<p>who said harvard wanted cool guys?? jk </p>
<p>maybe DHA didnt convey his "coolness" in his essays. who knows???
:(</p>
<p>" maybe it just sucks when you know you fight everyday for what you believe in and love, and work so hard to get past financial obstacles/etc, and then to see your crazy rich prep-school friend who has had it easy their whole life and who doesn't do sh** get accepted. i mean, i like my friend. but...harvard? come on... "</p>
<p>Tawny, I fall into into your first example and I got in. Don't lose all hope in Harvard yet.</p>
<p>I got a 480 on my SAT II, but it was in French with Listening. No one around my area has taken the French SAT before so I couldn't ask anyone for advice. Stupidly, I looked at the sample questions after I signed up and realized I was screwed. I prepped as best as I could, but there was no way my French (as good as it is compared to my area) could compete with the advanced French on the SAT II. As soon as I found out my SAT II scores, I called my interviewer and she assured me that when the adcoms line up my SAT scores, the 480 is going to stand out and it will seem "weird" compared to my above 600 scores. Also, you have to realize that this is a foreign language SAT score. I'm not planning to pursue French in college, as much as I love the language. Call me crazy, but I'm still signing up to retake the French SAT II in Jan, just to prove to myself that I can do better.</p>
<p>As for DHA's case, a possibility is he mentioned he came from a very competitive high school. Colleges look to see that you took full advantage of your resources. Granted, he came from a low income family, but as most people can see, so did a lot of other applicants.</p>
<p>Retaking the French SAT II even if you already got in?</p>
<p>U see, this proves my point that Harvard adcom know what they're doing. This is the very reason why harvard EAs confident, intellectually curious, passionate students like you and defers/rejects arrogant ones.</p>
<p>wow, It's reassuring to know that other students are as eccentric as I am. I took a few SAT IIs just to prove to myslef that I could do them also. Good show them what your made of!!! Buenas Suerte!</p>
<p>thanks Dream Weaver :)</p>
<p>lol yeah, I had money set aside for other colleges' application fees, but since I don't need them now, I might as well give them to College Board so I can go through 3 hours of French, Literature, and Math ... the things eccentric people do.</p>
<p>lol, i did those exact ones in december.</p>
<p>can i ask y ur doing literature and math as well?</p>
<p>Math is to see how different Math 1 & Math 2 is. I'm debating on whether to do Lit or not bc I'm pretty sure I'll get a low score. I'm applying to other colleges as well so I guess it won't hurt either way.</p>
<p>If you know the material for Math IIc, definitely take it. The curve is tremendous and it is much easier to get a high score than on Math Ic, even though the material is more different.</p>
<p>The reason DHA did not get into Harvard is patently obvious: It was not the right school for him. Judging by his posts, he believed that because of whatever factors, a Harvard acceptance letter was not only a likelihood, it was his due.</p>
<p>No one, and I mean NO ONE ought to expect a Harvard acceptance letter. It should be a surprise and an honor. Not only that, but Harvard is referred to by many Republicans as "the viper's nest" because it is such a liberal institution. It was even cited in the affirmative action case "Bakke vs. University of California at Davis" as having the ideal policy towards race and disadvantage. Harvard is no bigot institution.</p>
<p>Besides that, it is well known that when colleges say they want "diversity" they don't just mean diversity in the color of your skin, but diversity of viewpoints. The only reason affirmative action is still allowed is because the Supreme court says colleges have a sufficient governmental interest in a diversity of viewpoints. DHA came from a highly competitive school, meaning that even as a low-income hispanic, he had been exposed to the resources of an elite education, UNLIKE MusikAzngirl, who came from what sounds like a really terrible educational environment which couldn't even teach SAT level French, AND was a low-income student. Realistically, she has more to offer as an economically disadvantaged student from an educationally disadvantaged background than an economically disadvantaged student from an educationally priveleged background. The assumption is that due to her poor schooling, her SAT scores deserve the benefit of a doubt, whereas DHA, being from an elite school, would be expected to have the prep necessary to score well on the SAT. </p>
<p>In my meeting with Professor Harvey Mansfield this autumn, he told me the Harvard adcom does make mistakes, but also informed me that the process they work through goes like this: They take a very few students who are at the top of the applicant pool, who they think are likely to be very smart (tupac), but after that all they look for is diversity. Diversity of viewpoints. Sorry for how long this is, but I was completely scandalized by the statement that Harvard is a bigot institution. That is not, under any circumstances, true.</p>
<p>"U see, this proves my point that Harvard adcom know what they're doing. This is the very reason why harvard EAs confident, intellectually curious, passionate students like you and defers/rejects arrogant ones."</p>
<p>i really wish people would stop calling all the defers arrogant.
b/c it definitely goes both ways.</p>
<p>i'm a defer, i consider myself intellectually curious and passionate... i take about 2 extra classes each semester in addition to HS classes that i dont even need b/c i am interested in learning about the world... i am always the last out of the theatre when i work on a production... i work 15-hour days when films are being produced locally and need volunteer help...</p>
<p>yeah, i agree harvard wants "intellectually curious and passionate" people... i guess i'm just frustrated lately... i don't know what else to do to show them i am "intellectually curious and passionate"! i've run out of room in my schedule as it is! lol</p>
<p>"DHA came from a highly competitive school, meaning that even as a low-income hispanic, he had been exposed to the resources of an elite education"</p>
<p>yes, but as a poor student, he takes on SO many more responsibilities that his classmates never have to worry about.</p>
<p>Musik, I'm sorry if it seemed like I was scrutinizing you. That wasn't my intent. I just used you as an example because you're proof that scores don't matter as much as people give weight to them. Congratulations, by the way. </p>
<p>I know what you mean about thinking you'd do well but not doing so hot on test day. I thought the same about Spanish with listening. I thought I was the bomb in terms of non-native speakers at my school (I actually talk to natives in Spanish). But, day of the test, there were alot of unfamiliar vocab words that I NEVER hear used... I got a 510. It wasn't completely bombed, but I could have done better. Also, it could be that you need 600 on a language test to bypass language requirements at the school, so they overlooked your score.</p>
<p>Musik is proof that low scores can get in, but I think that she is an extreme situation. She works a full-time job in a low-income area at a bad school...and she lives on her own. How many applicants do you think work full-time jobs and live on their own?</p>
<p>And Musik, I was wondering, if you've been living on your own, and now you're going to Harvard where I assume they'll pay for everything for you, how does it feel not to have to worry about where money for living expenses is coming from? Maybe that's not completely the case, but from what I gather, all of your dreams just came true...</p>
<p>Terra, I fit that description minus the living COMPLETELY on my own. My school is worse than hers, too. But, they saw something interesting in her. She seems interesting. I probably didn't show my "full-ness." I want to write for the Crimson if I'm accepted. But, I never sent in any sample articles or the likes for them to send to their editor for review. So, I'll send in something like that to see if I can get a good review and possibly an acceptance.</p>
<p>Tawny, DHA, AP Freak, I am so sorry for you guys as I got deferred too. We are all low-income students who take on family responsibilities and work hard in school. We really deserve to get in. The rich snobs with low test scores don't have stats close to ours, yet they got accepted. Harvard should really consider a person's background when evaluating a student. But yet again, admissions decisions were never fair to begin with.</p>
<p>Since the inception of the HFAI, Harvard has been draining a lot of its money to low-income students. They promised that people with low-income get a free ride and they now have to keep that promise. Does this mean they have to accept fewer poor kids so they would not have to give out so much money?</p>
<p>"Musik is proof that low scores can get in, but I think that she is an extreme situation. She works a full-time job in a low-income area at a bad school...and she lives on her own. How many applicants do you think work full-time jobs and live on their own?"</p>
<p>How many people are national finalists in Siemens Westinghouse? Harvard is a place of extremes, that's why it's so hard to get into.</p>
<p>"The rich snobs with low test scores don't have stats close to ours, yet they got accepted. Harvard should really consider a person's background when evaluating a student."</p>
<p>What have you been reading? Harvard definitely considers a person's background! All top colleges look at a student in context, and often a disadvantaged background can really tip the balance. However, if Harvard does not believe you are capable of handling the workload there, no amount of extracurricular prowess will get you in.</p>
<p>"The rich snobs with low test scores don't have stats close to ours, yet they got accepted."</p>
<p>I honestly think that you are just generalizing and reinforcing a sterotype about Harvard. Maybe you know a well-off kid that got in with low scores, but you can't use that one kid as the primary, commonplace Harvard rich kid. Just like Musik, she got in with low test scores, but you can't necessarily use one student to justify low test scores for everyone with low income.</p>
<p>"How many people are national finalists in Siemens Westinghouse? Harvard is a place of extremes, that's why it's so hard to get into."</p>
<p>I'd bet that there were more finalists and semi-finalists that applied than there were kids that comepletely lived on their own. Just look at the stats thread...people keep saying how all of the Siemen's applicants were deferred, yet Musik is the only one that I see in there living completely independently.</p>
<p>Maybe I'm not looking at all the details, but that's what came off the top of my head.</p>
<p>Just my 2 cents.</p>
<p>I seem interesting. Thanks running :) You seem very interesting too. I will definitely root for you in April (not that I wasn't before). </p>
<p>I don't have much to say for the discussion so far, only if you guys want to analyze my acceptance, perhaps you should know also that I am not just independent financially but in other areas as well. I lack family support since I was little, and this is what I talked about in my essay and in my interview, for this is really what made me who I am today. If Harvard really do compare students of similar backgrounds and if I were compared with other applicants with low income, perhaps this is what got me in - while maybe you have emotional support, I did not.</p>
<p>MusikAzngirl is one applicant. There could potentially be many more such applicants who were accepted to Harvard. But yes, I would agree there are probably more Siemens Finalists/Semifinalists than people like Musik. My point was that Harvard is looking for a very select few people and that means going to extremes. Sorry for the confusion.</p>
<p>Tropicalisland--</p>
<p>The amount of money Harvard spends accepting HFAI kids compared to non-HFAI kids is tiny, in the larger scheme of things. Let's say the average student gets 10k in financial aid a year, while the average HFAI kid gets 40k, so an HFAI kid costs 30k more per year. And let's say that, say, about 15% of the incoming class is HFAI, so that's about 200 kids. That works out to six million dollars per class per year (or 24 million dollars per year once HFAI has filtered through all four years). This is at a school with a 22.6 BILLION dollar endowment that's growing at about 10-20% per year. This is at a school that just had a $44 million budget surplus. When Harvard decides to spend money on a major initiative, it doesn't need to go scrounging around for a few million dollars.</p>