Have I ruined my chances at Grad School?

Graduate School
1

<p>So here's my situation. I'm using a throwaway account and withholding some details for the sake of anonymity, as you'll find out below:</p>

<p>In high school I was an excellent student, but I'm not sure if I still am: cumulative 4.0 GPA, top of the class, loads of AP courses, National Honor Society, Eagle Scout, varsity sports captain, All-State musician, etc etc etc. I'm currently a junior in college, studying engineering at a top-25 college in the nation, which I got in on a full-tuition scholarship.</p>

<p>I hate both my college and my major, but my parents forced me to come here and study something I hate. The motivating force is money- invest as little money in as possible and get the most money out. Naturally, my freshman year I had a very hard time adapting, coupled with family problems back home. I've had clinical depression, attempted to kill myself twice, seen a psychologist, cut myself, and spent time in a psych ward. My first year in college I was shooting 2.7, 2.8's on a 23 credit/semester schedule, and since then I've gradually improved to 3.8's and 3.9's on a 26 credit/semester schedule, much closer to the level of work I'm capable of. My GPA, unfortunately, is ruined and currently sits at a 3.24. I did the math and no amount of 4.0's can get me above a 3.5. I'm out of the running for most honor societies and research opportunities by not meeting the minimum GPA requirement.</p>

<p>Many of the students and professors see me and my new work and consider me one of the hardest-working, highest performing kids in the class, but have no clue how embarrassingly low my GPA is (they even consider me extremely modest for how often I call myself stupid because of my GPA). Employers, on the other hand, only see my sub-par GPA and are completely unaware of the struggles I've been through, how everything has been an uphill battle that takes more work than the other students have to do. I don't mean to sound arrogant or self-entitled to anything because of my struggles. I'd prefer no advice on switching colleges or majors or breaking things off with my parents (I've gotten plenty of that over the years)- I'm committed to graduating from this college with this degree in engineering, and as I've shown, I'm seeing this through if it kills me. Perhaps by knowingly putting myself in this situation I have no right to complain, but either way I'm done regretting where I went wrong and I only want to focus on what's best for this future I've decided.</p>

<p>TL;DR excellent student in high school, terrible suicidal student freshman year of college, back to being excellent student. Now in junior year, but my GPA is in shambles at a 3.24 all because of freshman year. It's impossible to get it above 3.5. Classmates and professors consider me smart but they've never seen my GPA, and employers probably think I'm stupid.</p>

<p>My questions are twofold:
1) Do I have any hope at all of getting into a respectable grad school for engineering?
2) Would it be a good idea to tell professors and employers of my struggles? My professors think I'm smart, but I don't know how telling them my GPA or my sob story will affect what they think of me. For all I know, they might be deeply offended at how much I hate their college and their area of study. As for employers, I don't know if it's better that they ignorantly think of me as inherently dumb, or smart and hard working yet mentally unstable. Either way, it's a lose-lose scenario.</p>

<p>Thanks in advance for all the help, this has been deeply troubling me for years.</p>

2

<p>Do you need to go to grad school? I don’t think your GPA will matter much to employers; frankly, there is a need for qualified employees with engineering degrees in most engineering fields. I don’t think they care as much about the GPA as the fact that you earned that degree. Have you been doing internships? Someone may be willing to hire you right out of undergrad if they like you during your internship. For grad school, it may matter, especially for top schools, but they may consider your upward trend in grades and the excellent letters of recommendation you should be able to get from the professors who think well of you. Good luck to you.</p>

3

<ol>
<li><p>Yes: You have a shot at getting into a respectable graduate school for engineering. </p></li>
<li><p>Yes: It’s an excellent idea to tell your professors about your struggles, if they are personable, warm professors. </p></li>
</ol>

<p>I’d never normally reply, but I felt compelled because I have a similar story. Though I’m in a different area of academia, I was fairly messed up through the end of high school and during my early college years. I maintained a 3.0 for the first two and a half years, and I have maintained a 3.9 for the past two and a half years. My GPA, now that I’m applying to graduate schools, is a mere 3.4, which is certainly not representative of my potential.</p>

<p>However, one of my professors is familiar with my story, and he is only because he asked me. I shied away from talking to any of my professors about my issues because I didn’t think that such issues had anything to do with the subject matter. And because I was shy. I didn’t want them to stigmatize me, either. In the end, you will (a) have an opportunity to explain your extenuating circumstances in your personal statement and make a case for the hike in your GPA and (b) your professors, particularly those who you trust, will have an opportunity to address the shortcomings in your application in their reference letters. Furthermore, you also have the opportunity to take the GRE, which, if you do well, will support your case. </p>

<p>Unfortunately, there’s a stigma against emotional disorders, even in academia. Some people do, indeed, believe that once you’re depressed, then you’re prone to those feelings for eternity. However, those are the minority, I believe. I think that because academics are more educated, they’re more sympathetic to and apprised of depression and depression-related problems. Moreover, because your depression was circumstantial (your parents, the major, etc), admissions committees may render your depression as less likely to repeat. </p>

<p>At any rate, good luck to you. When the time comes, study as hard as you can for the GRE. I’d study for three months. When you write your statement of intent, make sure you show that while your grade point average was a 2.8 early on, this trend was a force of circumstance and that you’ve come out of it because you’ve maintained a 3.9, kicked GRE’s ass, and have published this, learnt a language, etc. I do believe you’re bright, and I do believe that admissions committees will recognize this. You do have a chance at getting into a prestigious program; good luck!</p>

4

<p>As other have said, do well on the GRE and you can get into a fine graduate program. The fact that your academic performance has been excellent in the last 2-3 years is important and should be something that the professors who write your LORs should mention. This means that it would be a good idea to tell those you ask for a letter a bit more about your circumstances (not the personal stuff, just tell them that you had a difficult time at the beginning of your time at college).</p>

<p>All that being said, make sure you choose at least one graduate program that is not extremely selective. The kind of program that will give your application a thorough read and see the plusses in admitting you. Don’t get hung up on only applying to “top” programs, look for good programs that are strong in what you are interested in. You can find great advisors there and set yourself up for a good position after graduation even if it is not a “top 10” program according to some ranking service.</p>

5

<p>I think you’d probably be able to find a graduate program just fine, and if you don’t get in on your first try, working in the field for a couple years would make you a solid candidate for later admission. While engineering does tend to be more intensely grade selective than many other fields for grad school, an upward trend in grades is much better than the opposite! I wouldn’t mention your mental health at all. Fair or not, there’s a stigma associated with that and an adcom make consciously or unconsciously hold it against you. I also wouldn’t mention it to anyone, I’d just say something generic like you found it difficult to adjust to college your first year, but once you got the hang of it, you were great and will continue to be so. Spin it in a positive light.</p>

6

<p>On your resume, when you put your gpa, you can also put the gpa in your major only, and that can make a big difference. Some say that grad schools will focus on that, or the last 60 units, so you can frame things that way.</p>

<p>Stop with the negative self talk. Not only is it extremely unhealthy and dysfunctional, it can also be very off-putting and unpleasant, even uncomfortable, to other people. Time to re-frame your story to yourself–you are someone who had a rough time but prevailed.</p>

7

<p>some schools focus on the latter two years of your undergraduate gpa, and some others don’t even look at the first two years, so I have been told… It makes sense though. Try to explain in your SOP of the situation.</p>

8

<p>Hey everyone,</p>

<p>First of all, thanks to everyone for putting in the time to read my story and submit your input. I didn’t expect such an outpouring of opinions, but I’m extremely grateful for it.</p>

<p>I do have two internships under my belt, which I guess in itself proves that some people would be willing to hire me. I think at this point I’m definitely going to tell one or two trusted professors about my situation, but I won’t go into too much detail- just enough so that it doesn’t sound like I’m making up excuses for my previous performance. If I’m lucky, maybe they’d be willing to look past one of the lower GPA requirements for a research opportunity, which would be a huge boon to my grad school applications.</p>

<p>I think a large part of the stigma behind mental health is that everyone reacts to it differently, as I’ve noticed in the comments above. With no idea how the news will be received, people will often prefer to suffer in silence. And since most mental illnesses are unnoticeable, it’s hard to discern between a mentally ill student/employee and an intrinsically stupid one, at least without having some extensive background knowledge of the person when “normal”. Even if other people can pick up on the fact that something’s wrong we still often don’t admit to it- a few of my friends back home have noticed how worn down and haggard-looking I’ve become and asked me about it, but every time I just skirt the issue. Granted, I’m sure everyone goes through rough patches- it’s unfortunate how often it happens while in college, when one’s performance will have the biggest impact on the rest of one’s life. But no sense in being stuck in the past when the damage is already done- regrets will get me nowhere, and now I have a better idea on how to proceed. The fact that there’s still hope is definitely a load off my mind.</p>

9

<p>Three comments:

  1. A 3.3 or whatever does not stop you from getting into a top grad school. Letters of recommendation and research experience are tops, especially for PhD programs.
  2. Many grad schools only look at the grades in the last 2 years.
  3. Explain the drop in grades when you apply.</p>
10

<p>Is it possible to take some easy classes after you graduate? To boost your gpa like an arts class or something? </p>

<p>If not if you can get a 3.3 you may be able to get into a state college grad program, although they also look at work experience in grad program so all may not be lost.</p>

<p>I was majorly depressed when I was younger so I feel for you in that respect. </p>

<p>I wish you luck friend.</p>

11

<p>Um…once you graduate, any additional courses are NOT computed in your GPA.</p>

12

<p>Also, I find “If you get a 3.3, you may be able to get into a state college grad program” to be odd advice. Some (most?) of the best engineering schools are “state college grad programs,” like Georgia Tech, Berkeley, UIUC, Purdue, Michigan, UT-Austin, Texas A&M, UCLA, Maryland, several other UCs, Virginia Tech…</p>

<p>Anyway, I find a 3.24 GPA in engineering to be pretty good even without the explanation. Managing to pull yourself from a 2.7 to a 3.24 is quite impressive, and I don’t think you’ll have as much trouble finding a job as you think.</p>