Geology list, and reasonable to limit based on this?

College Search & Selection
1

<p>I have grown very interested in geology. I can really see myself majoring in it. Turns out, my AP Chem teacher has a degree in geology and has spoken to us about it. I am very interested now. I think this might be the direction I go. And i have been thinking about it for a while now, I am just now posting. I am 80-90% certain I will go in this direction. </p>

<p>Is it reasonable then, to now limit my search to only colleges that offer this major? I had a few schools on my list that did not offer this major (Hendrix, Austin College, and Rhodes) so I would cross those off. The ones I have already applied to were TAMU (already admitted), Baylor (already admitted), Ut Austin, UT Dallas, Rice University, and Trinity University. </p>

<p>I am thinking of adding in OU and Sewanee. Are there any other schools I should seriously consider? I am pretty much wrapping this up now. And I wanted to stay closer to home and I live in North Texas. And I need financial aid. I am very unsure about OU and Sewanee because I am wondering if the schools I already applied to are going to be more likely, as far as good programs or financial aid. But I am unsure completely. </p>

<p>Ok, those are a couple questions. I am not positive I will do geology, but, I am very very interested.</p>

2

<p>Consider small colleges in the Keck Geology Consortium:
[Keck</a> Geology Consortium](<a href=“http://www.keckgeology.org/]Keck”>http://www.keckgeology.org/)
These schools span a fairly wide range of locations and selectivity.</p>

<p>One factor you might want to consider is the opportunities for field work.
Colorado College is especially well-located for that, and its one-course-at-a-time Block Plan creates a lot of flexibility to schedule off-campus study. Carleton and Colorado College have 2 of the highest rates of alumni PhD production in geology (according to NSF data available at webcaspar.com).</p>

<p>The Keck colleges that claim to cover 100% of determined financial need are:
Amherst
Carleton
Colgate
Macalester
Mt. Holyoke
Oberlin
Pomona
Smith
Washington & Lee
Wesleyan
Williams</p>

<p>Colorado College claims to meet about 99% of demonstrated need, but is need-aware in admissions. Of the above schools, Macalester and the women’s colleges (Smith, Mt. Holyoke) are a bit less selective than the others.</p>

3

<p>For financial aid estimates, run the net price calculator on each school’s web site. Schools that “meet full need” won’t necessarily give the same net price for you as each other.</p>

4

<p>^ True. But that does not necessarily mean that even the least generous of them won’t give you a better deal than schools that do NOT claim to cover 100%. </p>

<p>You’re likely to see variations not only between schools in this group, but also from one income bracket to another. That is, school X may have a lower net than school Y for a $50K family income, but school Y may have a lower net for a $100K income.</p>

<p>So yes, run the NPCs with the most detailed, up to date data you can provide.</p>

5

<p>You might want to take a look at the curriculum and be sure the college offers a BS, not a BA. You should be required to take Calculus through Differential Equations, a year of physics and a year of chemistry. Then the required course list in your major should include at a minimum physical geology, historical geology, mineralogy, petrology, geophysics, geochemistry, and structural geology. I have recently seen degree plans that just aren’t rigorous enough if your intent is to be a geologist. Many small colleges, and other schools that offer only a BA, have only a small selection of geology courses and don’t require enough math, chemistry and physics. (However, if you wish to be a high school earth science teacher, or do something else other than work as a professional geologist, a BA may be fine.)</p>

6

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<p>However, it does not mean that a school claiming to “meet full need” is more generous than one that does not.</p>

<p>For example, consider school A and school B, both with list prices of $60,000. School A claims to “meet full need”, while school B does not. Let’s say that both expect a student contribution (ESC) of $7,000 per year.</p>

<p>But, using different methodology for the same student, school A calculates an EFC of $40,000, while school B calculates an EFC of $20,000.</p>

<p>Let’s say school A offers a $13,000 (= $60,000 - $40,000 - $7,000) financial aid grant to “meet full need” with a net price of $47,000. Let’s say school B gaps the student by $10,000, offering a $23,000 (= $60,000 - $20,000 - $7,000 - $10,000) financial aid grant, giving a net price of $37,000.</p>

<p>Here, we see that school B is more generous and cheaper, even though it does not “meet full need” that school A claims to do.</p>

<p>There are also schools that do not claim to “meet full need” for everyone, but may do so for certain subsets of students (e.g. in-state students at some public universities, schools where financial aid is partially merit based, resulting in (for example) “meeting full need” for students with >=3.5 HS GPA but not others, etc.).</p>

7

<p>Re: BS vs. BA</p>

<p>The title of the degree does not matter as much as the actual curriculum. A BA degree at one school may require more in-depth math and science than a BS degree at a different school.</p>

8

<p>True, ucbalumnus, but not typical in geology. Many schools offer both a BA and a BS, some schools offer one or the other. Generally, they are very different degrees.</p>

9

<p>^^ Are those real examples? Or are they hypothetical, speculative examples?</p>

<p>If a school claiming to meet 100% of demonstrated need is being accurate in its CDS reporting, it should mean that it is, on average, more generous with n-b FA than one that claims to meet less than 100% of need. In estimating net costs using collegeabacus.com and IPEDS, I’ve found that full need schools repeatedly come out with lower net costs than other schools. However, I’ve only tested a small subset this way; there are a lot of colleges out there and many different need scenarios … so, your mileage may vary. And I don’t doubt there is room to tighten up standards so that “meeting full need” has a more consistent meaning.</p>

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<p>So we sometimes refer to “need-blind, full-need schools”. Such a college would purport to meet full demonstrated need of ALL admitted students. Many of the 50-60 colleges that claim to cover 100% of demonstrated need also claim to be need-blind (or are need-aware only in a small number of borderline cases).</p>

10

<p>A better question is whether the OP will Qualify for the FA s/he thinks is needed. Many students say FA when their parents are well into middle income and they really need merit $.</p>

11

<p>They are hypothetical speculative examples, but some students have posted net price calculator results from various “meet full need” schools which varied by over $10,000 in net price.</p>

<p>Granted, the “meet full need” school that is worse than a school that does not “meet full need” may be uncommon, but it is not impossible, so the student should run the net price calculator on every school, rather than assuming financial aid generosity on the basis of a “meet full need” claim.</p>

12

<p>There is a bigger difference than that. Of the schools that claimed to meet need, I have found, using my own numbers, a more than $17,000 difference per year from the school that ended up with the least vs the most.</p>

13

<p>geologist and employer here. I second ucbalumnus’ post 7…BA or BS doesn’t matter, but I definitely go through the transcript to assess BS-equivalency. I recruit at a number of schools, like Colgate and Pomona, with fantastic geology departments, but where only BA’s are awarded.</p>

14

<p>I read recently that Colorado has more kinds of rock than any other state. Regardless, I’ve seen Colorado’s rocks and they are spectacular and varied. I’d certainly look at Boulder and Colorado State as well as Colorado College. Some of those professors wrote the book on geology. And Xmas Break in Colorado is pretty spectacular itself. We used to love to watch flatlanders trying to ski.</p>

15

<p>Keep the schools coming! The Keck Consortium seems to be all LACs. I would love it if someone would list even more more (esp. Northeast schools) that are known for geology. My younger son is only a high school sophomore, but is interested in geology as well, and it’s not a field I am familiar with.</p>

<p>P.S. BA vs BS does not really matter in a lot of fields, in my experience</p>

16

<p>You should consider University of Alaska Fairbanks, i just applied today myself. Its most well known majors are geology and petroleum engineering, so if living in the arctic sounds fun, then check it out! there’s no essay required, and plenty of other majors to switch to if you end up not liking geology.</p>

17

<p>Top 10 Universities and Top 10 LACs for PhD Production in Earth Sciences, 2007-2011</p>

<p>Key to Columns
A = number of PhDs earned by alumni in Earth Sciences, 2007-20011 (source: National Science Foundation, webcaspar.com)
B = undergraduate enrollment (source: Wikipedia, usually for 2012)
C = school name (names in bold are Keck Consortium colleges)</p>

<p>A … B … C
32 2100 Carleton College
29 6100 Brown University
27 26000 University of California-Berkeley
23 1000 California Institute of Technology
21 25000 University of Colorado at Boulder
19 22000 University of California-Santa Barbara
18 2000 Colorado College
18 28000 University of Michigan at Ann Arbor
17 14000 Cornell University, All Campuses
17 7200 Harvard University
17 4200 Colorado School of Mines
16 39200 Pennsylvania State U, Main Campus
11 2100 Williams College
11 2900 Colgate University
11 2900 Oberlin College
10 1500 Whitman College
10 1600 Pomona College
9 1800 Amherst College
9 2000 Macalester College
8 2300 Franklin and Marshall College</p>

<p>Note: this is NOT a list of the top 20 schools for PhD production in Earth Sciences. </p>

<p>The following universities generated between 12 and 16 PhDs in this period (and so would “rank” between Penn State and Williams in absolute number of doctorates):
University of Florida
University of Texas at Austin
University of Washington - Seattle
College of William and Mary
Michigan State University
Stanford University
University of Arizona
University of California-Los Angeles
Rice University
University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
University of Rochester
Brigham Young University, Main Campus
University of California-Santa Cruz
Dartmouth College</p>

<p>The following universities generated between 8 and 11 doctorates:
University of Wisconsin-Madison
Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State Univ
University of Nebraska at Lincoln
SUNY at Buffalo
Arizona State University Main
Boston University
Princeton University
University of Minnesota - Twin Cities
University of Oregon
Colorado State University
Ohio State University, Main Campus
University of California-Davis
University of Chicago
University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill
University of Tennessee at Knoxville
Yale University
University of Oklahoma, Norman Campus
University of Missouri, Rolla</p>

18

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<p>Correct. It is a consortium of small liberal arts colleges, “focused on enriching undergraduate education through development of high-quality research experience”.</p>

<p>Notice that every single LAC in the list above is a Keck Consortium member.</p>

19

<p>I can’t speak for the other campuses, but keep in mind that OU (and from what I understand UT/TAMU) specifically discourages the phD route and instead heavily encourage students to get a masters since that’s generally the highest degree needed for a job in oil.</p>