty based on your debt load! There are some good loan calculators and lots of loan info at finaid.org…you would benefit by getting acquainted with them.</p>

<p>[FinAid</a> | Calculators | Loan Calculator](<a href=“http://www.finaid.org/calculators/loanpayments.phtml]FinAid”>http://www.finaid.org/calculators/loanpayments.phtml)</p>

<p>The one factor I didn’t see mentioned above is that Canisius is in Buffalo and Rice is in Houston…I assume you’re from Western NY/Buffalo because few people outside the area would know Canisius, so where is the budget for travel to/from Houston? There doesn’t appear to be one thin dime for that in Rice’s COA, so you need to add at least a thousand a year if you’re going to come home for breaks, etc.:(</p>

<p>Imho, neither of these schools are affordable for you…where are the SUNY’s in this mix?! Your stats suggest you would have received decent merit aid, perhaps even a full ride, had you applied on time! At this point, I doubt that many SUNY’s have space available for next year, although a few of the smaller schools like Buff State and Brockport might. Did you apply to any other financial safeties? You might also consider D’Youville, which is less expensive than Canisius and known for health science programs. If they’re still offering automatic merit awards for next year, you would qualify for at least 50% off tuition and 25% off R&B. Niagara is another possibility as their COA is just under $35K and they may offer more institutional aid than Canisius. Check this list for updates on schools with space available and be sure to ask them if merit aid is still being offerred for next year!</p>

<p>[Space</a> Availability Survey Results 2010](<a href=“http://www.nacacnet.org/PublicationsResources/Research/SpaceAvailabiltySurvey/Pages/SpaceSurveyResults.aspx]Space”>http://www.nacacnet.org/PublicationsResources/Research/SpaceAvailabiltySurvey/Pages/SpaceSurveyResults.aspx)</p>

<p>Unless there are strong chances for outside scholarships still in play, you may want to consider other choices such as commuting, starting at your CC (our CC offers free tuition to val/sal’s, idk if yours does) or taking a gap year to work, save, and revamp your college list to include schools that would be more affordable for your family. Would you consider any of these options?</p>

13

<p>OMG…
You want to become a doctor. </p>

<p>Then…NO…do not borrow anymore money! You’ll need to borrow too much for med school. </p>

<p>Quickly apply to your local state school. Go there. You can get into med school from any school.</p>

<p>Look at it this way. Your parents are struggling with $50k in debt. Why would you think that you could afford $50k in undergrad debt and med school debt about $250k+? Young doctors do NOT make enough to pay back over $300k in loans. Not even CLOSE!!! Besides, those loans would not be subsidized. They would grow big time while you’re in school. :(</p>

<p>Besides, you already have the max student loans in your package. You can’t borrow any more money as a student. I can almost guarantee you that if you start at either of those schools, you will leave after a year or so because you won’t have the money to finish there. How awful would it be to have big debt for your first year or two and then have to finish at your local school? That would be crazy!</p>

<p>What are your stats?</p>

14

<p>Why did you apply to canisius and rice in the first place? What was their appeal for you? Did you have your heart set on one or the other? Also, what type of medicine, if you know?</p>

15

<p>Your loans will be about the same at both schools. You will need the max Stafford and your parents will need a PLUS in about the same amount. </p>

<p>If you can afford one, you can afford the other.</p>

<p>If you can’t afford one, you can’t afford the other.</p>

<p>Your packages are virtually identical. The cost of attendance at Rice is more, but you got more “free money” from them.</p>

<p>Rice didn’t include the Plus loan but if you add that amount in…you more than cover the cost of attendance there.</p>

<p>BUT it sounds like these schools are a financial reach for your family.</p>

<p>Just curious…why are you receiving your acceptances now? Are you a transfer student, or did you get accepted off a waitlist…or what?</p>

<p>Are there any other schools on your “accepted” list that are more affordable for your family? Have you discussed finances with them.</p>

16

<p>Your parents can get the PLUS loan for either school. It comes down to whether or not they can afford that loan at all. It’s a decision to discuss with them. The costs are about the same, with info given. Depending on where you live, transportation costs might be the difference. Rice is a national university with a sterling reputation and has much more "bragging power’ than Canisus. Also has more top grade scholars. It is a far more selective school. Given the two choices, I would pick Rice. But it comes down to the crucial affordability issue. Your parents are going to be paying more than $1000 a month in loan payments for over 10 years with the loans for either school. Can they afford this? Do you have more affordable choices? Will they agree to the loan?</p>

<p>Rice tends to meet full need. If they gave you that package, your parents are deemed able to come up with that $20K a year. It’s up to them whether they can or are willing to do so.</p>

17

<p>His parents already have $50k in debt and their income is only $90k. Not only can they not afford to take on any Plus loans, it would be a bad idea for them to even consider them.</p>

<p>And, the student should not be thinking that HE will be the one to pay them back. The student will already have the max Stafford loans. And, he wants to go to med school. There’s no way he’ll be able to afford Stafford loans, Plus loans, and med school loans after he becomes a physician. </p>

<p>Some kids naively think young doctors are making “so much money” that they can easily pay back HUGE loans. They can’t.</p>

18

<p>That’s up to the parents. Not us. He needs to be talking to them. What he has presented to us is that he is trying to choose between Rice and Canisus based on financial aid. What we are telling him is that the aid packages are virtually the same since the PLUS loan could be taken for Rice as well as for Canisius; they just didn’t include it as part of their packages which is typical of many schools. Rice is the school with the better rep and more academically strong students. For the same amount of money I would recommend Rice. </p>

<p>However, there are many, many premeds who do better at Canisus type schools in getting the grades for med school. Rice is a tough school. The competition is going to be a lot stronger. Many a kid who was a top student who go to schools like Rice, Johns Hopkins, Cornell, Tech schools for pre med studies find that their grades there don’ t cut it for med schools while their peers at less intense schools are in more nurturing premed programs and are able to more easily get the gpas needed for medical school admissions.</p>

19

<p>Ok, I know how expensive medical schools are, but thanks for helping me get a fuller picture of how huge my debt would be coming outta med school. </p>

<p>But i thought there are public medical schools, like the University of California - San francisco, or suny upstate medical, that don’t cost that much at all. I know Baylor med school also has a great value, compared to like, HMS’s tuition of 42,000, which i simply cannot and will not do. </p>

<p>here are my stats, btw:</p>

<p>SAT: putting all my best subscores together = 2150</p>

<p>writing = 740
cr = 690
math = 720</p>

<p>sat subject tests
sat II - bio - 650
chem 690
math 1- 700</p>

<p>act = 31</p>

<p>i got 300 hours at a hospital, and an internship there. i was also a bausch &lomb honorary science award winner. thts it for my medical related ec’s. my cousin goes to baylor med school and i know some friends who go to bcm too. </p>

<p>I’m the valedictorian of my class</p>

<p>i took 4 ap classes: ap calc ab, ap physics c, ap biology, and ap english literature</p>

<p>Honestly, for your information, im leaning more towards canisius because its closer to home and i would like the liberal arts education. also its jesuit.</p>

<p>i got no other outside scholarships to bank on…i already won two though.</p>

<p>What i thought i could do was negotiate with canisius. I really want to go there, ofc they should want me to go there too, so shouldnt they give me a better financial aid package since im choosing them over rice!? </p>

<p>are there any other solutions?</p>

20

<p>Don’t know what state you live in, but Texax med schools are relatively affordable for instate students.</p>