Georgetown vs WashU vs Cornell vs McGill

College Search & Selection
1

<p>Hi All,</p>

<p>This is a wonderful forum and I have enjoyed reading all (most) of the comments!</p>

<p>My daughter has been accepted at all 4 and she is leaning towards medicine - perhaps with international health + public policy slant.</p>

<p>They are sooo expensive (actually they all are - sigh)</p>

<p>How do these colleges compare
1) academically challenging
2) Name recognition/Value
3) opportunities and
4) Prospects after graduation (how do they do after?) and
5) How is the undergraduate program valued when applying for post-graduate degrees?</p>

<p>Comments and advice from past and present students would be especially awesome!!</p>

<p>Thanks in advance.</p>

2

<p>Georgetown is great for international health! Your daughter has three options available if she’s interested in international health:</p>

<p>-Does she want a mix of health sciences (anatomy and physiology, human microbiology, human growth and development, chemistry, nutrition), public health courses (global patterns of disease, demography, health promotion and disease prevention, epidemiology) , internships built into the major, and a practical experience abroad, also built into the major? Then she’d like the International Health major in the School of Nursing and Health Studies.</p>

<p>-Does she want more of a basic science foundation (General Biology, General Chemistry, Organic Chemistry, Genetics, Biochemistry, Virology), mixed with science focused public health courses? Then she’d like the Biology of Global Health major in Georgetown College.</p>

<p>-Does she want a stronger focus on the international realm, mixing technology and science, as well as strong preparation in language and economics? Then she’d like the Science, Technology and International Affairs (STIA) major, with a concentration in International Health, in the School of Foreign Service.</p>

<p>Georgetown is great for all things international. Cornell is probably the strongest in the sciences. Georgetown has so many options in international health available that simply aren’t found at most other schools. Many go on to work for WHO, CDC, World Bank, Peace Corp, etc., as well as professional schools like (from last year’s International Health graduating class) Johns Hopkins School of Public Health, Harvard Medical School, Georgetown Medical School, University of Illinois Medical School, NYU Physical Therapy, London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine, etc.</p>

3

<p>I would go to Cornell.</p>

4

<p>I go to McGill but I wanted to go to Georgetown. Gtown’s a better school, and it’s perfect for what your daughter wants. Cornell and WashU are good but their locations are terrible.</p>

<p>It’s very hard to get a high GPA in sciences at McGill, BTW…average GPA is ~2.7.</p>

5

<p>I’m neutral party. I didn’t even apply to any of these schools, but I looked at them. Here’s what I think in a nutshell.</p>

<p>Georgetown isn’t exactly great for the sciences. McGill’s reputation is weak in the United States, esp. in the south and west. Plus they have a huge student:faculty ratio. Cornell is a great school, but Ithaca is cold and depressing for half the year. While St. Louis isn’t DC or Montreal, it’s better than Upstate NY. Plus, WashU is known for quality of life and exceptional undergraduate experience/education. I’d go to WashU. From there, my order would be Cornell, then G’town, then McGill.</p>

6

<p>yes, Cornell and WashU definitely have better science facilities than Georgetown. However if your daughter is really interested in international health/policy, Georgetown has the most opportunities in that field. If you search my previous posts you’ll see that Cornell was my top choice school, they gave me a “guaranteed transfer offer” (go to another school for a year, and if you have a 3.2 GPA you will be accepted to CAS as a transfer student). I went to Georgetown intending to do that, but decided against it because of the coursework in international health and human health sciences that I took, as they were simply things that I could not focus on there, as well as the smaller science/pre-med population, which allowed for more individual attention as well as lots of research opportunities from freshman year (including a great Medical Center right on campus, with an early admission program).</p>

7

<p>My recommendation would be in favor of Cornell over WashU. Cornell is very strong in the sciences (amongst other things), and they send more students to med school each year than any other university. Also, Cornell has never “gamed” the rankings systems over the last 15 years, in the way that WashU has, in order to improperly push themselves higher on the problematic USNWR rankings system. Furthermore, Cornell’s campus is remarkably beautiful, and Ithaca is not at all as remote as many people claim. Ithaca is a quirky and artistic small city with many wonderful restaurants and interesting places to shop. Lastly, in terms of name recognition, Cornell is the only Ivy on your list, not that it should really matter though, because in my opinion Cornell University stands well enough on it’s own merits.</p>

8

<p>Dude, wanna buy a ShamWow?</p>

<p>BTW, I’d choose between G’Town or Cornell.</p>

9

<p>Cornell/Georgetown
WashU</p>

<p>McGill</p>

<p>In that order.</p>

<p>Cornell because of the great sciences and policy management programs available, as well as awesome focus on research, ties with Georgetown’s specific program strengths in International Policy and relatively good strength in sciences (though nothing superb) and its wonderful abundance of related internships available in DC.</p>

<p>WashU in second. Great school, but little internships of this nature at St. Louis +, the name recognition needed to bounce into the international field is relatively lesser than that of Cornell Georgetown or even McGill.</p>

<p>McGill comes last because of the larger size, and the lesser value of a McGill degree in the United States. For undergrads, it is definitely not the best place to be.</p>

10

<p>@nikihana - regarding your question #4:</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>One measure relating to this question can be found in the Wall Street Journal’s data on post-collegiate salaries. Cornell’s position on this list is relatively high:</p>

<p>[Post-College</a> Earnings Data from the WSJ](<a href=“http://online.wsj.com/public/resources/documents/info-Salaries_for_Colleges_by_Type-sort.html]Post-College”>WSJ.com)</p>

11

<p>This would come down to Georgetown and Cornell for me, and Georgetown would win due to its location. Cornell is a fantastic choice, though, if your student doesn’t need a big city.</p>

12

<p>Hope2getrice’s analysis is pretty much dead on. If your daughter were interested in just medicine, I would say WashU (it’s like Shangri-La for pre-meds), but the international component would be stronger at Georgetown/Cornell.</p>

13

<p>Thank you all for your comments and feedback! </p>

<p>When we visited the G’Town campus the facilities seemed a tad bare but NHS was impressive, especially the HHS dept. We were a little concerned about the freshman dorms - are freshman dorms the same everywhere?</p>

<p>She seems set on Georgetown, though.</p>

14

<p>I’m glad she’s set on Georgetown! NHS is awesome for international health if that’s the school she’ll be in. The Human Science Molecular/Cellular Biology Lab is very new, with state of the art equipment. There’s also the patient simulator, GUS, that is available for some of the international health and human science courses. The other science facilities are functional but nothing special. Organic Chemistry labs are new and on the Medical campus (right next to NHS), so you probably didn’t get to see those.</p>

<p>Also, there’s a great summer program that your daughter may be interested in after her freshman year (the required courses are done freshman year). It’s the Translational Health Science Internship, in Buenos Aires, Argentina. It mixes basic health sciences and public health. The focus is on pediatric respiratory infections. Students study the diseases in the lecture setting, as well as in the laboratory, getting the basic science background in the disease processes. They then work with physicians and nurses in the community that specialize in such diseases, and really learn how the knowledge they gain in the classroom applies in the real world setting, and the impact such diseases have in Argentina. Students can then continue research in those diseases in NHS with the professor in charge of the program.</p>

<p>[Georgetown</a> University Nursing and Health Studies](<a href=“http://nhs.georgetown.edu/humanscience/argentina.html]Georgetown”>http://nhs.georgetown.edu/humanscience/argentina.html) </p>

<p>What were your concerns with the freshman dorms? Which did you see? Feel free to PM me for more info. I think they are above average, and better than some I’ve seen. I did a summer program at Yale, and the freshman dorm I stayed in was like a closet. There also wasn’t air conditioning. All Georgetown residences have air conditioning units within the rooms/apartments/suites. New South was recently renovated, and is the traditional, long hallway dorm. It also has wireless everywhere. Harbin was where I lived, and the rooms were decent sized, and you shared a bathroom with a small group of people. Village C West has private bathrooms, but the rooms are smaller because of that. Darnall I don’t remember (I stayed there for a summer program as well, but didn’t go there after that), but it vaguely seems similar to New South. You can get cable TV in the rooms, each student has an ethernet connection, and there’s a computer lab in each dorm. Each floor also has a common room.</p>

15

<p>"I go to McGill but I wanted to go to Georgetown. Gtown’s a better school, and it’s perfect for what your daughter wants. Cornell and WashU are good but their locations are terrible.</p>

<p>It’s very hard to get a high GPA in sciences at McGill, BTW…average GPA is ~2.7. "</p>

<p>Welcome to a Canadian university. :)</p>

16

<p>Cornell, McGill, Georgetown… is this order.</p>

17

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<p>Curiously, McGill has a [much better reputation](<a href=“http://www.topuniversities.com/worlduniversityrankings/results/2008/overall_rankings/top_100_universities/”>http://www.topuniversities.com/worlduniversityrankings/results/2008/overall_rankings/top_100_universities/&lt;/a&gt;) internationally than either Georgetown or WUSTL, especially in [life sciences](<a href=“http://www.topuniversities.com/worlduniversityrankings/results/2008/subject_rankings/life_sciences_biomedicine/”>http://www.topuniversities.com/worlduniversityrankings/results/2008/subject_rankings/life_sciences_biomedicine/&lt;/a&gt;). In fact, I guess very few people overseas know WUSTL, while McGill on the other hand is very well-known.</p>

<p>Anyway, I guess Americans have a tendency to belittle all things Canadian. I wonder why.</p>

18

<p>Thanks JasonHoya! We heard a lot about Georgetown internships but it is nice to hear the same from a student :-)</p>

<p>I understand the rigorous education in HHS and NHS - but…
when you apply to med schools after Georgetown, do they rate it as equivalent to a tier-1 schools (for pre-med), in terms of preparation and prestige?</p>

19

<p>Haha, that “international ranking” website has little credibility, especially when Pitt, Purdue, Minnesota, Boston U, Georgia Tech, etc. are part of the Top 100, and Georgetown isn’t on the list at all. I’m pretty sure this list has been discussed before.</p>

<p>Georgetown overall is known as a top tier school, with an 18-19% acceptance rate, and is seen as being very similar with schools like Cornell, Penn, Brown, etc. (what some on here call the "lower Ivies after HYP). As far as preparation, well for pre-med, any 4 year school will prepare you for any medical school, as far as, the pre-med requirements don’t necessarily prepare you for medical school (you learn everything you need to know in medical school), but are more like “weed out” courses, especially Organic Chemistry. And the rigor of Georgetown is definitely known to medical schools (there is no grade inflation in the sciences at Georgetown, just look at reviews for Alan Angerio at ratemyprofessors.com for example). Out of people I know, last year there were students accepted and attending Harvard, Northwestern, Johns Hopkins, Georgetown, Illinois, NYMC, George Washington, Maryland, Boston University, University of Chicago, Tufts, and UMass Medical Schools. Georgetown also has an Early Assurance Program (EAP) where you apply to Georgetown School of Medicine after sophomore year, and if you have high grades, good interview, and a reason why you want to be accepted early (if you have a research project you want to do during senior year, or a study abroad project, etc.), you can be admitted to GU Med School and don’t have to take the MCAT.
So, while Georgetown isn’t known for sciences, they are a hidden gem at Georgetown (browse the Gtown forums for statements by other actual science majors), there are many options for majors, research opportunities both in the undergrad departments and in the Medical Center right next door, volunteer opportunities both with the GU Hospital, other hospitals throughout DC, and the Georgetown EMS program, which allows students to become EMTs and runs 2 full service ambulances, unlike most other collegiate EMS programs, providing a great pre-hospital medical experience.</p>

20

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<p>I’m not a big rating guy but The Times World Rankings has Harvard, Yale, Cambridge, Oxford, Cal Tech (1 through 5) on their list and it has “little credibility” because Georgetown is not on the top hundred? How about Georgetown did not meet or compete in the selection criteria while other top U.S. schools did very well?</p>