Harvard v. Chicago v. Rice

College Search & Selection
1

<p>Given the abundance of this type of thread, I really didn't want to start my own but it seems like it's come down to it. While I shouldn't be complaining about getting accepted, I almost wish I'd gotten more rejections so I don't have to make this decision. I guess the hardest part is that I like each of these schools for DIFFERENT reasons, and there's no choosing "what is better." </p>

<p>I had a doctor's appointment yesterday, and my doctor actually spent some 10 minutes discussing college with me. When I mentioned my options, these were her reactions:
Chicago--hmm..pretty good
Rice--polite "what?"
Harvard--WOW! OH MY GOSH!</p>

<p>I went into the whole application process totally ignoring the prestige factor, and I really only applied to Harvard because my parents made me. And while I don't think I was a prestige whore, my doctor's reaction definitely made me more conscious of it. Basically, my thoughts here: </p>

<p>Chicago: This was my dream school for almost two years. After being accepted EA, I was all psychologically ready to go to Chicago and all of my friends still think I am. I love the city, I love the culture, I love Doc Films. However, with other options in front of me, I'm beginning to see all the flaws I had missed. (Chicago has a huge graduate population, and undergrads really aren't the priority there.) The big sinker is that it's expensive, about 5k more a year than Harvard, and I doubt my parents are willing to pay full freight for it. </p>

<p>Harvard: I spent so long thinking "There is no way I'm going to Harvard! Even if I get in" and was basking in the gratification of turning down Harvard. But it's hard. It's Harvard for god's sake. It has world class programs in everything I will want to study. I'll be close to home, and I'll already know a few people there. At the same time, I want to get away from all this familiarity and completely start over for college. Still, I know Harvard will open many doors for me simply because of it's name. Same reason why my parents will pay for Harvard no matter what. </p>

<p>Rice: I decided to apply on Dec 29, and it's so ironic that I'm seriously considering it now. I got a great merit aid package ($74k + guaranteed research), and I love the undergrad focus and smaller size. BUT, I'm probably going to end up studying social sciences (esp econ), and Chicago and Harvard have top top programs from that while Rice isn't that distinguished in that field. At the same time, my major is pretty tentative, but it probably will not be science. I also have concerns being from New England and going to a school that is half Texans. </p>

<p>Any thoughts? Advice? People have been telling me that I can't make a "wrong" choice here, but I would just like to hear more opinions.</p>

2

<p>I would cross Chicago out of the list (5K/yr more than Harvard with no advantages over it and some shortcomings) and pick between Harvard and Rice (saving 100K, scholarships + it costs less to start with ?).</p>

3

<p>That's basically where I am right now. :) Choosing between Rice and Harvard is hard on its own.</p>

4

<p>Have you visited the schools? Are you planning on attending accepted students' weekends? The social life and atmosphere of a school is something you never want to discount.</p>

5

<p>I've visited Chicago and know all about the "Where Fun Comes to Die" comments. I'll definitely be doing attended students weekends at Rice and Harvard.</p>

<p>The thing about social life I feel is that it's what you make of it. I'm sure I can find a niche in all three of these schools. I'm not making a final decision until I've done all my visiting though.</p>

6

<p>From the latest USNWR, the sticker prices for Harvard and U Chicago are:
Harvard:$33,709
U Chicago: $34,005</p>

<p>What is causing the $5k difference that you reference? Have you spoken to anyone at U Chicago about this and perhaps leveling the financial playing field?</p>

7

<p>The sticker prices mean little. Chicago broke it down for me on paper and it broke $40,000. I don't know how or why.</p>

8

<p>hawkette, I think you're only looking at tuition. The financial office sent me an estimate of the total cost of attendance at Chicago to be $51,300, which is mighty steep. I also live very close to Harvard so we would save on transportation and health insurance costs. </p>

<p>I do plan on contacting Chicago and seeing if I can get them to match Harvard's cost of attendance. Don't know how effective the H-bomb would work.</p>

9

<p>incubyte,
Yeah, I was only looking at tuition. If I add in room/board (again using the generic data from USNWR), I get the following:
Harvard:$33,709 + $9,946 = $43,655
U Chicago: $34,005 + $10,608 = $44,613</p>

<p>Obviously,you have the real data in your hands. I am just surprised that U Chicago COL would be meaningfully more than Harvard and that the spread would be so different than the figures above. </p>

<p>I have no idea, but I guess I'd be surprised if U Chicago didn't make a real effort to match (or perhaps even exceed H's offer). The Rice offer should also give you more leverage.</p>

<p>As for the institutions, I am delighted for you. These are three of my favorite schools. I think Rice might be the most unknown and most underrated school in America. U Chicago, to my mind, is just such a premier school and its economics programs have so many outstanding graduates. Harvard, the premier brand in college education, and will provide you with so many opportunities and experiences. It's a cliche, but there isn't a bad choice here. </p>

<p>It does not sound like you are going to need it, but good luck with your decision. :)</p>

10

<p>My D got into Harvard last year after thinking other schools were her top priorities, and agonized over it before deciding that she just couldn't turn Harvard down. Even after that decision, there was buyer's remorse - "what great experiences may I have given up for the prestige brand?" Off she went to Harvard, and guess what? Incredible friends, more exciting things to do than is humanly possible, extracurricular brillance that's breathtaking, a college setting that is Disneyworld North for college students. There sometimes seems to be an assumption that since it's Harvard, it must be intense and grim. D's found nothing of the sort - she's having the time of her life and can't imagine that she ever had qualms.</p>

<p>But FWIW, students adore Rice too, and that "where fun goes to die" thing about U.Chicago is just a gag line from an old Second City skit.</p>

11

<p>okay im going to tell you what to do</p>

<p>GO TO HARVARD - it is the best school in the world</p>

<p>I live in houston and it is not anywhere close to teh texan stereotype - it is an internationl city with out many hicks. However, dont go to Rice - it is not that prestigous outside of Houston (and even here it isnt)</p>

<p>Chicago is boring - dont go there</p>

12

<p>actually, my impression of chicago was that its focus was on the undergraduate students, sometimes even to the exclusion of the grad students.</p>

<p>i woulda crossed rice immediately off the list, because there's no reason to choose that over harvard since your parents will happily support the extra expense.</p>

<p>but anyways, it seems like you might possibly regret not choosing harvard if you went to other schools, so perhaps you should go there!</p>

13

<p>Thanks to everyone who as replied so far. </p>

<p>The financial situation is that my parents can technically "afford" to pay, but it will definitely be a big burden. 100k, the difference between Rice and Harvard/Chicago is a huge sum, especially because I will likely be attending grad school anyways. Going to Rice would be ease the load a lot.</p>

14

<p>incubyte, I'm in a similar situation (minus the Harvard... which doesn't really make it that much similar, Oh well.) I went down and visited Rice in March. Despite all this money they were throwing at me (74+research), I could not see myself here. Part of it didn't look challenging enough, and I didn't really click with the people I met there. Plus Harvard and Chicago are in the middle of their respective cities, Rice is isolated from the rest of Houston. Isolated enough to require a car, something that is a burden to Northerners like you and me. </p>

<p>When I visited Harvard during a college visit trip, I came away unimpressed. Everyone there appeared to be a glorified stereotype. It seemed to be a blissful paradise, happy to a fault. There seemed to be little connection to the real world, but it is very hard to turn down unlimited resources. </p>

<p>I can tell you are thinking about economics. I hear (from tucker max, a biased source, but w/e) that a UChicago Economics Degree is the most valuable degree in the United States. Chicago has a lot of graduate students, but as you probably know they are across the street and do interfere with undergraduates too often. I think if you have known Chicago was your school for two years, and you are a big anti-prestige whore, then I'd say, you will go to Chicago.</p>

<p>But then again, even Ted O'Neil said (paraphrasing quote from visit) "If you get into Princeton, Harvard, Yale, have fun at one of those places. But If you get in here, consider us because we like to think that we are competitive."</p>

15

<p>Cross Chicago off your list for several reasons. I went to Chicago, and I'll tell you my experience. </p>

<p>The pros: I'm in grad school now, and I know more than anybody--Chicago really teaches you how to think and be an intellectual. My friends from Chicago are truly some of the most unique, brilliant people in the world. I'm in grad school now, and Chicago was just a whole other level. I learned things there that I never could have obtained from any other educational. institution. But if I had to do it over again, my choice would definitely not be Chicago. Why? Read on.</p>

<p>The drawbacks: You know that encounter with your doctor? Expect that for the rest of your life. You will work so hard in Chicago, only to have people think that HARVARD is a better school. Most people have never heard of Chicago, or have no idea how prestigious it is. (95% of Harvard people graduate with honors. The average GPA at Chicago? Just above 3.0, which is really, really low compared to almost every other school in the country.) As much as that encounter bothers you now, imagine how insulted you will be when you study 10-14 hours a day for 4 years at Chicago and then have some other liberal art grad--especially an Ivy Leaguer--try to claim that their degree is better than yours. </p>

<p>Also, as far as life opportunities go, Harvard grads just get more bang for their buck. The school is universally recognized and impresses just about everyone. You are practically assured to graduate with a great GPA at Harvard--your whole class will--which will open all sorts of doors for you in grad school or a career. And if you are going to grad school, then that is the school that counts--don't blow your money on undergrad. An average or even above-average GPA from Chicago can really hurt your admission chances to grad school, and your grad school institution is way more important than your undergrad one. (A person who goes to Florida for undergrad, and then goes to Chicago for their Ph.D. is going to be a lot better off than the person who took the reverse path.)</p>

<p>Also, if you are not sure about future plans for grad school, do not go to Chicago. They prepare their graduates for grad school, period. Unless you major in econ (or can utilize parental connections), expect an uphill battle when you try to get a job in "the real world" with a Chicago (liberal arts) degree. It is no fun to graduate with a large debt, only to find that a community college degree is worth more on the market than a Chicago one.</p>

<p>On a final note, Chicago financial aid is undeniably the worst thing about the school. Or at least it was when I attended. I feel literally scammed by the school, as my degree ended up costing thousands more than I originally thought it would. (That first financial aid package is the best you will ever see.) At first, I got a great financial aid package. However, it steadily declined over the 3 years it took to get my degree. I had to graduate early for financial reasons--missing out on many classes I wanted to take. To add insult to injury, in my final year, my mother(single mom of three, earning 40K a year), was laid off from her job. Expecting at least a minimal amount of aid to complete my degree, Chicago responded with a financial aid package of virtually ZERO. How I see it, they knew I was too invested to transfer, so they just figured I would have to borrow the money to get my degree. (And in case you are wondering if there was good reason for this drastic reduction--I sure did--there was not. I had an above-average GPA, was one of the best varsity athletes on campus, was very involved in activities, and had no disciplinary issues.) None of my ivy-league friends had this happen, and my friend at Vassar actually got a full aid package when her father (who earned double what my mother did) was laid off.</p>

<p>While many of my Chicago friends praise the school, for anyone with financial concerns of any type, I highly recommend other schools. As for graduate schools--I cannot imagine a better place than Chicago. Get a cheap degree now, do well, and Chicago may well be in the cards for your future.</p>