<p>Bchan, I dont disagree, but the SUNYs are doing the most to hurt locals. Lower stats for OOS and low tuition.</p>
<p>Binghamton has the most at 15%, but my understanding is that half of them are international students. This is a huge increase from 10 years ago when they were heralding an increase from 3% to 5% OOS. It could well be that the numbers are lower for the OOS kids because they do recruit athletes and most of them are OOSers. Being a small school for a state university, having that core number of athletes makes it a large percent of the student population. I know this because my son was the rare in state atheletic recruit and he spent a couple of days there on a paid athletic visit perusing the facilities. A lot of international athletes too. The school so wants to break into the top 50 universities rankings, and be the flagship school for NY. It’s a fine school and is the most selective of the SUNYs and has broken into the 30% range for acceptance. Three of mine who looked at it, felt that the offerings were more extensive, the facilities and amenties much nicer at UBuffalo. To be a true flagship school, it’s going to have to be a lot larger, I think. I like this school; I’m all for this school and it is gaining in popularity here.</p>
<p>I personally think the UCs are over the top for tuition now. They are too high for instate as well. From what my brother, who lives in CA, tells me, it has hit a breaking point for many there. The better UCs are just too big, many don’t have the amenities and school spirit environment, are too much suitcase and other than UCLA and Berkeley are almost all in staters. Not a lot of diversity, not a lot of school fun and adhesion among the students. I can see that in that I’ve yet to meet a non CA resident go to a UC other than the the top two, maybe SC and lately SD is making waves. Irvine, Riverdside (?) SB, and the others just don’t have the appeal though the stats of the kids and selectivity may be up there. </p>
<p>I don’t think the SUNYs are at the level that they can raise their tuition if they want to attract talented OOS kids. Where they have a cost advantage is that off campus housing availability and prices are pretty good at most of them, so the sticker price can be drastically slashed during upper class years.</p>
<p>Seeing as how I’ve got you NY folks on this thread, what do you think of Stony Brook?</p>
<p>kayf - I see your point, it wouldn’t be so bad if their OOS tuition was relatively low if they weren’t also admitting less qualified students OOS - that seems to be to no ones advantage!</p>
<p>CA and NY aren’t just opposite coasts - they’re oppositional in their state U. marketing strategy (granted they are competing in very different local markets) and I don’t think either extreme is good.</p>
<p>Cpt, I have seen threads here from kids with stats well below Binghamton 25/75 splits, and with tuition at 14G, it is not fair to taxpayers. At a minimum, the SUNYs should be more transparent about what is going on. </p>
<p>And the SUNYs latest ploy? That they want the state to agree to minimual tuition increases, even for OOS. They just thump their noses at the taxpayers every day.</p>
<p>Why do you guys believe that they’re admitting less qualified students OOS? What would be the point? Is there any evidence, perhaps published numbers? </p>
<p>It seems rather strange; typically, it’s the opposite.</p>
<p>No, they wont publish stats, even disregarding FOIL requests. But it is pretty clear from Naviance data that something fishy is going on.</p>
<p>The Navaiance for my son’s school certainly does not support your theory. It may well be true, but I know a lot of kids who got into Binghamton with sub par stats. The trick is to apply early. It may or may not be true that OOS kids have stats lower than NY kids–I sure don’t know but the athletes do make a large contingency of OOS kids. </p>
<p>I’m not sure what the big deal here is. I don’t think Bing admissions is that big of a deal, particularly OOS admissions. Never heard of it as a problem in my 10 years here dealing with college admissions and it was always a school considered heavily for each of my kids and their friends. I am glad that there are more OOS kids going there. I wish UB were at that %. It has only improved the school.</p>
<p>oh please, spare me CPT, the GCs at my DDs school are excellent and of course applications get in early.</p>
<p>I dont mind the number of OOS, but they SUNYs should not be giving away OOS tuitition.</p>
<p>I don’t happen t think they are giving away anything. More OOS kids enhance the system. I was sorry they raised the tuition a few years ago.</p>
<p>@MrK - Stony Brook was one of the front runners in our house last year because they offered DS a full ride. They do seem to be very intent on attracting high stats kids – there quite a few scholarships available, including some for OOSers. (There is an early application deadline for them if anyone here is interested.) They held a special admitted students day for science geeks like DS which included tours of Brookhaven National Labs and talked a lot about how there are many opportunities to do internships there. There is also an Honors College. (Oddly, although my kid had 2360 on the SATS he did not get accepted to the HC because his unweighted average was just below the 92 cutoff – they did not care that he had taken 14 AP classes!) IIRC, Stony Brook was ranked at 99th in the USNews lists last year.</p>
<p>The problem with Stony Brook for us is that it is only about 20 minutes from our house. While this may seem like a good thing, I think our kid needed to get away further from home and learn to be independent. When we toured the campus on a Saturday it seemed to be deserted during the middle of the day. The tour guide said that everyone was probably sleeping, but I think a lot of kids go home on weekends. (I could be wrong.) </p>
<p>Ultimately, DS chose RPI, where we pay our $25K EFC and he has Stafford loans. Perhaps this was a dumb choice from a financial perspective, but he has been doing very well there and has bloomed both socially and academically.</p>
<p>The moral we learned is that all schools on a students list should be ones you would like to attend. There’s no point in getting into a safety if you don’t actually want to go there.</p>
<p>There is a grim post about SB on this forum, that will tell you about a lot of the bad things about SB. I know a number of kids who go there and they love it; don’t know any who hate it and the kids I know who went there seem quite satisfied. The SUNYs do tend to be suitcase/ commuter school which is a drawback. </p>
<p>But my son had a very traditional, rich, fun educational 4 years at a SUNY with no regrets at all. It wasn’t my choice for him, but he learned his discipline very well, got a lot of attention from his dept, graduated debt free in 4 years and is a working performing arts alum who is making ends meet in his field though barely, living on his own in NYC. He has a number of friends from his SUNY and other SUNYs and they are doing as well as and better than a lot of his old high school classmates who are still living off their parents after graduating from selective schools in fields that are not as questionable in keeping the belly full.</p>
<p>Hey OP, did your son appeal the UCSD rejection? Time is now short, so I’ve no idea if that’s a possible path for you.</p>
<p>What was your planned budget for college costs per year? I’m another Californian, and I’ve gotta say that I think your son will be far better off to grab Bowdoin or Carleton at $20k a year, if that’s what’s on the table and if those packages don’t include any unsubsidized loans. Typically, FAFSA EFC runs around 25-33% of your gross income, which would put your household income at around $60-80k. That sounds a bit low for Carlsbad, and would put you within the Blue and Gold plan anyway, so I’m guessing that your income is higher. In which case, if the $20k a year school(s) are giving your son grants/scholarships and work study and subsidized loans, he is getting great FA packages. </p>
<p>Keep in mind: we have no idea how much UC tuition will be going up per year. We have no idea how much CSU tuition will increase, either–and San Diego State has a reputation for being difficult to finish within four years. </p>
<p>Have your son scrimp, as noted above. Have him work summers. Have him take out those Stafford loans at around $5k a year.</p>
<p>FWIW my son is a junior at Bowdoin and he loves loves loves loves it!! I would think that $20K per year for one of the top schools in the country, VERY hard to get into, where the student body just seems to be happy, content, hard working and playing, just really contented and wonderful students, would be an opportunity you would not want to pass up. It was not my choice for my son–I cried the whole day we put the deposit check in the mail. But it has turned out to be precisely the place for him, and if they have offered you rather good financial aid (it sounds like, though I hear your sticker shock and I sympathize) I would put your hand to the plow and not look back. I think your son will never regret it. (Carleton is a pretty great place as well–you are really VERY lucky in his options as far as his growth and education, even though the financial hit is going to be felt).</p>
<p>I think that the OP got a terrific deal and am curious how he got such great fin aid packages. I don’t recall what his income range is or his EFC. That the UCs did not meet need is no surprise, from what I have heard of the situation Few state schools meet need fully and to few students. Only 2 guarantee it. I’m not sure how much better anyone can do in terms of snagging at top school at a bargain price unless he has high need.</p>
<p>UC’s Regents merit awards are IIRC around the $7-8k a year range, bringing COA at Cal to the low $20k annual range. The Bowdoin offer is definitely better.</p>
<p>The OP is in a rough place financially: a one income household, a period of joblessness resulting in loss of retirement savings, and now kid #1 off to college and breaking the budget. 
CarlsbadDad, I see that your wife isn’t working–you say she has no college degree. I know the economy is in rough shape, and we have no idea what kind of home responsibilities she has, but it does sound like she may need to find some sort of paying job. And please hang around here to figure out how to find affordable schools for the two younger kids.</p>
<p>Another parent who did not research the subject of financial aid, basically.
Where will my child get a good financial aid package? State vs. private schools.
How does financial aid work? Merit aid vs. need based aid, etc.
What schools meet a high percentage of need? </p>
<p>Very unfortunate situation, especially with all the resources online & books and so on.
The sticking one’s head in the sand method does not work when it comes to paying for college for your children. I do sympathize though with the OP’s situation.</p>
<p>Kay… </p>
<p>Are you saying that you know of a lot of OOS low stats kids who are being accepted to SUNY Bing? How many are we talking about? How low are their stats? </p>
<p>SUNY Bing</p>
<pre><code>* SAT critical reading scores over 500 97%
- SAT math scores over 500 100%
- SAT writing scores over 500 98%
- ACT scores over 18 100%
- SAT critical reading scores over 600 68%
- SAT math scores over 600 86%
- SAT writing scores over 600 74%
- ACT scores over 24 98%
- SAT critical reading scores over 700 13%
- SAT math scores over 700 29%
- SAT writing scores over 700 20%
- ACT scores over 30 34%
</code></pre>
<p>Doesn’t look like SUNY Bing is accepting many low stats kids…and some of these are probably instate. I don’t know the sports situation at Bing, but some of those low stats kids may be athletes.</p>
<p>I am aware that the CSU system has a priority of offering admissions to local residents, but I have never heard that the UC system gives priority to or even considers place of residence as a criteria for admittance. Otherwise, UCLA could easily fill just with L.A. kids, or Berkeley with Bay area kids, which is not the case at all.</p>
<p>Yes, UC’s do give “consideration” to where the students live in regards to Admissions. Of course that does not mean that a UC will fill with only local students. It just means that it is one consideration out of many considerations. That said, because R&B is so costly, it would make sense to make it “more” of a consideration when cost is an issue. Maybe the consideration shouldn’t be increased for UCLA or Cal, but for the others.</p>
<p>From the UC admissions website:</p>
<p>*
We spend time evaluating your academic achievements in light of the opportunities available to you and your demonstrated capacity to contribute to the intellectual life at UC. The 14 factors we weigh are:</p>
<p>.
.
.</p>
<p>Location of your secondary school and residence.*</p>
<p>Mom2, I didnt mean to imply that any OOS kids were off the chart unqualifies, just that they were appreciably less than average. Your stats do not disprove that. Plenty of kids with between 500-600 SATs. Their 25th percentiles are 580/620 I would like to know OOS v IS. That SUNYs will not provide is outrageous. If they are so proud of what they are doing, they should provide full disclousre.</p>