Help a junior with big dreams and a small pocketbook!

College Search & Selection
1

<p>Hi everyone!
So this is my first post on CC and I'm looking for a bit of advice regarding LAC's where I would realistically be able to receive some substantial merit aid. I put a lot of thought into crafting my list; pairing my academic interests (environmental studies/policy, foreign language, history, government, etc...) with financial considerations. My mother (a schoolteacher) has told me flat out she will pay $10,000 a year for me to attend college and my father (a police officer) will most likely be able to contribute a small amount towards my education. I am worried about financial aid though, because combined, my parents make around 130,000 dollars and I don't know if colleges will take into account my stepmother's (married to my father, noncustodial parent) income. I currently attend a private, all girls, catholic high school in Ohio on a full academic scholarship and I want to continue the trend of not being a financial burden on my parents.
So here's my list: </p>

<p>Middlebury
Carleton
St. Olaf
Oberlin
Kenyon
Lawrence
Wooster
Bates
Colby
Willamette
Puget Sound
Whitman
Lewis and Clark
Smith </p>

<p>I feel like I don't have enough financial safeties/academic safeties. I have a weighted 3.99 and an unweighted 3.6 which I'm sure will go up following this school year, as my gpa has been a 4.2+ each quarter. I'll have taken 5 AP classes by the end of my senior year (we have a weird block schedule and the maximum number of AP's someone takes at my school is 6). My ACT is a 29 (ugh.) and my SAT a 1970 (I'm retaking this in June hoping to get a 2100 or so, but there are no guarantees). I know I'm a pretty iffy candidate for many of these schools and I really need recommendations! I don't want anywhere too preppy or conservative- I'd like to be surrounded by friendly, honest, open people who enjoy being outdoors and don't spend all of their time imbibing alcohol (I know Colby and Middlebury have cultures focused on this which is why they're sort of iffy for me). And if it matters at all, (which it really doesn't, in my opinion) I'm an African American female. </p>

<p>Thanks in advance!</p>

2

<p>If you apply to schools that give the best aid, then likely they will include your dad and stepmom’s income. </p>

<p>If so, the “family contribution” of your mom, dad, and stepmom will likely be much higher than it sounds like they’re willing to pay. </p>

<p>Do you know if your dad and stepmom will fill out the NCP foms? And, do you know how much they will contribute?</p>

<p>You’re in a difficult situation. You might get accepted to a great school, but the family contribution will be too high. If you apply to a school that doesn’t require NCP info, it may not be a school that gives good aid.</p>

<p>You need a strategy.</p>

<p>Apply to a couple of schools that meet need and require NCP info just to see what they’ll expect. </p>

<p>Also, apply to a few schools that “meet need” but don’t require NCP info (I think Vandy and USC don’t require NCP info). </p>

<p>Lastly, protect yourself by applying to some schools that will give you huge merit scholarships (like full tuition or more) for your stats. </p>

<p>Will you likely be a National Achievement Finalist? What was your PSAT?</p>

<p>Take both the ACT and SAT again…you need the best scores possible.</p>

3

<p>thanks for the advice mom2collegekids.
My dad and stepmom will fill out the NCP forms. I have tried to have frank conversations with my father regarding how much he’s willing to pay for college but he does quite a lot of talking around the question and has not given me an actual number. I think (I hope!) I’ll be an National Achievement Finalist; I’m not sure what the cutoff is. I got a 197 on my PSAT. Should I apply to somewhere like Ohio State, Ohio University or University of Cincinnati for a financial safety? I know I’d get a lot of money at those places, I’m just afraid I’d get lost in the fray. I feel like I’d be sacrificing a lot of what I wanted out of my college experience, but I understand the necessity of having someplace like that on my list. Are there any LAC’s that may provide the same sort of financial safety net?</p>

4

<p>

For starters Carleton only offers $2K in merit aid for NMFs. Otherwise it’s all need based. I don’t think Middlebury offers merit aid either.</p>

5

<p>“Should I apply to somewhere like Ohio State…”</p>

<p>Most Definitely!!! </p>

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<p><a href=“What it Means to be a Buckeye - YouTube”>What it Means to be a Buckeye - YouTube;

<p>Go Bucks!!! :)</p>

6

<p>Here is a quick reference chart for estimating your family contribution:
[2010-2011</a> EFC Quick Reference Table | Strategy Center](<a href=“http://www.stratagee.com/blog/?p=15]2010-2011”>http://www.stratagee.com/blog/?p=15)</p>

<p>This table ignores many details, such as family assets. But let’s just assume your parents’ Adjusted Gross Income is $130K, there is only one dependent child (you), and no assets are counted. In that case, your expected family contribution would be about $30K. If your Mom’s AGI is only half that ($65K), and if only that income is included (and again, ignoring assets), then the expected family contribution is about $8K. Big difference! Family assets (or your stepmother’s income) could drive up the EFC significantly. But based on what you’ve told us, let’s suppose your Mom can cover her share of the EFC. A lot seems to be riding on how your father and stepmother’s income is counted, and (if that is all counted), on their willingness and ability to cover their expected contribution. </p>

<p>In the worst case scenario, your EFC would be significantly more than $30K (after your father and stepmother’s income is included, and after accounting for assets) … but your parents might not be willing and able to contribute much more than the $10K from your Mom. That would cover the cost of attending an in-state public university, but only if you commute from home. If you throw in $5K in student loans, $2500 from student employment, and a few thousand from your Dad … then you and your family would be bringing $20K-$25K to the table. In that case, you could afford to live on campus at an in-state public university. However, you could be facing a insurmountable cost gap to attend one of the LACs you listed, if it expects significantly more than $30K.</p>

<p>You probably cannot count on merit aid to close such a gap at those schools. Most of the New England LACs don’t offer merit aid at all. Most of the Midwestern LACs (Oberlin, Grinnell, etc.) do, but the average award is usually only about $10K or so. Your stats may not be high enough to qualify. Even if you do, then depending on aid policy, they may not “stack” the merit aid on top of any need-based award, but instead lower the need-based aid by the amount of the merit award.</p>

<p>So … this is all complicated. In the best-case scenario, a private LAC will expect from your family only the $10K from your Mom, plus a few thousand from you (some combination of loans, savings, and earnings). You cannot count on that scenario, so you definitely need to include some lower-cost financial safeties in your strategy.</p>

7

<p>So I’ve done some weaseling around the internet (on the college board CSS profile website) and discovered that some of my schools don’t require the NCP forms, which would help out, right? My mother herself makes about 90,000 dollars and I do have a younger sister who is a freshman in high school. Does anyone know anything about the Honors Tutorial College at Ohio University? I know I’d need to raise my test scores (this seems to be a key piece) but that could provide the small experience I’m looking for, as well as a bit of academic rigor. </p>

<p>Wooster- no NCP
Colby- no NCP
Lewis and Clark- no NCP
St. Lawrence U- no NCP
U Puget Sound- no NCP
Whitman- no NCP
Willamette- no NCP
Denison- FASFA only
Earlham- FASFA only</p>

<p>Thanks so much everyone!</p>

8

<p>

</p>

<p>Keep that assumption in check. I recommend that you DO apply to several elite LACs (Middlebury, Amherst, etc.) because these are among the schools with the most generous aid policies. Moreover, African Americans are particularly underrepresented among selective LACs (few applicants, low-to-middling yield). Therefore, your test scores and GPA may well put you in the ballpark at least.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Check out Colorado College. You might find it less preppy than some of the New England LACs. It’s also very outdoorsy and needs more URM applicants. Grinnell is a great school with a huge endowment (aid $$$). Davidson is another excellent LAC, maybe more preppy than you’d like but generous with merit aid.</p>

9

<p>*My dad and stepmom will fill out the NCP forms. I have tried to have frank conversations with my father regarding how much he’s willing to pay for college but he does quite a lot of talking around the question and has not given me an actual number. *</p>

<p>Having them complete the forms is only half the battle. I’m guessing that together they probably earn about $100k or more (plus whatever income/assets/equity they have). Their income calculated with your mom’s income could mean little to no aid at all. </p>

<p>Instead of asking your dad how much he will pay, ask him if he would pay $20k per year or more. Putting a real number out there for him to deal with is more realistic. After all, if he’s thinking that he might contribute $5k or so, obviously that won’t be anywhere near enough.</p>

<p>So, the question for dad really isn’t " how much will you pay"…the question is more likely “will you pay $20k or more.” </p>

<p>If you give a number like $20k or more and his reaction is that there is no way he could contribute that much, then you’ll know that the schools that require his info will not work. </p>

<p>Unfortunately, your mom’s income is less than your dad’s family’s income…so he may just think that he needs to contribute what she’s paying $10k. Sadly, $10k from each is not likely going to be enough once schools calculate using 2 households’ incomes/assets, etc. </p>

<p>Having a lot of need when both families’ incomes are good, is not a good position to be in. Unless you get accepted to Harvard, Yale, Princeton, or Stanford (the 4 schools that give super aid, using super formulas), your “expected contribution” is going to be high even at other schools that meet need. </p>

<p>This is what confuses people all the time…they hear that School X gives great aid. However, you have to qualify for that aid by showing that your family’s income/assets aren’t that high. For those with NCPs and 3 adult incomes/assets/households, that can be hard to demonstrate. </p>

<p>As for your financial safeties, if you’re certain that OU and OSU will give you lots of money, then apply to them. (How are you SURE that they will give you lots of money? Right now, I don’t know if your stats are high enough.) </p>

<p>If you make NA, then you’ll have a few more options.</p>

<p>Also, unless you really like OSU and UO and you’re CERTAIN that you’ll get a lot of money from them, you should also apply to a couple of more financial safeties. </p>

<p>You need to find out the info from your dad, and then come up with an appropriate strategy.</p>

10

<p>Here are a few more FAFSA-only LACs you may want to consider:</p>

<p>Allegheny
Centre College
Hendrix
Guilford
Juniata</p>

<p>Oberlin requires the CSS/PROFILE but apparently does not require the NCP.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>If your Mom and Dad together make $130K (without including your stepmother’s income), and your Mom earns $90K, then it appears your Dad earns LESS than your Mom. Right?</p>

11

<p>My dad does earn less than my mother. I was also wondering- do colleges pull out of their retirement accounts? Thanks for the school suggestions tk2179, I’ll definitely look into those.</p>

12

<p>^ Generally speaking, retirement assets are protected and would not factor into what your family is expected to pay.</p>

13

<p>Sit down with your mom now that tax season is over, and run her numbers through the FAFSA calculators at [FinAid</a> | Calculators | Expected Family Contribution (EFC) and Financial Aid](<a href=“Your Guide for College Financial Aid - Finaid”>Expected Family Contribution (EFC) Calculator - Finaid) and at [College</a> Calculators - savings calculators - college costs, loans](<a href=“College Board - SAT, AP, College Search and Admission Tools”>Calculate Your Cost – BigFuture | College Board) If her finances are messy, she may like to work through the FAFSA formula on paper at <a href=“http://www.ifap.ed.gov/efcformulaguide/attachments/101310EFCFormulaGuide1112.pdf[/url]”>http://www.ifap.ed.gov/efcformulaguide/attachments/101310EFCFormulaGuide1112.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Once you know those figures, talk with her about how close she can come. Is the 10k that you mentioned above her real limit? What kind of commitment can you get from your father? If he can come up with 10k also, with a Stafford Loan for yourself and some money from a part-time job, you should be able to afford a home-state public university.</p>

<p>Your grades put you in range for a number of merit-based scholarships. Read though this list, and see what ACT/SAT score you would need to qualify: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/848226-important-links-automatic-guaranteed-merit-scholarships.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/financial-aid-scholarships/848226-important-links-automatic-guaranteed-merit-scholarships.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>For unbeatable do-it-yourself exam prep advice, see <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/sat-preparation/68210-xiggis-sat-prep-advice.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/sat-preparation/68210-xiggis-sat-prep-advice.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>If you would consider attending a women’s college, or an HBCU, take a look to see if any of them would work for your long-term goals:
[HBCU</a> CONNECT - The Original Historically Black College and University Student & Alumni Community](<a href=“http://www.hbcuconnect.com/]HBCU”>http://www.hbcuconnect.com/)
[The</a> Women’s College Coalition](<a href=“http://www.womenscolleges.org/]The”>http://www.womenscolleges.org/)</p>

<p>There is a lot of useful information for you and your parents in the Financial Aid Forum. Encourage your parents to read through some of the threads there.</p>

<p>Wishing you all the best!</p>

14

<p>Check out the University of Minnesota - Morris. Solid public LAC with very reasonable costs and good merit aid.</p>

15

<p>sweet_dreams: Seems like it would be good, if you haven’t already, to talk at length with your parents about what you’re looking for in terms of schools and share the results of your research with them. </p>

<p>A few suggestions for schools: You might want to take a look at Beloit College in Wiscconsin and Kalamazoo College in Michigan. Also Millsaps in Mississippi if you’re willing to go out of the Midwest. People also have great things to say about Trinity U. in San Antonio–good facilities, big endowment.</p>

<p>I can see how you might be worried about getting lost in the fray at a large public school but my experience (having gone to a big state U. as a shy, retiring undergrad) is that you can make a big place feel smaller in a number of ways (you find your hangouts, you find your peeps, you get involved in organizations, etc.). You might feel like more of a “number” (pulling out the old cliche) at a big public U than at a small LAC but it isn’t necessarily the case. Getting into an honors program could help make things feel smaller, as well. I work with someone who went to Ohio University who has nothing but good things to say about her experience there; same thing with another colleague who went to Miami U.</p>

16

<p>A few other schools:</p>

<p>Since (based on Smith) you’re amenable to all-women schools: Agnes Scott College in Georgia (well regarded, selective but not most selective; seems to give reasonable financial aid).</p>

<p>Knox College? Illinois Wesleyan? Illinois Wesleyan, with a high percentage of Illinois kids, might be eager to have OOS kids. It pulls a lot of terrific, smart kids from my daughter’s good, diverse public school here in suburban Chicago.</p>

17

<p>

This is true but the $ need to be in actual retirement accounts like IRAs or 401Ks. If the money is just sitting in a CD or savings account it is considered as being available for use.</p>

18

<p>If the money is in state retirement accounts (for public employees) that’d be protected, right? Thanks absweetmarie for the suggestions- I’ll certainly investigate those.</p>

19

<p>Look at the Colleges that Change Lives. Some of them have already been suggested individually, but as a group they’re mostly good, small LACs with good aid available.</p>