I would have thought this would have been obvious…
It’s about time. Makes me wonder about the professors who have been opposing this idea. Do you suppose it’s a generation thing, and the old sleazes who thought it was all right to come on to “coeds” are dying off?
Does this mean that the only option left is twerking for good grades?
Wasn’t this already a rule? If not, why not?
Looks like there was no significant opposition at Harvard, but the AAUP does not like it.
It was probably the rule a long time ago that professors and students in their class could not have sex with each other. This seems to be any undergraduate student at Harvard.
Yes, this is any undergraduate student. Which is the way it should be. It does say that they can have sex with graduate students as long as they aren’t supervising them…
That is how I read it also Vlad.
Making this a rule isn’t going to solve the problem though IMO. These kinds of things don’t go away just because some administrative body makes a rule against it. If anything, this will just add to the tension and potentially cause larger problems.
This may work for Harvard, but there could be a problem at colleges in more isolated communities.
Often, colleges have programs through which employees can get degrees by studying part-time and paying reduced tuition rates.
Often, particularly in colleges in isolated communities, spouses of faculty members work for the college in some capacity because few other jobs are available. Some of these spouses are in the employee degree program.
If one of these spouses wanted to get an undergraduate degree through the employee degree program, it would seem to conflict with a rule prohibiting sex between faculty members and undergraduates.
This is now Harvard’s official policy, so good. Professors who choose to ignore it will be in violation of the policy which could work against them in their professional life. I went to college a long time ago when this kind of conduct was treated with a slap on the wrist and no real ramifications. I like things better now.
“If one of these spouses wanted to get an undergraduate degree through the employee degree program, it would seem to conflict with a rule prohibiting sex between faculty members and undergraduates.”
It could be solved by including an exception for students already legally married to or being in a long-term relationship with faculty members prior to enrollment.
Note that this policy concerns undergrads in Harvard College, which has pretty much zero non-trads or Harvard employees/spouses as students. Any spouse of faculty picking up an undergraduate degree or taking classes will almost certainly be doing so through Harvard Extension School.
I assume that prior to the article Harvard hadn’t thought to codify the ban on sex between students and professors. There’s no indication that any faculty member opposed it.
Considering that many grads at Harvard are probably only a year or two older than most of the upperclassmen undergrads, I don’t see a problem with that.
Meaning the professors can have sex with the grads so long as the professor is not supervising them. Not the grad student and undergrad.
On an earlier thread on this topic, I mentioned that the school where my husband is a professor has a similar rule, and it took quite a while to get wording the faculty would agree to. Mainly because it’s very common at this campus for spouses of faculty/staff to take undergrad courses - spouses can take courses at no cost. So they did hammer out an exemption for “pre-existing relationships”.
Is that “pre-existing” as in before the parties became either faculty or staff at the institution or “pre-existing” as in before the first day of a particular class?
It depends on the school and what the policy is. If the policy is “any undergraduate” then the pre-existing relationship has to have started before both parties have taken on role of professor and student at the same school.
In schools that ban it by the class (like the one where I went to grad school, although I don’t know if they have since changed it), then it’s usually before the first day of class. You can’t get into a relationship with an undergrad that you met through a class they’re in (and this extended to graduate student TAs, too). You can wait until after the class is over (or, ideally, until the student graduates). If the student was already in a relationship with you before the class, then theoretically that’s fine - but in practice, you don’t teach intimate partners, so likely that person would sign up for another class or the faculty member or TA would ask for a different assignment if there was only one section.
In these cases where a spouse is taking a class or two - or even enrolled in an undergraduate program - we are usually talking about grown folks (25+) who are already in long-term or married relationships with someone else who happens to be on faculty at the school - perhaps this solved a two-body program or perhaps they met through their affiliation with the school.Besides, an accusation of wrongdoing needs an accuser, and who is going to raise hell about a non-traditional student (25+) sleeping with the faculty member they are married to/partnered with?
@justonedad - no, you don’t have to have been married to the person prior to taking the job. Free classes for spouses and dependents is a great perk at many private schools. There would be a different uproar if they told you it was only available if you were married prior to taking the job. You either need to have been married prior to the spouse enrolling, or wait until they graduate. There have probably been cases of exceptions where both parties were older and the dating was unrelated to the student/faculty status (we live in a small community and circles overlap quite a bit). The rule is primarily to prevent faculty abusing their position of authority over undergrads,which typically involves traditional undergrads with less life experience. It also protects professors from being accused of abusing their authority if an undergrad enters into a consensual relationship and then later lies and says they were coerced.
@juillet - it’s true that schools try to keep faculty from instructing close relatives, but in reality that’s not always feasible. In a small college, some majors may not have multiple faculty qualified to teach upper-level courses. I’ve seen faculty teach spouses, children, nieces, nephews. But then I’ve seen that in K-12 as well. And there isn’t always a need for one of the people in a relationship to be an accuser - there are many people who delight in being anonymous informers.
@InigoMontoya - I was actually referring to outside informers and not one of the two people in the relationship. I’m just wondering who would think it was a worthwhile cause to complain about a professor-student relationship when the student in question is the professor’s husband, and/or even if someone did, what exactly they would expect the “consequences” to be.