Flute major--is my list too long/top-heavy?

College Majors Music Major
1

<p>Hi everyone! I'm a senior planning on finally taking trial lessons and applying to music schools very soon. As the title says, I'm planning on majoring in flute. I'd love to be able to say I'm confident in my ability, but I have no delusions about the competitive nature of flute. My teacher insists that I'm conservatory material, but I can't seem to shake the mental image of not getting into a single school I apply to D: Especially since I'm prone to audition nerves and don't practice quite as much as I'd like to.</p>

<p>Can anyone offer any advice about my list so far?</p>

<p>Boston Conservatory, Boston University, New England C
Carnegie Mellon
Cleveland Institute of Music
Curtis
Eastman
Indiana U Bloomington
Peabody
Juilliard, Manhattan SM, Mannes</p>

<p>"Backups" - Rowan, Rutgers, Temple</p>

<p>It's a lot, and I'm having a really hard time narrowing down my list to something more manageable. I've also been told to look into a lot of other schools, including Northwestern, CCM, San Francisco, Michigan, UT Austin, U of I Champaign-Urbana, CU Boulder, UC Santa Barbara, U of Orgeon, and the Hartt School.
As you can imagine, I'm kind of at a loss for what to do. I'm also in New Jersey, and kind of iffy about going to college as far away as San Francisco. And I'd prefer an urban campus if at all possible.</p>

<p>Should I add more safeties? If so, which ones? How many schools is it typical for music performance majors to apply to?
I'm open to any advice anyone has!</p>

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<p>Backups? Temple and Rutgers both have very, very good music programs…</p>

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<p>sprstr,</p>

<p>Please don’t take this wrong - but is your teacher helping you with your “list” and the whole admissions process? Seems to me that you have a list of some of the top schools and schools with the top flute teachers in the country. You may be a match for them all – but your own assessment of your abilities and statements of your concerns makes me think you could use more guidance and help than you can get here. </p>

<p>If your teacher has “connections” and can help you arrange trial lessons, take advantage. Some students will have already met with prospective teachers in junior year or summer camps - or at least already been in contact with teachers for lessons in the next few weeks. You may be behind…. (but I state this as a violin specialist, maybe the flute world is different) </p>

<p>With the December 1 deadlines for most music school applications, you might have to do some very fast work. Have you started making arrangements to get the pre-screens that many programs require done by Dec. 1?</p>

<p>There are/were some flute posters who were active last year through the searching and audition process. Some of the info may well be of interest. </p>

<p>Good luck!</p>

4

<p>You mentioned that you are taking trial lessons. Be certain to ask the teachers at these trial lessons which schools they would recommend for you. Ask them what your chances are at the school or schools at which they teach. While they have a vested interest in promoting their own school, I believe that most want to help students and will be as honest as they can. As well, if you are not in the ballpark for their school, they lose nothing personally or institutionally by telling you that. </p>

<p>It may feel awkward to ask about your chances, but everyone should know that trial lessons serve several purposes: a) they provide instruction in the instrument; b) they give the student knowledge of the particular teacher; c) they give the teacher knowledge of the student (both in terms of ability and in terms of personality/fit); and d) they allow the student to ask the teacher about how they would fit at the teacher’s institution and at other institutions. Stay conscious of the time during the lesson, and be certain to raise the issue of how good a fit you would be at the teacher’s school or other schools at least ten minutes before the end of the lesson. </p>

<p>As you know, no one here on the board can suggest schools in your range without hearing your playing (and most of us could not suggest schools even if we heard your playing, either due to our ignorance of flute playing or our ignorance of the calibre of flute playing at particular schools). </p>

<p>Adjust your list as you get feedback from college/conservatory teachers, but do keep a couple of reaches and a couple of safeties.</p>

5

<p>diontechristmas - That’s what I heard, hence the quotes around the word “backups”. I wish I was in a position to say I was guaranteed there, but I’m not. I don’t want to end up in a position where I have no college to go to, which is why I’m seeking opinions or ideas about other good schools I could add to my list that wouldn’t have such a high level of competition. Sorry if that category heading came off as condescending, I didn’t mean it to be!</p>

<p>Fiddlestix - My teacher was the one who helped me narrow down my list, and suggested several of them. As you said, most of them are top schools–that’s why I’m questioning my list, because I fear that my teacher views my ability differently than colleges might. </p>

<p>By “pre-screens”, do you mean audition CD’s/DVD’s and such? I did a lot of research on deadlines, and several of the schools on my list require CD’s sent by December 1st. Is there another part of the process, besides applications and audition scheduling, that I’m missing completely?</p>

<p>Violadad- What would be a good, non-awkward way to ask about my chances? Or even ask for a lesson? </p>

<p>& thanks everyone!</p>

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<p>Hi sprstr,</p>

<p>By “pre-screen”, I did mean the CD/DVD first step required by many schools. They will review these before inviting students to a live audition. </p>

<p>Frankly, your question and list overwhelms me - especially as you are currently a senior leaving a very short time frame before application deadlines. Please find an adult mentor - teacher, parent, orchestra director, musician friend - who can help you!</p>

<p>On your own, you can do specific research on the schools above. Several quick thoughts on pairing your list:</p>

<p>1) Financially, what can your family handle? This may include travel as well as tuition.</p>

<p>2) Some of the schools - especially the universities - have GPA and standardized test score hurdles that must be met before you can be admitted - no matter how good your playing. You could take a look at the websites specifically looking for required GPA and scores to see if you fit the requirements. If anything is unclear you can call Admissions and ask if your stats are within range. </p>

<p>3) Create a spreadsheet of audition requirements at various schools. If any requirements fall outside the range of what you are preparing for other schools, you may need to drop it due to time constraints.</p>

<p>3) Audition date conflicts?? You will have to prioritize.</p>

<p>4) Your own preference for urban setting and location not as far away as California is also quite valid for discarding some otherwise worthy schools.</p>

<p>5) Do you know students accepted at any schools on your list? Has your teacher had students accepted at any? How do you compare? Analyzing this is the first step of determining “match, reach, safety”.</p>

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<p>sprstr, you may be mixing your dads here. It was violindad who suggested you inquire as to your chances, not I. But as I have suggested similar advice in the past, I will address your question.</p>

<p>You can broach the question in a couple of ways so as not to put you or the instructor providing the trial lesson on the spot.</p>

<p>One way is to phrase it along the lines of “Based on what you’ve heard today, would you consider me a viable candidate within the typical applicant pool?” If the answer is yes, you might want to follow up with “are there specific areas that I can focus on within the coming months?”</p>

<p>If the answer is a qualified “maybe”, the above holds water as well.</p>

<p>If the response leads you to believe that you would be out of place within the pool of talent, then a question asking for recommendations for solid programs within your zone of current ability is appropriate. </p>

<p>Realize anything can happen at auditions. They are crap shoots, subject to many variables, and some might say “whim of the gods”. Cast a wide net. </p>

<p>You have gotten excellent advice from those posting before me. Heed it, and that of your instructor, as well.</p>

<p>If you can’t locate some recent flute threads, I’ll be happy to dig up a few.</p>

<p>Added: Asking for a (trial) lesson is not uncommon, is highly recommended and there are many threads here detailing what to expect, costs, timing. It’s simply a matter of contacting an instructor, expressing your interest in studying with them (or at the institution), and arranging a mutually acceptable time.</p>

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<p>Oh!! I’m sorry, I must have looked at the first letter and skimmed through the rest of the name. Thanks for the advice though, I’ll definitely do a search on flute threads.</p>

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<p>No apology required.</p>

<p>There’s plenty of past threads on many of the schools you mention. Audition experiences, visits, students (and parents of) currently in, admitted to, or in some cases graduated from the music program. Not all are flute related (most aren’t) but there is a broad depth of both knowledge, experience and insight here. </p>

<p>The search this forum/advanced/“keyword”/titles method is your friend. If you can’t find it, ask. The Master List threads '08,'09 an '07 (undated) are also a great resource. You can find accepted students, degree, and instrument/discipline at most of some of the finest music programs in the country. Look for some past posts by specific username for school or instrument info. </p>

<p>Most here are more than happy to help.</p>

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<p>sprstr- take a look at the “Accepted To” thread and the “Final Decision” Master Lists. You’ll be able to recognize the flute players- PM them and see if they can offer any advice. Some may still be around. If you have questions about specific schools, check out who decided to attend where, even if the aren’t connected with flute. Many of us parents would be happy to provide information about schools on your list. I have a D (VP) at CIM, don9992’s D is at Eastman, Bluepearl is at Indiana. Sit down with your teacher now, your audition rep should be decided and set in stone and you need to make arragements to get your pre-screening materials recorded so that you have time for the edits and to decide which pieces go to what school- and keep that list straight since you will need to play the same pieces you had on the pre-creen you sent (at least it’s that way with voice, can anyone help out with instrumental and tell us if it’s different?). Take a look at audition dates and see where they fit on a schedule so that you can make optimum use of your travel time and money. Reservations needed for out-of-town trips? Get checking on those too. There is a lot to accomplish and as you’ve already been told, there are others who have been working on this for months. You can do it, and if you have more questions- not about your chances of admission,violindad was right, we can’t help with that- put them out there and someone will always jump in to help. Good luck!</p>

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<p>Yes Temple and Rutgers would be backups and fairly down the list if one is really confident that one can make the list of conservatoires that was presented.</p>

<p>I spoke with a flute player that only applied to 12 conservatories and no backups and got into 11. So if we are talking that level of player, the list presented maybe too long but not necessarily too top heavy. </p>

<p>But since we have no idea what level player you are or what level of teacher made the recommendations what can we really say? Obviously those are good schools. Your need for safeties and the level of those safeties again depends on what kind of player you are.</p>

<p>In any given year there probably are 150 or so world class flute players applying to those schools and maybe 15-20 are admitted. If you are confident you are that level of player go for it.</p>

<p>But based on the information you have provided we can be of no help in answering your question. Those that have said get busy getting the sample lessons and finding out what level you really are have the best advice. That will answer you question better than we can without hearing you play or even if we did. Flute is without question the most difficult instrument to get into that level of school because there are so many great players and so few openings. </p>

<p>You really should be starting to prepare for recording pieces for pre-audition cuts. You need to find out where you stand. NJ certainly had youth orchestras, and competitions and all-state and other events that might give you some help in deciding, but until you have played for some college flute professors you are just guessing if you are that very rare best of the best. 1 of 10 in 10,000. Did you attend any top summer programs where you worked with top teachers or competed with great players from around the country like Tanglewood or Wildacres or Eastman? As was asked has your teacher had students go to a conservatory? Does she play in a major orchestra or teach at a significant university music program, graduate from a top university or conservatory, hold advanced degrees?</p>

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<p>You’ll croak doing 12 or 15 auditions, even if you are qualified for every one of those schools on your list. It is simply too long (IMO) and auditions are expensive (if they involve out of town travel, airfare, hotels, car rentals), and emotionally exhausting, not to mention the time lost from school in travel/audition time. Just the pre-screens and applications alone for that many schools would be daunting.</p>

<p>It’s important to know where you stand in the overall pool of applicants, at least roughly. From there, you can devise a reasonable list, which for most students is six schools, including one that is a “safety” as much as music schools go. </p>

<p>Good luck narrowing that list!</p>

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<p>6 schools even for a soprano? What do you think? Seems like if the teacher feels the student is competitive for Indiana, then it seems reasonable to include 3-4 reaches. Since some of the reach schools have small programs (some may accept only 3-4 sopranos). Then, if you want a few options to choose from come May 1st, i.e., a small school, a big University, a small town, a big city, a double degree program… We’re down to 9 schools: 4 reaches, 3 “matches”–(vastly different schools, all well-regarded), 2 “safeties”–at opposite ends of the country. Of course they are all auditioned schools, so technically none is a safety. Audition-wise it’s doable, because 4 of these will come to my D’s school. With pre-screens involved, there might not really be 5 other auditions. We’re able to arrange one audition on a break, and put two more onto the same trip (hoping for no blizzards in Feb). Ugh! With the Common App, it’s really 4 applications, but of course, 9 supplements. With one early action safety, I suppose she might not end up completing all the applications. Also, it’s hard to know how the economy will affect admissions–2 of her schools are California publics. Will more people apply to those this year? Will they accept fewer with the knowledge that they may get a higher percentage of students matriculating, and their budgets have been slashed? Any feedback from the soprano applicants out there? To how many schools did you apply/plan for?</p>

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<p>With voice, it seems really hard to say that a school is a match or a safety. It’s more of a crapshoot as far as I can tell. D’s teacher recommends her sopranos apply to 12 schools. I expect we’ll do 13, since Curtis is beyond unlikely.</p>

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<p>The flute faculty at the Hartt School is outstanding. While not a “safety”…the school DOES have one early audition date the first weekend of December. Students get their admissions decision WITH music merit aid before Christmas. DS did that when he applied. It was nice to have an acceptance early in the process, AND it was also nice to have a couple of auditions earlier on in the audition process as most are in late Jan, Feb or early March. </p>

<p>In any event…I would say a couple of things. You need to narrow your list down to no more than 6 or 7 schools, in my opinion. It is very difficult to manage the audition schedule for more than that many schools. In addition, I agree with others…get info about these teachers and try to have some lessons with some to help you narrow down your list. In our experience, the same names for an applied teacher came up repeatedly when DS was discussing college with musicians we knew. His applied instrumental teacher in high school knew MANY of the college teachers on DS’s instrument and was able to make some excellent (and well trusted) recommendations based on DS’s skills.</p>

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<p>An easy way to knock schools off a list like that is look at the requirements for auditions/pre-screening and see which ones have pieces that overlap. Then, look at your rep list and see which schools you can play the same piece for over and over. You do not want to be preparing 13 or 14 different pieces for auditions.</p>

<p>Also, I (personally) would consider Rutgers and Temple to be “middle” schools, but not safeties. This could be different for you because you are from NJ and Rutgers is a state school.</p>

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<p>Safety varies by the level of the player. Certainly for an elite player, a middle school could be considered a safety. For a middle level player it certainly would not. For a lessor player it might be a reach school.</p>

<p>Do not be defensive, they are very good schools but as you admit they are “middle” schools, not elite schools. An elite player that is likely to get a yes from one or more conservatory programs, their safety is not going to be Podunk U. Their safety will be a middle school or even a top level university.</p>

<p>Hart has a nice program but is not to be confused with Eastman, Julliard, Oberlin, NCSA, CCM, CIM etc. Talking flute.</p>

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<p>I haven’t read every post closely, so perhaps this has been said. Flute is one of the instruments where a pre-screen CD is common. If I were you, I would go ahead and do paper application and submit the prescreen CD for as many as you want. (Or can afford. Some of those application fees are hefty.) You can narrow your list down later if you still have too many after the pre-screen results. But the pre-screen might narrow your list down for you. On the other hand, if your pre-screen is accepted at a whole bunch of top schools, you might feel a bit better about your back-ups.</p>

<p>Another idea I’m fond of is to find a rolling admit - or late due-date - “safety” (perhaps one that doesn’t require an audition), and apply later on if it starts to look like it might be necessary. By that point, if you have results from an early audition or two, you may or may not need to pursue the safety. Another approach that some take is to only aim high, with the back-up plan being to take a year off, and try again next year.</p>

<p>The one thing I’m not clear on is if you are just creating a list based on recommendations, and don’t really have any personal knowledge of the schools. Once you start visiting, and/or have a few trial lessons, you may find some schools falling by the wayside simply because you can’t imagine yourself happy there.</p>

<p>Every year there are students who get into what they thought was their dream school, only to realize later on that it wasn’t at all where they wanted to spend the next four years. You might want to spend a little time exploring the websites of the schools you’ve listed, and see which ones really appeal to you, and why. Work fast - you don’t have much time!</p>

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<p>thumper is correct about Hartt, and the December audition date is an Early Action, meaning that they let you know around Christmas-time. They no longer give the merit-aid info until later on in the season, at least they didn’t last year, but you do have the advantage of knowing about one school and also knowing how an “audition” session works. It’s a good option.
As for the prospective VP majors- sop14’smom, applying to that large number of places is OK, if you can afford it, actually going and singing at that number is brutal. If Curtis is “beyond unlikely”, why do it? That’s $100 and a pre-screening CD you can save on!
You are looking at a period of 2-3 months- factor in bad weather (sorry,sopranomom92, if it’s February and your’re looking at the Eastern or Central US, there WILL be bad weather and your travel plans will be impacted by snow/ice/fog!). We did visits during D’s junior year (except for one) and she narrowed things down to 4 schools. On at least 1 day of driving to/from each of those, we had to content with terrible weather; driving, blinding snow, black ice and ice fog, doubling the driving time under decent conditions.
Doing the paperwork is one thing, but expecting a young voice to sing a dozen or so auditions during a compressed time period is just not safe. The weather is a factor with voice, with the dry inside air causing problems, it’s flu season (two variies this year), colds, crowds, all od the things singers avoid. Then, add in schoolwork which still has to be kept up and fatigue and something has to give- usually it’s the youngster. Honestly, I can’t see a voice teacher recommending a dozen schools,unless she is expecting that the student will not pass the pre-screening at some of them.Two “reaches”, two “probables” and a safety or two if you must is the way to go.With a list of a dozen or more, it has to be overloaded in at lest one of those catagories and I can’t see that a girl would be equally happy at all of those on the list.
If you make a list of your D’s “must have’s” for a school and then compare that to the long list of schools, it should be perfectly possible to compress it and come up with a list of 4-6.
Perhaps the VP questions should be started in another thead so as to give this “back” to the flutists and instrumentalists- things can be very different for voice since it is a “living” instrument!</p>

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<p>I am so glad we have other sensible voices that agree about the number of auditions! When people plan to do 10-12 auditions, I really do not think they are aware of what that means. Please listen to the advice of those of us who are on the other side. Six is really the max, and an early audition is a great plan. I would be wary of a voice teacher who would even recommend 12-13 auditions!</p>