Great ACT score, GPA... *feh*...Advice?

Paying for College
1

<p>Looking for advice....</p>

<p>DS2, a rising senior, just got his ACT score -- 31! That's the 97th percentile for this year's students. Yay!!</p>

<p>His SAT was 1920, which is in the 89th percentile, I think.</p>

<p>But, his GPA is just 3.31 (UNweighted), 3.6 weighted. He's already taken four AP classes, and will have two next year. Extracurriculars are: Captain of the Model UN Team, leader of the Debate Team, leader of a Christian club at school, member of BETA club, and many service / volunteer hours. Also works 20 hours / week. Ran Cross Country two times.</p>

<p>We'll almost certainly qualify for need-based aid, but we'll also need more help than that.</p>

<p>We live in northern Virginia, but he's open to going anywhere.</p>

<p>Any advice on where he might look, and what our chances might be for any significant scholarships? A private Christian school would be ideal, but he's open to anything. He's a very sociable guy. Politically he's very conservative, so he wouldn't be happy at a campus with a strong liberal atmosphere.</p>

2

<p>You’ll find lots of ideas if you go to the Parent Forum, and look at the top for “Class of 20XX forum” - Under that heading is a current thread for Parents of 3.0 - 3.3 gpa Class of 2014, and for the class that just graduated from high school.</p>

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<p>If money is an issue, start with the new sticky thread here:
<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/1523536-website-calculates-automatic-full-tuition-scholarships.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/1523536-website-calculates-automatic-full-tuition-scholarships.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Then go read all of the threads started by BobWallace on various types of merit-based scholarships. Yes, your son does qualify for a bunch of them.</p>

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<p>Here is an older thread by a parent of some students who were not what seem to be the typical CC overachievers. Read through the process she used.</p>

<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/291483-update-what-i-learned-about-free-ride-scholarships.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/291483-update-what-i-learned-about-free-ride-scholarships.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

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<p>We’ll almost certainly qualify for need-based aid, but we’ll also need more help than that.</p>

<p>That sounds like you want to stack need based aid with merit based aid to reduce your family contribution. That won’t work. </p>

<p>What is your situation? Do you know what your EFC would be? How much can you pay each year? Also be aware that most schools don’t meet need.</p>

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<p>Looks like your older son is at Bama on the NMF scholarship:</p>

<p>*Our DS is also a NMSF from the northern VA area, and he was granted 36 hours of credit for his AP and CLEP tests. He is having the time of his life!!! He is THRILLED to be there. Roll Tide!!
*</p>

<p>Is S2 going to test again? Getting an ACT 32 might bring in a lot more money.</p>

<p>If S2 is going to be a Eng’g or Comp Sci major, then he would get free tuition plus 2500 per year from Bama with his current score.</p>

<p>What is your EFC with one son in college?</p>

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<p>THANK YOU so much, everyone! I came to the right place – so much good info here. The website with the merit aid calculator was very helpful. We’re taking a look at some of those schools. Several of them would give him a completely free ride (tuition, fees, housing, & food).</p>

<p>Is S2 going to test again? Getting an ACT 32 might bring in a lot more money.</p>

<p>Yes, he is planning to test again, but from the merit scholarship calculator, a 32 wouldn’t bump him up much except it would bring Louisiana Tech into play.</p>

<p>If S2 is going to be a Eng’g or Comp Sci major, then he would get free tuition plus 2500 per year from Bama with his current score.</p>

<p>DS2 would LOVE to go to Bama!! Unfortunately, he’s not a great candidate for either of those eminently employable majors. :slight_smile: Even with tuition and housing, he could never afford the fees, meals, and books.</p>

<p>What is your EFC with one son in college?
This next year, our EFC will be very low, because right now (tax year 2013) our income is extremely low, we will still have his older brother at Bama, and there are two younger siblings currently being homeschooled. I don’t know what will happen after this year, if our income were to rise at all, like if I went back to work.</p>

<p>It doesn’t matter what our EFC is, because DH and I have not one dime to contribute. Barely making ends meet, even being as careful as we are with the budget. What we contribute to our kids is help, love, support, encouragement, strategy, info, insight, and helping navigate the waters when they get choppy or confusing.</p>

<p>All of DS2’s test scores are tugged down by significantly lower math scores. The math dept at his high school is the worst on planet earth. Do NOT get me started!! “Oooh, you’re a winning football coach? You’re hired!!–<em>POOF</em> now you’re a math teacher, too!”</p>

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<p>So, it seems that your kids will qualify for Pell Grants? right? A split low EFC between two kids?</p>

<p>If he bumps his ACT to a 32, then he gets free tuition at Bama no matter what his major is. With a Pell grant, a $5500 student loan, and some summer earnings, he might be able to pay for Bama…if he was willing to work part time during the school year for pocket money. It is EASIER with two kids at the SAME school. Believe me! lol</p>

<p>What is his major and career goal?</p>

<p>I doubt any privates are going to give him a free ride or near free ride unless it’s really a low quality school. </p>

<p>The English section on the ACT is one of the easier places to improve one’s score. The Math isn’t high level…has he used a practice book?</p>

9

<p>Thanks for your help, mom2collegekids!</p>

<p>So far, DS1 at Bama has received some Pell Grants, and is also taking loans. He did receive a very generous NMSF award (tuition, housing, laptop, & stipend), but he still has to take out loans to pay books, fees, and meal plan. He works every summer & usually Christmas break. When I say we have NO money, I’m not kidding. We rent out a room to help make ends meet. DH is a brilliant, gifted, wonderful man who chose to work for a charity and let’s just say he’s not in it for the money. KWIM?</p>

<p>DS2 would be thrilled to be at Bama. [We took him with us to Parents Weekend, and he LOVED the whole SEC football experience!] And wherever he goes, we’re fairly confident that DS2 will also receive help from the Pell Grant program, for the first year. But after that, all bets are off, because our income may rise slightly. If he didn’t qualify for a Pell after his freshman year, then he’d be stranded at Bama (and spoiled LOL) with no way to pay for continuing there. </p>

<p>As most of us know, if you earn a middle-class income, you’re stuck in no-man’s land… too poor to pay for school, too well-off to earn any real financial aid. And DS2 isn’t excited about borrowing $22,000 or more to pay for an undergraduate education, in this economic atmosphere in which young people graduating from much better schools are struggling VERY hard to find real jobs.</p>

<p>DS2 is interested in business. He is a natural at it. Used to sell his Hallowe’en candy to other kids at church. He’d like to be in management, or an entrepreneur & own his own business.</p>

<p>I’m not sure he will test again… going from a 31 to a 32 doesn’t help much. Here are his ACT scores:</p>

<p>English = 28 (this is 88th percentile nationally)
Math = 27 (also 88th percentile)
Reading = 35 (this is 99th percentile)
Science = 34 (this is 99th percentile)</p>

<p>…His lowest subtest score was Usage / Mechanics, 13 which is 77th percentile.</p>

<p>He has not used a CLEP book for prep. Do you have a recommendation?</p>

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<p>So you’re looking for tuition, fees, room, board, and books guaranteed for four years, on merit, because you can’t risk losing anything should the EFC rise when oldest graduates. Uf da. That’s a tall order. I mean, I know there are people who nab these kinds of awards, but they’re often really, really high stats kids. I think you might need to be looking at competitive awards. How far do your think your son can bring up his unweighted GPA?</p>

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<p>If I’m reading you correctly your younger son doesn’t even want to take out the subsidized government loans he’s eligible for in order to finance his education, even though he is planning to have a career in business? I would recommend he rethink that position - almost every financial aid package he will see will automatically include those loans, they are standard, and if you or he don’t have the funds to afford to refuse them it will eliminate almost any school he might wish to attend.</p>

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<p>No matter where your child goes to college (except maybe commuting to a local cheap public), I highly doubt he’s going to escape taking full fed loans. He needs to rethink that.</p>

<p>Sure, he may find some unranked commuter school that may give him a free ride with a 31 and his GPA, but he’ll hate the school because everyone goes home at night and on weekends, and he’ll be lonely. And, who knows if the school will have a decent business program.</p>

<p>When he and his brother attend, the EFC will split. What is S1’s EFC? If it’s 2000, then each boy will have an EFC of 1000 when both attend. How many years will BOTH boys be in college together. It sounds like only one year. </p>

<p>Also…when income rises as you project, how much will it rise? And when would it rise? (aren’t you homeschooling younger kids?) Would that increase income be from you returning to work? What year in college will S2 be then? If you’re earning more money, can’t you pay a bit towards college? (keep in mind that only about 25% of any “new” money will increase your EFC…so not a big change).</p>

<p>I’m trying to keep track of what will be happening when. It doesn’t sound like the income increase would happen when S1 graduates, or am I mistaken. And, even then, the change wouldn’t yet affect S2’s EFC. </p>

<p>You mention that your son works summers and sometimes Christmas breaks. Well, he could do what MANY college kids do, and that’s work 10 or so hours per week while in school. That can bring in about $3k per year in addition to summer earnings. If he earned $6k per year that wouldn’t affect his EFC.</p>

<p>BTW…an increase to an ACT 32 or SAT equivalent WILL MEAN more money and choices. There is a difference…a 32 is a frequent benchmark for scholarships.</p>

<p>Also…is S1 home for the summer with S2? Can he sit with S2 while he does a few math sections from some ACT practice books? Maybe S1 can provide some free tutoring.</p>

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<p>Wow, I came to the right place! mom2collegekids you sound like you have a LOT of knowledge & experience in these matters.</p>

<p>We expect income to rise because we have reason to hope that DH’s non-profit may be able to pay him a slightly better salary due to lower overhead costs. But our experience working with FAFSA has been that even a very slight increase in family income means a HUGE increase in the EFC. </p>

<p>And frankly, if our income rises, DH and I would rather put that money toward retirement, which is looming large in the window and for which we’re not prepared. We told both kids waaay back before they even started high school that we would not be able to pay toward college, and that anything they find for college would either be their own savings, or scholarships. The kids can borrow to pay for college; the adults in their 50s cannot borrow to pay for their retirement.</p>

<p>Our contributions to their college journey have been the gifts of time, encouragement, experience, scholastic support, driving them to EC’s, paying for educational testing when needed, making sure they have a social life, activities & opportunities, emotional support, advocacy, lots of research, tons of prayer, time management and other skills coaching, and occasionally finding affordable tutors to make up for the various shortcomings of their public schools.</p>

<p>Yes, DS2 would like to graduate without any debt, if he possibly can. [He’s always been a business guy and hates owing money!] We are reading stories all the time about intelligent, promising young adults graduating from really good schools, with tens of thousands of $$$$$ in debt on their backs…and then they can’t find a job! Or, they can’t find a job that pays enough to make ends meet with the huge student loan payments. Some financial analysts are predicting that another fiscal crisis is silently looming, when a large chunk of the 20-somethings decide to declare bankruptcy and default on their enormous, unrealistic student loans.</p>

<p>So, if he MUST take out some student loans, hopefully he won’t be maxxed out and staggering under a huge debt when he starts out on the road of life. </p>

<p>Another financial reality for DS2 is that right now he’s driving a 20+ year old car that’s literally held together with strings and baling wire (which he bought for himself), so he’s also realizing that in the not-too-distant future, either during college or just after, a car loan will figure into his financial future. Where we live, public transport is almost non-existent and not a realistic option at all. (DS1 drives a car which was given to him with 240,000 miles on it, and I drive a 10 yr old minivan.)</p>

<p>DS1 is maxxing out loans, to cover the shortfall between his very generous scholarship and the remaining costs of attendance. It will be interesting to see what happens to him (from a financial point of view) after he graduates.</p>

<p>When our two younger kids get just a bit older, I’m already planning ahead regarding what late-in-life career I might best pursue…and what education <em>I</em> will need. Nursing? Administrative? Teaching? Tutoring?</p>

<p>Re: the difference between an ACT score of 31 and a 32 – we used the merit calculator (see posts above), and plugged in DS2’s numbers, with a 31 and with a 32. Bumping his score up from a 31 to a 32 only brought two more colleges into play, and only of them would be a school he might be interested in. Are there a lot more schools out there that kick in a scholarship with 32 being the magic number / threshold? Do you know any specific ones, by any chance?</p>

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<p>ErinsDad, THANK YOU for posting the thread from MomFromTexas. Although that lively conversation (with 469 posts spread over 83 pages) took place many years ago, I found it very refreshing! I think MomFromTexas and I would have a lot in common.</p>

<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/148852-what-ive-learned-about-full-ride-scholarships.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/parents-forum/148852-what-ive-learned-about-full-ride-scholarships.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Even if my spouse and I could mortgage our own financial future and security to scrape by and get our child to a “top” school, I don’t know that we would.</p>

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<p>Howard’s Founder’s Scholarship would be tuition, fees, and room (not board or books); remaining price for board, books, travel, and misc is probably about $9,000 per year (probably at the edge of what a student can come up with using Stafford loans and work earnings). It is not normally considered a “low quality school”. Students are probably less likely to be politically conservative, but more likely to be religious and less likely to binge drink, compared to college students overall.</p>

<p>[Grants</a>, Scholarships & Fellowships - Howard University](<a href=“http://www.howard.edu/financialaid/grants_scholarships.htm#Freshman]Grants”>http://www.howard.edu/financialaid/grants_scholarships.htm#Freshman)</p>

<p>But yes, raising the ACT to 32, or getting a 1400 on SAT CR+M, would open up more possibilities:</p>

<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/1348012-automatic-full-tuition-full-ride-scholarships-19.html#post16145676[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/1348012-automatic-full-tuition-full-ride-scholarships-19.html#post16145676&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>There are also competitive big scholarships:</p>

<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/1461983-competitive-full-tuition-full-ride-scholarships-2.html#post15889078[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/1461983-competitive-full-tuition-full-ride-scholarships-2.html#post15889078&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

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<p>Your son does need to try to bump his ACT because many schools have NOT yet published their merit awards for the next app cycle. You’ve been looking at last year’s awards. The same schools that would give money for your son’s current score, may require a higher score for this next app cycle.</p>

<p>What is S1’s EFC?</p>

<p>*But our experience working with FAFSA has been that even a very slight increase in family income means a HUGE increase in the EFC. *</p>

<p>I don’t see how that can happen to a Pell family. only a small percent of each add’l dollar goes towards EFC. If your H were to get a five thousand dollar raise, are you saying that EFC rises by that much or more???</p>

<p>Howard’s Founder’s Scholarship would be tuition, fees, and room (not board or books); remaining price for board, books, travel, and misc is probably about $9,000 per year (probably at the edge of what a student can come up with using Stafford loans and work earnings). It is not normally considered a “low quality school”. Students are probably less likely to be politically conservative, but more likely to be religious and less likely to binge drink, compared to college students overall.</p>

<p>Yes, there are some HBCU’s that have full rides for those stats. Don’t know if the OP’s son would want to attend a HBCU.</p>

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<p>Given the financial and other constraints, it is best to put all options on the table, rather than make assumptions about what the student (whether black or non-black) thinks about HBUs (or if it even matters to the student).</p>

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<p>If he is looking for a good private Christian College like you said, I would most definitely recommend that he checks out Wheaton College (IL). Also, his ACT score falls under the criteria for a yearly scholarship there.</p>

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<p>Thank you so much, everyone, for your help & suggestions! You’ve given us some great leads & ideas to pursue.</p>

<p>Update: DS2’s GPA unweighted is 3.52, weighted is 3.7 .</p>

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<p>“If he is looking for a good private Christian College like you said, I would most definitely recommend that he checks out Wheaton College (IL). Also, his ACT score falls under the criteria for a yearly scholarship there.”</p>

<p>Wheaton is an outstanding school. But if I read their Financial Aid section correctly, the only scholarship DS2 would be even CLOSE to even attempting would be their “Presidential” award. He doesn’t have the stats, but here are the requirements: </p>

<p>Minimum 3.6 unweighted GPA on 4.0 scale, plus minimum 1400 SAT (Critical Reading and Mathematics highest composite score) or 32 ACT.</p>

<p>This Presidential Award gives the student $3,500 per year. But since their website also estimates the annual cost of attendance at $42,390 … this was not a really helpful suggestion.</p>