<p>NESCACgrad, what kind of bands do you mean? Were they wristbands or marks on helmets? I want to ask son and dad if they remember anything.</p>
<p>Thank you for an awesome bunch of observations!! And congrats on having the D1 offer on board, it must give you a sense of peace to know it is there, and it sounds like a great school as well.</p>
<p>They were bands that they placed around the kids’ wrists - looked like the Lance Armstrong Livestrong bands. On the day we were there, Coach Bandy (Harvard O Line coach) and the Tufts head coach, Civetti, were the ones putting them on the wrists.</p>
<p>Thanks, I will try to find out if son remembers having a band. I don’t remember hearing anything about it! It would be just like my husband to miss something like that - he’s always just watching what’s going on on the field.</p>
<p>As for the camp stuff - OK here’s what I can now come up with. </p>
<p>I am interested in the figures of how many linemen there are going to these camps (and by the way is it just me, or does it seem like there are like at least 3 parents with OLine players currently here on this board?). I have split camps with my husband but I can verify we do see many of son’s classmates at the same camps. There are some that are definitely higher on the recruiting radar, as well as some who hope to be, and some underclassmen. I guess you are always trying to ferret out who is really in competition with your own son by both age, position and academics.</p>
<p>I did hear from at least two parents at different schools that certain players on their teams are “committed” to NESCACS at this point which differed from what I understood, which was that commits to NESCACS this early are really unusual. We hadn’t really even considered it. We have also heard by now of at least three players committed Colonial/Patriot and even one committed D1 who for whatever reason was still at one of the camps.</p>
<p>Regarding the SAT scores we have heard of anywhere from 1500s to 2000. Son has not run into anyone at camps who would admit to scores over 2000. Some kids with 1600s are still having legitimate talks with coaches. On the other hand, according to son, one kid who was easily over 6’4" and over 300 was having a big conversation with a coach until he was asked for his SATs, and then it was like, oh. Big let down and that was it.</p>
<p>One thing that disturbed me a little which I just wanted to throw out there. A parent told me to be careful of other parents who lowball their kid’s scores and grades and ability in order to get you to be more candid about yours (that is, letting you presume your kid is in a different category, so you relax your poker hand). I don’t know why this surprised me, but on reflection, it didn’t. I actually think I have possibly done this, not really remembering, but I know I usually am the type to keep to myself and I know I have been directly approached by parents who ask me introductory questions (like asking me if the colors of my sun umbrella are my son’s school colors) and now I’m not entirely sure sometimes what I have shared.</p>
<p>Another thing, I actually overheard this in a line where the parent and player in front of us told the coach they heard from another parent that they were already in talks with that parent’s kid who was in the same position - apparently someone had been talking in the stands about how that coach was interested in their kid, and the parent brought it right to the coach. The coach obviously looked non-plussed, probably with both parents. </p>
<p>Anyway, I have had lots of fun, though we have younger ones that also need lots of attention and we have only been able to do so many camps (I’m sorry if I’ve been that one that’s been trying to keep my kids occupied with goldfish and juice boxes). </p>
<p>Here’s hoping it works out for everyone. GP</p>
<p>GingerPeach, I suspect our sons have bumped into one another based on your posts. </p>
<p>Your post raises some interesting issues:</p>
<ol>
<li> How many linemen at these camps? It’s hard to gauge. What matters is how many academically qualified (rising senior) linemen (at least for the NESCAC and Ivies and prob the Patriot) are at these camps. Since many of these camps are moneymakers for the coaches, they won’t tell a kid not to attend - no matter how bad his grades/SATs; not to mention, there are often other schools at the Div I camps that may have an interest. Assumption (a small Div III school in Worcester) was at both Brown and Princeton. I can tell you at the Harvard camp on the day we attended, there were 27 o linemen, of whom 6-7 had the highest bands (blue).<br></li>
</ol>
<p>Take with a grain of salt, but at the camps we have attended, the # of linemen have ranged from 10-30 kids (of whom at least 2/3rds were either too short, were too young (underclassmen), or were too soft/unskilled to be legitimate Div I recruits IMO). I assume the academics would cull the herd further - but as you note, you have no way of knowing. Also, since many of these schools have several different camp days, there are obv lineman groups that we have not seen. </p>
<ol>
<li><p>I am not how sure someone can “commit” to NESCAC in July? No matter how many assurances a NESCAC coach gives you, until admissions send you an acceptance letter, you can’t put much stock in that. As for the CAA/Patriot, since those schools are Div I and offer scholarships, they have been giving offers, and indeed, kids can verbally committ now if they so choose. To that end, why a kid would commit to a school, and then continue to attend other schools’ camps makes no sense. It makes one wonder just how strong these so-called commitments are?</p></li>
<li><p>SAT scores are important - esp for the NESCACS and the Ivies - and for the o lineman, even more so. On the Ivy AI index, O linemen are rarely, if ever, in the lowest bands academically. One Ivy coach told us that in the past 20 years, his school never offered an O-linemen in the lowest two tiers. I can’t conceive of an o lineman being recruited to an Ivy/NESCAC with a sub-1800 SAT. I could be wrong, but I’d like to see it. Patriot and Colonial will certainly recruit kids below that level. </p></li>
<li><p>Parent gamesmanship does not surprise me. But seriously, at the end of the day, what matters are your son’s academics and his skill level (including height and weight). The beauty of the O-Line recruiting process is that most schools are looking for between 3-6 O-linemen every year. Contrast that with qbs where they recruit usually 1-2/year. </p></li>
<li><p>Camps have been fun, but my son is tired at ths point; can’t wait for the season. It’s been an interesting experience!</p></li>
</ol>
<p>MaryOC…glad you popped in. Your advice and info was hugely helpful last year, thank you! Happy to say the boy will be playing ball at his #1 choice and his mom and dad are very glad to have the process behind them!</p>
<p>NESCACgrad, GP and others, I feel like I have probably bumped into all of you somewhere.</p>
<p>GP all of the kids I have seen have been so cute. I hope no one minded our puppy … I tried to keep him out of the mix around the stadiums/fields but we did bring him a few times.</p>
<p>Wow re: the OLine talk on SATS. Yes, we just heard this. OLine is typically brought in at the highest bands. Receivers, QBs and backs are brought in at the lowest bands. We have come close to a #1 school where everything else falls mostly in line except the band. We’ve been told there may be a spot at the end of the rainbow (Nov. 1 ?) but we need to get the scores up and show the senior 1Q grades.</p>
<p>I am so tired. We really just got home after 7+ hours driving and trying to process. </p>
<p>Will check in tomorrow.</p>
<p>Glad your son asked the coach for clarification ChicagoMama, and you have a more realistic expectation of what is required to prove his worthiness to #1 choice coach. I hope it all falls into place for him… just keep in mind that the coach from the first team to offer will be pushing for a commitment. It gets prickly.</p>
<p>@ JoBenny - glad things worked out for your son. Congrats! I am happy to share what we learned along the way.</p>
<p>It’s definately helpful to get info from as many other parents who have already been through the process as you can. One thing I learned as we made our way, at least in our experience, is that there is no universal recruiting process even within the same league. There were some general guidelines that crossed school programs, but for the most part, there were as many recruiting timelines and protocols as there were schools who approached our son.</p>
<p>My son received an offer from a d2 school and they told us we can verbally commit to them in October. He also is supposed to be offered from Patriot League schools and one Ivy league is e-mailing him and asking him to come work out for them even if they do not have a n official camp that week. He is really interested in a Military Academy and that would be his first choice. Some schools want you to know that they want you where others are waiting to see if some kids fall through the cracks to them. We were advised that November is the time when most schools will start to present the offers to you.</p>
<p>You all have great info here. We just got back from camp #4 (2 Ivy, NE Elite and a NESCAC with 2 to go). We have a D-line guy. I just wanted to add, it’s super important to talk to other local parents you trust. We have a friend whose son went through this process several years ago at NESCAC schools and she has walked me through what she did. (Her son is now a NESCAC football senior.) If you haven’t already, find a family like this through your school counselor or your coach/AD or church/work. </p>
<p>Yes we had the red band at Harvard. That was with 1860 SATs and a 3.94 GPA.</p>
<p>The head coach told us at camp this weekend that they will flag around 15 kids for letters of interest in fall based on Admissions pre-read. I agree with NESCACGrad88, those letters won’t come until the Ivy schools have taken their pick. We have a one Ivy callback, and one NESCAC head coach tell us our guy would be in a mid-low band & should get his SATs up a smidge in October. Some of the NESCACs are pickier than others, though…so we are going to sit tight and just let it roll! Keep your boy upbeat!</p>
<p>I agree that the fellow parents who have already gone through it are the most incredible resource. Also, the most reliable, walking the line between HS coaches and college coaches and what the players themselves sometimes think will happen. </p>
<p>In the end, what pans out, is what pans out, and I think parents are the only ones who really keep the closest track of that and maybe even have the longest memory in terms of all the hands played up until the game ends.</p>
<p>My s has 2 more camps to go. He has one last Junior Day too. He has heard the “we want you” words and offer of support, etc. We have done round 2 for a couple of schools/coaches (2nd time on campus with either tour, interview or camp). My BS meter is on and so far I don’t read any BS from coaches. But, a coach wanting my son for football doesn’t mean admissions does. </p>
<p>So, still reading the tea leaves and more importantly reading my S. He has lost interest in some schools because the school itself or the football program has fallen into the “not feeling it” category. He did cast the wide net which was great for awhile. But, the energy to keep it all going just isn’t there. At this time, he can see himself at 2 of the NESCACs, one D2 and one other D3 program. 4 schools at the top of his list. Ask me in a few days and I bet it all changes. :)</p>
<p>I found one of the must useful questions for coaches to be: “How successful have you been at getting the athletes who you have supported through the admissions process (i.e., what is your track record with admissions?).” This is not a question you ask early in the recruiting process unless you have a very good rapport with the coaches. It’s really a question that is more appropriate at the stage where your kid is being actively recruited and perhaps trying to make a decision between a couple of different programs. In the case of my S, it was an absolutely key question in making a determination about where to go to school. He had 5 - 6 offers of “support” at different schools after sending in transcripts, test scores and attending some camps. One coach offered support but there was no pre-read process in the admissions department. We liked the school a lot, but thought that the lack of a pre-read made a decision to apply a bit of a gamble. At a couple of other schools, my S had positive pre-reads with admissions and offers of coach support, but the coaches were new or we didn’t have great data on ultimate success with admissions. At yet another school, the coach was clear with my son that his pre-read was positive, but that he was on the borderline academically and they wanted him to apply, but there was some risk. At the school my S chose, there was a positive pre-read, an offer of support from the coach and – here was the clincher – solid data/numbers from the coach about past success in getting kids in my son’s position ultimately admitted to the school. He did not have a 100% success rate and we understood there would be no guarantee, but his success rate was very high and that gave us a lot of comfort that he had a good working relationship with the admissions department and they had a shared understanding about the kinds of kids who would be admitted to the school. Of course, if my S had not liked the school with the high success rate, he would not have applied there and we would have taken our chances elsewhere. But he loved the school, applied ED and fortunately was accepted.</p>
<p>I don’t have a kid in this sport, but I do have one going to a NESCAC school in the fall. I wanted to agree with ReallyOK that ultimately what was tremendously helpful was the coach telling us his track record with admissions. One NESCAC coach told us that while he only had a couple of slots, an A-band athlete could feel pretty confident about admission, even without the slot, if the coach designated the athlete as a recruit. Another one told us that he had only ever had a single athlete denied by admissions–this is with his full support, presumably the athlete who was his number one pick–and in that case, the athlete had not written a very convincing application (perhaps self-sabotaging? who knows?).</p>
<p>At some point I do think it is appropriate to ask for specifics on how many athletes actually get in ED. A friend of my D got wait-listed at one NESCAC after many assurances and 11th hour encouraging texts from the coach. I have a feeling that this coach, who was relatively new to the school, didn’t have enough experience with that school and its system, whatever it was. She was accepted by a different NESCAC school where the coach has been in residence for over 20 (maybe over 30?) years and obviously knew the system inside and out, and could provide numbers on past admissions cycles. I think if the coach seems to have a good working relationship with admissions and can give you numbers, that counts for a lot.</p>
<p>Wow this thread is informative!</p>
<p>My son (an OL) is a rising junior. He has sent varsity highlights from his fresh and soph years as well as a combine/showcase reel. Most of this summer was spent working the camp circuit to include 3 D1 state universities, 2 ivies and 2 D1AA. Since he only stands 6’2", he has resigned himself to the fact that he is not a likely a big-time D1 recruit.</p>
<p>Thus far, three college coaches have contacted his high school coach (a D1AA state university, a Big East and a Patriot). Plus one Ivy mistakenly emailed my son directly indicating theyd like to continue with the recruiting process (they had him pegged as a rising senior oops!). </p>
<p>Given this background information, I have few questions for those of you who are further along in the process:</p>
<p> I understand coaches can begin sending recruiting materials on Sept 1st of your junior year. Should we hope for a full email inbox on the 1st? If there are no emails that day, should we be disappointed/discouraged?</p>
<p> Should we expect colleges with genuine interest will come to one of his games this season or is that more typical of your senior season? If they dont come, does that indicate they are not terribly interested?</p>
<p> My son has yet to take SAT/ACT. When should we anticipate coaches asking for standardized test scores?</p>
<p> When are Junior Day invitations sent? Am I correct in understanding they are typically held around February? Do all levels (D1 through D3) host Junior Days? Are these truly for top recruits/invitation-only or are they open to all juniors?</p>
<p>Sorry this is so long-winded but hoping you can glean some light on what to expect. Thanks in advance!</p>
<p>Hi PTMajor, you will get a ton of good information here.</p>
<p>Quick answers: </p>
<ol>
<li><p>Sept 1st and email … Don’t expect a lot, this is really the D1 date for major D1 ranked recruits already on the big football radar. You are right, for a 6’2" lineman you will be fishing in a different pond. For your guy, you will want to start contacting schools following the completion of your son’s junior season with links to highlight film which you should have online at YouTube or hudl.</p></li>
<li><p>Coaches really don’t travel to HS games anymore except perhaps for the D1 prospects. They do most recruiting through camps, film and good relationships with HS programs, and equally as important, through potential recruits contacting them first. With technology today there are just too many recruits to wade through, it is extremely helpful to know who likes them first as well as who they like.</p></li>
<li><p>Take the SAT as soon as you and son are comfortable he will get a good baseline. You can usually improve around 50 to 75 points with each successive taking. We had our son take them first in January junior year. Since you are not D1 it is kind of useless to target schools just yet without an SAT score since they are so important to non D1 big football programs.</p></li>
<li><p>Junior day invitations start early in spring if not before. Sometimes they are by mail, sometimes coaches visit schools, sometimes by email, even by text and often in response to sending an email to a school, linking to film, and filling out the school’s football questionnaire online. Don’t expect too much too early on. The junior days or clinics at campuses towards the mid to end of summer can be a lot more targeted since there is so much more information available to both sides … We attended a junior day at a major Ivy in April and there were 900 kids there, not even an opportunity to step into cleats. You can imagine that not much progress was made that day.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>Compare with sometimes only 30-40 kids at a prospect day later in the summer where all information and scores are in and coaches have already seen kids at camps. Now i would take an invitation to a prospect day in July or August over one in April any day.</p>
<p>Good luck and good for you for getting on the trail earlier than I did!</p>
<p>Thanks for the info although I will say I’m a bit disappointed. I was really hoping Sept 1st would serve as a gauge (which schools would be pursuing which players). </p>
<p>I am however, pleased to hear it’s safe to wait until mid-year for SATs. My son has done very little prep thus far. I originally thought we had to make a point of registering by Nov or so.</p>
<p>We had some positive experiences at the prospect days this summer. Son was able to get himself noticed at several. I think, in part, that was because the attendance was similar to what you described in your previous post (generally 15-20ish on the OL). I’m surprised to hear the Junior Day’s aren’t similar or smaller. </p>
<p>I suppose there’s not much more we can do now until junior films are ready. </p>
<p>Tick tock. Tick tock. :)</p>
<p>PT - junior days are smaller in the spring at the smaller football programs that are perhaps not on everyone’s first “wish list” … The kids that attend those have the advantage of really getting to know the football staff, who is full well aware that most of the kids they see have parents who want them to go Ivy. The ones at the Ivies are cattle calls in early spring. The hardest part, IMHO, is being completely honest with yourself about your player at your stage of tha game. You want to feel like the possibilities are limitless for as long as you can. Usually your player also knows no different and they will hear what adults are talking about.</p>
<p>I was not honest with myself early on. I am getting better as what other parents have told me would happen is happening to my son just like they said it would. I really think it will all work out for the best, but as you can tell from my posts, I had a very different perspective 2 months ago.</p>
<p>Understood. I think we are realistic about his skill level (based on his high school coach’s input as well as those colleges who contacted his HS coach). My concerns are with the Ivy’s that have demonstrated interest and my son’s ability to meet their academic requirements. I’m not convinced he’ll be able to meet the 2200+ mentioned in other threads which would take him out of the running anyway.</p>
<p>By no means is a 2200 SAT required for football recruits. Do not go by the non-football posts. Depending on gpa, the position and talent level, you can get by with 1900-2100. You need to look at the info on Ivy football banding and the Academic Index.</p>
<p>Also, just to be clear, the Ivies cast a VERY wide net with junior football players so be cautious. Some of the coaches will even tell you this, but some are pretty good at fluffing until they get you to their summer camp.</p>