Friend Got SCREWED OVER--Plz Read and Give Imput

Applying to College
1

<p>My friend's stats:</p>

<p>Female from Alabama
GPA: 4.4 W (full IB diploma/hardest possible classes)
RANK: 2/361
SCORES: 800M 740V</p>

<p>Countless awards and many areas of involvement.<br>
--National Merit Finalist
--AP Scholar w/ Distinction
--Hospital volunteering
--Piano awards
--Science research this summer in Boston.
--Mu Alpha Theta president
--Multicultural Club president
--Student Outreach for Religious Diversity founder and president</p>

<p>APPLIED TO: top schools such as Emory, Duke, HYP, MIT (2 sibs go there), Caltech, Columbia SEAS, as well as safeties</p>

<p>OKAY, here's the situation. My friend, who from the stats is extremely qualified, did not get into her top schools and right now, her situation isn't looking that great. As her friend, I've been trying to make sense of her admissions decisions as to why she did not get into at least one of her schools. </p>

<p>For Caltech and MIT: She did not take physics, which from what I heard is "strongly recommended" for applicants. She put down her major as "bioengineering." Could this have hurt her since she didn't take physics? ALSO, isn't it easier for girls to get into MIT and Caltech? Not that many girls are salutatorians w/ 1540s. Also, I should mention that she has two siblings at MIT and also had a great interview w/ them.</p>

<p>Columbia SEAS: Less selective than Caltech and MIT, so I thought her chances here were better. Her interviewer even said that she was great and that he hoped that she'd "choose Columbia over the other great schools she got into."</p>

<p>HYP: Of course, a crapshoot. These were for her, as well as for most everyone, a high reach.</p>

<p>Emory: I got in w/ a 4.01. She has a 4.4. There obviously had to be something wrong.</p>

<p>Duke: Many people from my school applied. But two candidates who were less qualified than my friend (one was a URM) both got in.</p>

<p>This leaves my head spinning and my friend w/o many options for next year. As we were trying to grasp at what could've possibly denied her her acceptances, we couldn't come to many strong conclusions. She had great grades, test scores, activities, essays, and teacher recs. And then we realized it--the school report. </p>

<p>Her counselor had mailed in much of her stuff late. Also, her brother asked around at MIT and said she did not have a great GC report. But the death blow came when a friend accidently found her school report (done by another school official).</p>

<p>This school report was horrible. In the Common App area where most school officials write a letter of rec for the student, this official had written two small paragraphs that basically said the student was only good at academics and was a disappointment to her teachers. This official also said that my friend gave her everything late, so she couldn't write an thorough report. Also, her checkmarks were not that high. And also, for the "how much do you endorse this candidate for admissions" the official put, "fairly strongly."</p>

<p>Her recommendation did not testify to the strengths of my friend at all. Everyone who knows her--teachers and students alike--know her to be hard-working and full of personality. I am starting to think that this school official did this partly to decrease my friend's chances b/c the school official has a "favorite" student to whom she had written AMAZING rec letters for and this "favorite" student was applying to many of my friend's schools (and she had lower grades/scores).</p>

<p>What are my friend's options? Taking a gap year is out of the question. I've suggested going to a school that's offering her great merit aid and then transferring, but is there ANY WAY to get back at the school official who did this to her? I mean, one that doesn't involve car paint and eggs...?</p>

<p>HELP.</p>

2

<p>I'm not good as her, but yea, I got rejected from most of my schools. Per se, 13 out of my 19 colleges. I only got into my 'safeties' and one match, and waitlisted at another school I thought I was a match for.
Good thing I had applied to 19, or else I'd be in the same boast as your friend.</p>

<p>Um. Yea, she should've had some safety schools. But yes, I know should've. I feel sympathy for her not getting in. She's certainly qualified. Such a sad thing to happen.</p>

<p>Why is a gap year out of the question?
I think the merit aid giving school is a good choice. Whether she will transfer or not is up to her, but I see nothing wrong with a school giving money.</p>

3

<p>wow, i'm really sorry, I don't know what to say... that really really sucks</p>

<p>She did get into her safties right? I guess she could try and transfer to a better school next year...</p>

4

<p>Was she waitlisted at any of these schools? If so, then she should try to obtain additional excellent teacher recommendations to submit. I would also suggest that her parent contact the school principal about the school report and try to get a new one written (by someone different!).</p>

<p>If there are no waitlists, I would still suggest that one or both of her parents talk to the principal about the school recommendation. If what you say is true, then the counselor did something very, very wrong.</p>

5

<p>I think that you may have found the answer in your post.</p>

<p>(her stuff going in late would have not hurt her as in the worse case, the school would have requested a fax).</p>

<p>Grades/ test scores are just one part of the equation, it could have been her essays, interview, and wht you just wrote about, her recommendations.</p>

<p>
[quote]
This school report was horrible. In the Common App area where most school officials write a letter of rec for the student, this official had written two small paragraphs that basically said the student was only good at academics and was a disappointment to her teachers. This official also said that my friend gave her everything late, so she couldn't write an thorough report.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>IF this is true about your friend it is a very telling statement. While she may indeed be very book smart, she may not be applying her self to the best of her ability: turning stuff in late, not taking care in her report writing (although she has never been penalized for it)</p>

<p>
[quote]
but is there ANY WAY to get back at the school official who did this to her?

[/quote]
</p>

<p>It could end up back firing in her face, risking her chance at graduation and her going to her remaining school.</p>

6

<p>
[quote]
This official also said that my friend gave her everything late, so she couldn't write an thorough report.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>So, did your friend really give everything late or is the person lying?</p>

7

<p>I don't really understand the reason for GC reports, since in large high schools the GC probably hasn't even interacted with the student more than once or twice. While I think they should comment on things like how rigorous the student's course load was compared to school offerings, I don't think they should be asked to comment on the student's personal qualities. The only advantage to GC reports, I guess, is that the student doesn't have the option to choose among a group of individuals and select only the ones who will likely give the best recommendations, as is the case with teacher recs. Your GC is your GC and that's it. But of course that only works well if the GC has some basis for comment. Maybe this is one way colleges hope they'll find out any negative things they wouldn't ordinarily? That may be what happened to your friend, or it may be she was really treated unjustly.</p>

<p>We know of a case where a student asked his favorite teacher in his strongest subject for a rec. Now this teacher happened to have a son of the same age in the same school. The student never gave it a thought, since the teacher's son was not as well qualified and presumbaly wouldn't be applying to the same tier of schools, and also because the son was interested in a completely diffferent major. Well, it turned out the son was indeed applying to all the same colleges as the other student, and they actually had the same top choices. After all the recs were sent, the teacher remarked that when she was writing the recs, she kept on wanting to add little asides like "My son too!" Obviously, the student worried that she may not have given him the best possible rec. Since we all know that colleges don't like to accept more than a few students from one HS, I think that teacher should have declined due to conflict of interest.</p>

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<p>The GFG:</p>

<p>The Guidance counselor report isn't just designed to let colleges know the terrible stuff. It's also an opportunity for guidance counselors to let the college know about important extenuating circumstances that teachers might not know about or might not think it is their place to write about.</p>

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<p>OP is saying that none of what the GC wrote is true. If that's correct, and the GC purposely wrote a negative recommendation when the girl in fact deserved an excellent recommendation--then, in my opinion as a mother, it is time for the girl's parents to get involved. In my DD's school, there is a head of guidance who oversees the GCs. In other schools, the supervisor might be the principal or vice principal. </p>

<p>The parents need to ask for copies of the recommendations (which it seems to me they should be entitled to after the fact). They shouldn't say that they KNOW the GC gave the girl a negative report--just that they are still confused and upset by the girl's rejections from top colleges and they would like to get the full picture on her application. </p>

<p>Then they will have to approach the GC's supervisor. Even if the guidance department will not surrender copies of the recommendations, the head of guidance should look at the recommendations to see what might have caused the problem. </p>

<p>The head of guidance might be able to make an appeal on behalf of the girl if she sees that the GC has done something inappropriate or possibly even illegal. In any case the GC should get called on the carpet by her supervisor and made to answer for her actions. </p>

<p>Let us know what happens.</p>

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<p>Well, some tact is definitely needed here. Don't offend the administration or counselor because many schools want a guidance counselor report for transfer students as well as incoming freshmen. </p>

<p>I would ask the GC to review the file with the student, her parents, and possibly a family advisor if there is any language barrier for the parents. If you find a highly negative report, that would be the time to consult the head of guidance counseling or the principal.</p>

<p>Remember that this student sent in more than a GC's report - she also sent in two recommendations from teachers who knew her well. Don't be too quick to assume that it was those two unsupportive paragraphs from the GC that did her in.</p>

<p>In addition, she should contact Emory and ask about her rejection. I wouldn't advise this except in this rare case where it seems they might have rejected her because they didn't want to be used as a safety school. She may be able to make her case and get on the waitlist there.</p>

11

<p>Did your friend do any sports or extra curricular activities?</p>

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<p>One of the things that I was reading this morning is that a lot of young women took a hit in the admissions process because of a shortage of men.</p>

<p>keep in mind, that schools are not at a loss for "smart applicants with great grades and great scores". Unless you what you posted is just a partial listing of her accomplishments, there are going to were probably a lot of applications that looked just like hers and there is nothing that is really stands out. (If she is an unhooked applicant, this really does not help her cause)</p>

<p>Remember schools build well rounded classes of students from all walks of life becasue education takes place both inside and outside of the classroom.</p>

13

<p>Yes, Sybbie, her gender may have indeed been a factor. Isn't it ironic that 30-40 years ago, girls faced additional challenges when applying to colleges because men thought them inferior academically, and now girls face more odds against them because they are TOO well-prepared academically?</p>

<p>Anyway, back to the OP. Your friends and her parents may not be able to see the recommendations after the fact because your friend probably signed waivers. However, her parents should go to the principal (or whoever oversees the GC), and demand an evaluation of what was sent from the HS to the colleges. They should ask specifically for the principal to look for anything that was erroneous, malicious, or possibly a conflict of interest. If the principal finds anything shaky (he might not admit it, though, so they should prepare for this), then they should demand that her schools be contract BY PHONE AND BY THE PRINCIPAL.</p>

<p>In the meantime, your friend can contact the admissions departments of her top schools to find out why she was rejected. If it points in any way to the school report, she and her parents should use it as ammunition.</p>

<p>Good luck to her!</p>

14

<p>Tread lightly here...about contacting admissions offices. It could look like other people are picking-up the mess for the student. And, if she did indeed turn stuff in late, it would REINFORCE what the GC wrote. Also, if the teacher recs were less than very good to excellent, there is an issue of cooberating 'evidence'.</p>

<p>Also, be very careful not to agitate too much because if she decides to transfer, she'll still need the support of her HS.</p>

<p>Just an opinion.
IB</p>

15

<p>
[quote]
this official had written two small paragraphs that basically said the student was only good at academics and was a disappointment to her teachers.</p>

<p>Her recommendation did not testify to the strengths of my friend at all. Everyone who knows her--teachers and students alike--know her to be hard-working and full of personality.

[/quote]
</p>

<p>Both of these statements could be true especially if a teacher feels that although your friend is smart, they don't think that she is proactive, takes risk (always does what is told and does not go the extra mile), challenges her self or is living up to her full potential.</p>

16

<p>Seems like the same thing that happened to my D (except her SAT score wasn't as high). She got rejected from all of her match/reach schools except Emory. She (we) was devastated and didn't understand (still don't). After reading the Emory posts, I've come to realize there are many in exactly the same place; some are in worse places as they didn't even get into 1 match school. While I too think that the GC didn't do my D any great shakes, I am at least grateful that she did get into Emory. We are visiting next week and I hope my D likes it.</p>

<p>Looks like we'll be seeing your friend at Emory next Fall. Emory IS and excellent school and your friend will find her place there amongst similar students.</p>

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<p>Fireflyscout: I know for a fact she was waitlisted at MIT. If anyone has the MIT waitlist stats from previous years, please feel free to share w/ me. I think she is going to try to get additional teacher recs. I will share with her your idea of having her parents call to get an additional report sent. Thanks.</p>

<p>Sybbie719: Yeah, I think we've ruled out letting officials know about this report because I agree, it wasn't appropriate that we found out about it and that my friend could get in major trouble for it. My friend is extremely book smart, but she said her teacher recs also pointed to things outside the classroom.</p>

<p>BlueAlien01: I think my friend was guilty of turning things in a bit late. However, I'm not really sure about it. I know that her real counselor was not at school, so she had to desperately get this school official to complete the report.</p>

<p>Wackymother: Thanks for your advice. I'll relay it to my friend.</p>

<p>Xcutioners: Yes, my friend was very involved with many different activities ranging from robotics, Science Olympiad (state and national SO), scientific research, cultural activities and government activities. She had several leadership positions (including president of Mu Alpha Theta).</p>

<p>Thanks for all the imput and advice everyone!</p>

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<p>Can't your friend say that she heard from someone in the admissions office, who let it slip about the reports, and with that information, she wants to see them</p>

<p>If they stonewall her, what does she have to lose?</p>