Help with college list?

College Search & Selection
1

My parents encourage me to apply to as many colleges as I wish, but I want to limit myself to around 10 schools to save some money and time. Family income is about $200,000. I have 2 siblings and one is 2 years younger than me (does that help qualify for any aid…?) I’m undecided on a major…

About: junior, female, asian, from VA (Not NOVA)
Class Rank: #2 (my school is mid sized and not that competitive though…)
GPA: W: 4.56 / UW: 4.0
SAT: 1460 (math: 740, english: 720, essay: 6/5/6
ACT: 33 (english: 35, math: 34, reading: 33, science: 30, essay: 10)
EC:
varsity swimming, states ('14, '15)
class vice president ('14, '15)
scholastic bowl ('15- current)
varsity cross country, regionals ('16- current)
sailing ('17- current)
girl scouts ('14- current)
NHS (will have 100 community service hours by graduation, hopefully sooner)
Model UN ('16- current)
part time lifeguard in the summer
art honor society ('17- current)
volunteer swim coach for little kids (winter '16-'17, next winter)
im not very consistent with my ECs which I know is a problem, and my test scores are average for some of these schools but anyways…
Here’s the list (brief impressions of each in parenthesis):

Extreme Reaches:
Duke(I loved everything. The academic environment, campus, food, research opportunities and close relationships with professors. At least, that how I felt on my tour.)
UNC(also pretty campus, nice ppl, rly cool research opportunities)
Reaches:
UVA (I haven’t visited in years but will try to this summer. I’ve heard some negative feelings abt this school and the preppy atmosphere seems kind of annoying to me…, but I know it is good academically)
VT engineering (parents will only let me go if I do engineering here, I visited a while ago but the campus is nice)
William and Mary* (pretty campus, crappy dorms, but cousin goes here and loves it)
Matches:
VCU med (parents will only let me go here if I major in med, I liked the campus bc it reminded me of home, should I be worried abt crime though…?)
Safeties:
ODU (parents went here, I would rather not go but if I have to then oh well…, don’t like the campus but I know some professors and they’re very nice)

  • I like this school quite a bit or visited it and had good impressions

What are more match/safety schools that I should check out? I’m worried that I don’t have enough… Also is there a chance I will receive money from any of these schools? My parents are willing to pay for any of these but ofc I’d rather go someplace that offers more money unless I get into one of the schools I really like. If I could get a nice balance between prestige and cost I would be happy. Overall I’m pretty introverted (so no JMU) and would enjoy a more collaborative (over competitive) environment. I don’t mind if the school is larger but I feel like I would do better at smaller schools. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated; thank you!

2

Your stats are good. Your ACT is better than your SAT. I would submit the ACT in your shoes.

I would say most colleges have crappy dorms.

I think you have a high chance of UVA and W&M. Also a good chance at UNC. Your app is going to be assessed in the context of your high school. You are not going to be compared to kids at other high schools. You are a very strong student at your school, so that is great.

I am a big fan of LACs. Your stats and ECs are good. I think there are a ton of LACs that would snap you up. You are introverted and want a collaborative environment. LACs are small. I think you could aim high. Carleton, Amherst, Middlebury, Cobly, Bates, Kenyon, Bowdoin, Hamilton, Grinnell, Colgate, Oberlin, the Claremont Consortium, and many others, esepcially if you want to get merit aid, are possibilities for you. These schools have excellent rates of acceptance to grad and medical schools.

3

Sorry to say, you will not make the cut for Duke. I had a 34 ACT with similar ECs and had 3 SATIIs with scores above 750 and got rejected by Duke. I guess this college stuff is a crapshoot (I got into Dartmouth, Cornell, Vanderbilt, and WashU), so maybe you can check out these schools. Also, listen to your parents. You never know where you’ll be accepted, heck you might even get into Harvard who knows.

4

Congrats on your hard work and success! I think your grades and scores would be average or better for applicants at Duke and UNC (OOS) and above average for the VA schools. It’s impossible to say with certainty if you would receive much aid in-state, but I would not count on much unless you land a good scholarship, which seems possible given your record. UNC would probably be expensive.

Do you want to be pre-med or study engineering? You mention parents would pay for VCU and Tech if you studied these? Would that be your preference.

There are many schools and hard to advise without knowing your interests. I will point out a few schools where you would have a good chance for merit aid. Many are in the Midwest where applications were down some this year, and the schools have some money. Denison has a beautiful campus and strong academics. It gives a lot of aid, and you would be a very competitive candidate for it. Here’s a handy, concise merit aid grid for Miami of Ohio. Note you would be on the top line and eligible for half to full tuition merit aid.

http://miamioh.edu/admission/merit-grid/

I don’t know as much about the College of Wooster and Macalester but believe you would be in line for generous merit aid. If you are interested in engineering, check out WPI. It’s very hands-on and project-based. It’s not as well known in VA but is a very strong school with a nice campus. I think you would receive merit aid there, just not sure where it would put the cost relative to a Tech or William and Mary.

5

@Pineapplejr7070 , this poster may well make the cut for Duke, but of course she may not. Your stats can’t be compared to hers. You are two different people with two different applications. If the OP had a 31, I might say differently. But she is a very strong student in her school, and that counts for a lot.

6

@Lindagaf I had national and international awards. I was invited to present my research in the United Nations for several ambassadors for world peace. I also am an international musician and performed in international venues from winning competitions. I also have much more on my resume which I won’t share but sure I guess you could argue that the post has a chance; everyone has a chance but I’m saying it’s not a really high one.

7

I think I know why you didn’t get into Duke.

8

It’s nice to see someone on CC who is not being overly optimistic and is maybe a little under optimistic. Yes, Duke is an extreme reach, but UNC seems more a reach, and UVA, W&M, and Tech engineering in state more like high matches. You might get rejected at any of those three, but you have a pretty good shot at each one.

I would be concerned about paying for schools. The VA schools all cost about $25-30,000, so those are all clearly doable. But schools like Duke and even UNC out of state are more like $65-70,000. Depending on your family’s circumstances, you might get some need-based aid at somewhere like Duke even with $200,000 income, but you’re not likely to get merit aid at really top schools. (Having a sibling two years younger will help with need-based but only a very small amount.) And schools that are less competitive may or may not have merit aid, but they are also less likely to give much (if any) need-based money. So you definitely should run all the Net Price Calculators with solid figures, and then see what your parents think is affordable. You should have at least some in-state option for around $130,000 for 4 years, so it is a difficult question of which other schools your parents think would be worth $200,000, or $250,000, or even $300,000.

I totally agree with the idea of looking at some LACs, particularly those with merit aid, for a couple of matches and possibly a reach. For a safety, you could look for an out-of-state public school with lower cost (more like $50,000) and the possibility of merit aid based on your stats that could take it closer to the cost of Virginia schools.

My D with similar stats just applied to UVA, W&M, and Tech (non-engineering) in state, and got into all three, which is one reason why I think you have a good chance. You definitely should visit UVA to get a better idea of it, and, if you like it enough, consider applying early action, which has no downside, really. Good luck!

9

@Wilson98 congrats to your D and thank you! I think my mom is all for prestige but my dad cares only about the money. For instance, if I received aid from VCU and none from UVA, he would want me to go to VCU while my mom would push me towards UVA.
Also I don’t really know where to start with out of state colleges… I don’t know if I will be able to visit any of them, and since I have never heard of any of them before, I don’t know how well respected many of them actually are. I’ll talk more to my parents about that though…

10

@Lindagaf thank you for that list! I will look into them.

11

@Pineapplejr7070 ah your results with duke make me sad… But thanks for sharing. I’ll go in with very low expectations. Congrats on all your acceptances though!

12

@TTG thanks for the college suggestions.
As for what I want to major in, I have absolutely no idea. I feel like I struggle most in math and science, but I don’t particularly hate the subjects. People have suggested majoring in what I’m good at, but I don’t have a favorite or best class… I feel like I struggle with everything… (The only classes I’ve really liked are art history and ceramics…But im not very good at art and there are little to no job opportunities in that field) For now, my parents are pushing me towards Med or engineering because they are well paying jobs, not because I’m interested in them. I’m scared that I will regret going into those fields (that old argument about doing what makes a lot of money vs doing what you’re passionate about), but I don’t really know what else to do that will offer a relatively decent amount of jobs. For most of my apps I will go in undecided. My parents told me that the only “strong” majors at Tech and VCU are engineering and Med, respectively. They only want me to go there if I get into those programs. (I know tech has a good architecture program and I debated applying to that but my dad harshly put that idea down due to the extremely competitive job market and my lack of skills).
I’m not entirely caged in by my parents. I could possibly go into whatever major I wanted to, but they would be very disappointed in me if I chose something that makes very little money (“we sacrificed so much for you to get an education, have all these opportunities to gain more success, etc”) And what if they’re right (I mean, parents usually are…)? I’m just a little torn between listening to them and finding my own way, but I have to keep in mind that they will be helping me pay…

13

I agree with much of the above. You can be confident that you would be a competitive, serious applicant at Duke and UNC and would be a likely candidate at William and Mary, UVA, Tech, and the other VA schools. No guarantees, especially at either of the Carolina schools, very especially in the RD round, and there are surprises in both directions, but I think it reasonable to look at it that way.

As noted, your parents’ success and high income make it more difficult to qualify for tons of need-based financial aid. Generally speaking, it is more difficult to get aid from OOS public schools. Some of the LACs listed above, though, are committed to meeting full financial need, so you might expect some when the sticker prices is north of $60k. I would add Williams to the list. It is one of the top LACs in the country and meets full need (as calculated by the school). I would also add Davidson and Rhodes College in Memphis if you wanted something southern.

You would be a strong candidate for merit aid at Denison, Miami of Ohio, and the other schools I suggested. I know someone who got enough merit aid at Denison to take the total cost down near the total cost of William and Mary for an in-state student with no aid. Your stats are higher. Note that you qualify by your GPA and ACT for the top line at Miami, and it super-scores for admission and aid, so if you’ve taken ACT more than once, you might even be a point above. You are well above the cutoff for GPA. You could conceivably just pay room and board there (emphasis on conceivably). That might be preferable to some of the VA schools for you.

It’s at least something to explore if you want other out-of-state options. Don’t go strictly by the sticker prices; you would likely get money at lots of schools. The challenge is that you won’t know the actual cost until acceptance. You can–and it’s a good idea–run net price calculators for places where you are interested, though these only provide a rough estimate. It is tough if a student falls in love with a school, and it turns out not to be affordable. So consider that.

Good luck!

14

Not sure where you are in VA, but maybe you could try to visit a nearby LAC and UVA to see how a large and small school feel. The University of Richmond is sort of a large LAC, with grad schools too, so a little bigger than some. Others that might, depending where you live in VA, be drivable in a day or overnight are Dickinson and Gettysburg in PA or Washington and Lee in VA. Schools can be different with different vibes but at least you could see what LACs feel like. Many of these campuses are as nice as William and Mary, just imagine that at half the size or so. They often have great non-competitive vibes and are highly respected, which sounds like a criterion for your parents. All of those listed by lindagraf have reputations in the same ballpark as William and Mary, higher in some cases.

It’s nice to visit but you can research these online. If one looks interesting, you can usually register with admissions. Often admission reps travel in the summer and fall to promote the schools. If you register, they will send info and notify you if they are going to be in your area. One of mine liked a school about five hours away. They interviewed well, and we wanted them to interview there and were debating a trip back. We got a postcard that let us know they would be interviewing in our area. We signed up and rode about 20 minutes over to a local hotel for the interview.

At the schools like lindagraf suggested, the admissions process can be a personal one, much more so than when applying to a large state university. If one looks interesting, you can even contact the rep for your region (that is usually available on admissions webpages). Let them know you are interested but unable to visit, and they may offer a solution. Summer and fall are a good time for this. They get extra busy once the applications start rolling in. This is best reserved for a few places that really seem intriguing. For example, if Denison and Kenyon looked interesting and perhaps possible financially, maybe you contact those two.

There are ways to meet your parents’ very sensible concern with future employment. It’s very typical not to know what you want to study. Engineering and the sciences are obviously great in terms of future jobs. Engineering is tough though if a student is not committed to it, premed too. You can explore math, computer science, and economics as well. That might set you up for law or business, maybe in a field that suits your interests. You could also work out something with your parents where you consider a double major, one in something more marketable and one that you want. Or you could do a major and a minor. Often, by meeting a school’s distribution requirements, a student is close to a minor in a subject.

Be realistic in considering all the above advice. You might fall in love with an Amherst, Denison, or Kenyon, and they might turn out to be too expensive. Keep your focus on in-state schools so you know you have some quality, affordable alternatives. In any case, VA has outstanding public universities, which is fortunate for in-state students. BTW, I was on the William and Mary campus yesterday, and it is an incredible place. Dorms are not particularly a selling point, but not really that bad compared to most places. But, also, you are a very good student, and it is possible that the cost at some of these could be brought in line with VA in-state prices.

15

@Lindagaf being salty is not good at all. Why did I get rejected at Duke? Give me a reason. Also, if you have not been accepted to Duke, you have no right to criticize.

16

At the risk of reducing higher education to a somewhat narrow statistical factor, you should know that the colleges that have been suggested to you represent some of the country’s most selective:

http://www.businessinsider.com/the-50-smartest-colleges-in-america-2016-10

http://www.businessinsider.com/the-610-smartest-colleges-in-america-2015-9

Personally, I’d concur with the NESCAC recommendations in particular for these schools’ excellent general academics, undergraduate focus and associated emphasis on teaching, and well funded financial aid programs.

17

Helpful list above. Just for clarification, NESCAC is the New England Small College Athletic Conference. Members include Amherst (MA), Bates (ME), Bowdoin (ME), Colby (ME), Connecticut College (not University of), Hamilton (NY), Middlebury (VT), Trinity College (CT), Tufts University (MA), Wesleyan University (CT), and Williams (MA). These include many of the most well-known LACs in New England. Tufts is in outer Boston, excellent school, more of a university than the others, but not large. They all have competitive admissions. Wesleyan is “hot,” partly because Lin-Manuel Miranda (“Hamilton”) is a famous alum and has garnered the school a lot of attention. Probably the most accessible are Trinity, Connecticut, and Bates (still competitive schools). I was particularly impressed with Bates on our visit, but that’s just a personal opinion. Not sure how financial aid would shake out at all of them. I know Williams is very need focused. And talk about small classes. At Williams students can take tutorials where there are two students and one professor. Students take turns writing papers each week, and the other comments in a shorter paper. They then discuss them with the professor.

18

just to set your parents straight, one of the toughest and best programs in the entire country is the VCUARTS program both undergrad and grad are extremely competitive and selective. In fact USNWR ranked it #2 in the country after Yale.
As for what to major in, well guess what you can be highly successful at ANYTHING if you are motivated. So so sad when parents(well meaning) try to force preconceived notions on a student starting their lives. No one knows, NO ONE , how or where you will end up and the only one that can truly affect that is you. A college major is absolutely NOT a gtd of some parents notion of a planned career. Anything can and anything will happen to change all that. I’ve seen very very average gpa students go on to be incredible successful (wildly). Have you considered business major? finance? good luck and follow YOUR passion not someone elses.

19

@Pineapplejr7070 “Why did I get rejected at Duke? Give me a reason. Also, if you have not been accepted to Duke, you have no right to criticize.”

A sample size of 1 means absolutely nothing. Here’s the only reason - they accepted people other than you and ran out of spots.

Thousands of extremely qualified students get rejected every year at every elite school because there isn’t enough room. I know three kids who are friends: one was accepted to Stanford, but rejected by UChicago and Harvard. Another was accepted at UChicago but rejected by Stanford and Harvard. And the third was accepted at Harvard but rejected at Stanford and UChicago.

Give me a reason why that happened (hint - it has to do with too many well-qualified applicants and too few spots).