<p>HELP! Hey everyone, I have a major dilemna on my hands. I have been admitted to Penn (and given an invitation to apply to the UScholars program, of which invited students have a very good chance of getting into) and USC with the trustee (full tuition merit based) scholarship, the Thematic Option honors core program, and the honors program. On the one hand I really liked Penn(loved the campus) and enjoyed its student body more then I did USC's.I am interested in possibly double majoring in archaeology and cinema. Penn has one of the best anthropology/archaeology programs in the world, but its film is not so stellar, while USC is just the oppositte, number one film and not so great archaeology. I have always wanted to do film, it has been a lifelong dream (although an impractical one, would love to do editing/producing) and I feel that this may be the best time to pursue it. If I were wth Uscholars at Penn, that would be a group of about 25students per year, and I'm guessin gthere would be about 30-50 trustte scholars who aactually end up at USC. My main question is, does the school I go to out of these two make a difference when I apply to grad school? I would really like to go to Yale or Oxford for grad, but I am afraid that going to USC give me less of a chance of getting in then if I went to Penn. Is this true? Or does it not matter which of the two I go too, just how well I do there? I have been gettin gmisxed responses from people on this, and am getting a little freaked out. On the one hand, I really liked Penn, Philli, and the students/camps and great Arch department, on the other hand, USC iswarm, free and has number one film and is in LA (best place for cinema) but I didn't really like the school or student body as much (although Im sure I coudl prob find my own niche, it just wouldn't be as big). Also, at USC I am currently in the college of Arts and Sciences and would have to wait till Jr. year to try and transfer to the film school in order to get a double major. What does everyone think? Will being at the top of my class at USC with the scholarship, thematic option, and honors program put me at the same level as if I were applying to an Ivy from Penn with the Uscholars?
Thanks everyone for your feedback!</p>
<p>Choose the one that you like best?</p>
<p>haha, I don't know which though :( I like Penn more, but I like the treatment I'll be given and the location of USC more. Does anyone know, does reputation of the school when they are this closee in the rankinds (7 v. 20 something) make a difference when applying for grad?</p>
<p>USC is an amazing place!</p>
<p>But it sounds like you and USC just did not "click."
You said, "I didn't really like the school or student body as much."</p>
<p>SO DON'T COME!</p>
<p>Open up a space for someone who really, truly wants to be a Trojan and loves everything about USC. There are many people out there waiting for a spot to open up because USC is their dream school and #1 choice, but they didn't get in. </p>
<p>School spirit at USC is extremely high.
So if you can't love the school and the people and everything about USC, you will be disappointed and feel very out of place here.</p>
<p>This is one of the tougher decisions I've come across. I know that USC is free, but would you be able to afford Penn if you went there? Which is more important to you - archaeology or film?</p>
<p>USC is a good school and all, but the area it's in is pretty ghetto. Not the greatest area, but, overall it's a good school with LOTS of school spirit.</p>
<p>Are you getting any financial aid at Penn?</p>
<p>I get no financial aid at Penn. However, I have a college fund saved up so that I would be able to attend Penn without going in debt, but I would definately have to sacrifice things like my horse and the hopes of ever getting a car. Although USC is in the ghetto area, UPenn isn't exactly in the suburbs of Philli either. Jackson17- I would say that film is probably more important to me, it is my dream job (movie are my favorite thing in the world! I love how they can affect an individual), however I would also have a ball being and archaeologist, I guess I just don't want to look back and say "what if..." with regards to film. I don't think the whole opening up a spot for anther person is a big worry, many (I think most) of the students who get trustee scholarships do not attend USC, and USC knows this so they admit a certain number of students keeping in mind that many of them wont come.
Does anyone have any opinions on whether going to USC and being a tustee scholar with all the honors would put me at a disadvantage when applying to grad school (I would LOVE to go to either Yale or Oxford for grad) then if I was applying from Penn with the honors?
Thanks everyone for all of your input!</p>
<p>In terms of grad school placement, you can get there from either place. One would expect U Penn to have a stronger profile with Yale and Oxford given its east coast location. But Yale and Oxford also get tons of applications from U Penn and similar schools while receiving comparatively fewer from the West Coast schools so the universe of co-applicants (if that even matters to Yale or Oxford) is probably smaller coming from USC. One data point that might reflect this is Law School placement at Yale Law. Currently there are 6 U Penn students there. There are 5 from USC. You can get to Yale from either place. </p>
<p>More important than this is how you feel about the schools and how you fit. U Penn, as an Ivy, has a different, lower profile, athletic atmosphere than USC. This affects the campus and the buzz that goes around and infects the social environment as well. You may not care, but some do. Penn, however, is pretty supportive of its mens basketball team. City-wise, Philly is not LA although both schools are in lousy (but improving) neighborhoods. Most U Penn grads, if they didn't come from the Phillly area, don't stay there. USC and LA is more of a match and retains and employs a good portion of its grads. </p>
<p>Given what you have written, it sounds like you prefer U Penn and no one could argue with this choice. If you have concerns about the film industry, try asking U Penn to give you a list of alumni in the LA area working in the industry and call them up. You might be surprised how helpful they can be and it might establish some good later contacts for yo.</p>
<p>Wow! Thanks for all the great information everyone! One extra thing I should probably mention though. When I first visited USC and UPenn I didn't like either. I thought both were far too full of partiers and sorority girls for my taste. I went back to USC for an overnight and still didn't like it (which may have been influenced by my hosts who said that they had even liked high school better. AHHHH!) and I went back to Penn and liked it the second time. So I guess you could say that I feel a little apprehensive about following my gut instinct for either school. The only schools where I knew the second I walked on to campus that they completely fit me personality wise have been Yale and Amherst. Hawkette, thanks for all the tips! Those facts about YAle law school definately made me feel a little better and I do know that the screenwriter (at least thats what I think) for Legally Blond went to Penn, so they should have some pretty great alumni.
I hate decisions :(</p>
<p>Parts of Legally Blond were filmed at USC (not Harvard)</p>
<p>The producer of Legally Blonde did go to Penn. Penn didn't do so great at placement at Yale Law (but did place very well into other departments at Yale) , however, Penn has 57 students in the last entering class at Harvard Law (the highest no. after Harvard itself, Yale and Stanford). Penn undergrads generally have far better grad-school placement than USC undergrads and Penn is amongst the top 5 American institutions represented at Oxford. Penn even has a tie-up with Oxford where you can spend your junior year studying there if you have a good GPA, and has had a history of strong ties and cooperation with the institution.
Being a University Scholar is an acknowledgement that you were amongst the best and most intellectually dynamic applications that Penn recieved this year, and would definitely give you a strong edge when applying to grad-school. Penn's University Scholars continually win the country's most prestigious academic awards--Rhodes, Marshall, Truman, Goldwater etc. You should give this opportunity serious consideration when you make your choice.
Also, since you are so passionate about film and in case you do not feel satisfied with Penn's program you can always take summer classes at NYU Tisch (only an hour and half away) or pursue your interest in the field independently, which would be harder to do with respect to archeology. Since you feel it is likely that you would make a career out of film, you would perhaps choose to study it in grad-school? In which case, the institution that you feel you would be more comfortable and happier in and would provide you with the best all-round academic opportunities and intellectual development, seems to be the better choice to make.</p>
<p>hey, snooker1, could you tell me where you are finding out all of these stats? Thanks!</p>
<p>Oh and I should probably add some information
1) I HATE being cold with a passion, however I'm from the NE so if I have put up with it for 18 yrs I think I can do it for another four
2) Found out today by talking to USC archaeology proffs that the Arch department actually is pretty sweet. LOTS of undergrad research and specialized attention payed to the students because there aren't that many. I guess the one girl who is graduating this year is going to Oxford
3) I'm a little hesitant about going all the way to the West Coast, seems a bit far
Ahhhhh! All of yours guys's input is so good, but each time I read a different opinion I switch to that opinion and think I am convinced until I read the next one, haha.
Also, my dad, an engineering prof who also admits grad students says it doesn't matter at all which university a student comes from. Hes says that when he gets an application from a student from MIT vs. from a student from another random school, he doesn't care at all that the one came from MIT all he cares about is the grades and research done by the student. Do you think that this is just an engineering thing?Haha, or maybe its just my dad.</p>
<p>Also, do you think the fact that Penn is much more represented at the grad schools has something to do with the fact that its Penn, or more with the fact that the general caliber of students there is higher?</p>
<p>If you want to do film there is no better place than USC. Its the clear choice. Film is one of those "vocational" majors with real training and the departmental rank really matters alot. </p>
<p>On the other hand departmental rank for something like anthropology or archaeology is much less relevant to grad school admission or further success. For majors like these the school rank is much more important and Penn is clearly better overall so if you want to get a PhD in this field Penn is the better choice. </p>
<p>So basically if you want to go into film USC no question. If you want to go to professional school or get a PhD in archaeology go to Penn.</p>
<p>Penn has a higher end student body.</p>
<p>Were you actually accepted into USC's film school? , because it is REALLY hard to transfer in, even for USC students. I wouldn't accept unless you receive assurances IN WRITING that you can get "D" [ department authorization to take classes] clearance for taking film classes without hassles. My son is Trustee Scholar at USC, and he doesn't get any preferential treatment during registration, despite his scholarship. And Penn does have a lot more Hi SAT, NMF students than USC. see below for interesting stats, compiled from another CC parent [ sorry I can't correctly attibute the post to the original author] :</p>
<p>Which universities have the most students with over 1500 SATs? </p>
<hr>
<p>I thought it might be interesting to see where the most students are going who score over 1500 on the SATs. The following is a list sorted by my estimate of how many full-time undergraduates have SAT scores over 1500 based on US News 2007. This is the raw number of students with over 1500 SATs, not the percent.</p>
<h1>with SAT over 1500/1600</h1>
<p>UC Berkeley 3668
Harvard 3333
U Penn 3110
Cornell 2805
UCLA 2791
U Texas Austin 2516
Yale 2513
Stanford 2435
Duke 2282
Columbia 2198
U Illinois Champaign-Urbana 2013
MIT 2007
Brown 1998
Northwestern 1998
USC 1977
Princeton 1953
NYU 1891
Washington U St Louis 1882
U Virginia 1723
U Michigan Ann Arbor 1645
U Florida 1639
U Notre Dame 1505
U Chicago 1501
Dartmouth 1486
Georgetown 1478
Georgia Tech 1470
UC San Diego 1349
Johns Hopkins 1278</p>
<p>The proportion of over-1500 SAT scorers is also interesting. It indicates where the over-1500 students are most highly concentrated. Here is a list sorted by the proportion. Keep in mind, these are estimates.</p>
<p>proportion over 1500</p>
<p>Caltech 0.6213
MIT 0.5
Harvard 0.4697
Yale 0.4697
Princeton 0.4102
Stanford 0.3737
Dartmouth 0.3669
Duke 0.3527
Columbia 0.3416
Brown 0.3369
Rice 0.3369
U Chicago 0.3253
Washington U St Louis 0.305
U Penn 0.2984
Northwestern 0.2483
Johns Hopkins 0.2483
Georgetown 0.2272
Cornell 0.2053
Tufts 0.1946
U Notre Dame 0.1822
Carnegie Mellon 0.1822
Emory 0.1788
UC Berkeley 0.1645
Vanderbilt 0.163
Case Western 0.1383
Georgia Tech 0.1337
U Virginia 0.1286
College of William and Mary 0.1286
USC 0.123</p>
<p>If your goal is to go to grad school at an Ivy, it will probably be easier to get in if you are coming from another Ivy.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.law.harvard.edu/admissions/jd/colleges.php%5B/url%5D">http://www.law.harvard.edu/admissions/jd/colleges.php</a>
Harvard Law-Undergraduate Schools Represented in 2006-2007</p>
<p>The following is a list of the 255 undergraduate institutions represented by all students enrolled in the JD program at HLS for the 2006-2007 school year.</p>
<p>Undergraduate Institution # HLS JD Students
Abilene Christian University 1
Alma College 1
Albertson College of Idaho 1
American University 4
American University in Cairo 1
Amherst College 19
Andrews University 1
Arizona State University 2
Austin College 1
Ball State University 1
Barnard College 5
Barry University 1
Baruch College 1
Bates College 1
Baylor University 1
Bentley College 1
Bethel College 1
Boston College 5
Boston University 4
Bowdoin College 3
Brandeis University 11
Brigham Young University 29
Brown University 48
Bryn Mawr College 1
California Institute of Technology 2
California State University - Long Beach 1
California State University - Los Angeles 1
Calvin College 1
Cambridge College 1
Canisius College 1
Carleton College 4
Carleton University 1
Carnegie Mellon University 7
Case Western Reserve University 6
City College - CUNY 2
Claremont McKenna College 3
Colgate University 1
College of the Holy Cross 1
College of William & Mary 3
Columbia University 46
Cooper Union 2
Cornell University 45
Covenant College 1
Creighton University 1
Dartmouth College 35
Davidson College 2
De Paul University 1
Denison University 1
Doane College 1
Drake University 1
Drew University 2
Drexel University 1
Duke University 41
East Tennessee University 1
Emory University 14
Ewha Women's University 1
Fayetteville State University 1
Florida A&M University 4
Florida International University 1
Florida State University 1
Fordham University 1
Furman University 2
George Mason University 1
George Washington University 10
Georgetown University 32
Georgia Institute of Technology 2
Goshen College 1
Grinnell College 2
Grove City College 1
Hamilton College 1
Hampton University 4
Harvard University 241
Haverford College 2
Hillsdale College 3
Hope University 1
Houghton College 1
Howard University 7
Hunter College - CUNY 1
Illinois State University 2
Indiana University 5
International University Bremen 1
Iona College 1
Iowa State University 3
Ithaca College 1
Jackson State University 1
Johns Hopkins University 3
Kalamazoo College 1
Kenyon College 1
Knox College 1
Korea University 1
Lake Forest College 1
Lamar University 1
Lee University 1
Lehigh University 1
Lewis & Clark College 1
Linfield College 1
Loyola University - New Orleans 1
Loyola University - Chicago 1
Luther College 1
Manchester College 1
Marquette University 2
Massachusetts Institute of Technology 13
McGill University 3
McMaster University 1
Miami University 2
Michigan State University 3
Middlebury College 6
Mills College 1
Minnesota State University 1
Morehouse College 4
Ner Israel Rabbinical College 1
New Jersey Institute of Technology 1
New York University 20
Niagara University 1
North Carolina State University 1
Northeastern State University 1
Northwest College 1
Northwestern College 1
Northwestern University 20
Oberlin College 3
Occidental College 1
Ohio State University 4
Ohio University 1
Oklahoma State University 1
Oxford University 2
Pennsylvania State University 6
Pomona College 9
Princeton University 54
Purdue University 3
Queens College 1
Reed College 1
Renmin University Of China 1
Rensselaer Polytech Institute 1
Rice University 18
Rochester Institute of Technology 2
Rutgers - State Univer. of New Jersey 2
Saint John Fisher College 1
Saint John's College - Annapolis 1
Saint John's College - New Mexico 1
Saint John's University 1
Saint Mary's College of Maryland 1
San Francisco State University 1
Santa Clara University 2
Seoul National University 5
Seton Hall University 1
Smith College 4
Southeast Missouri State University 1
Southern Methodist University 1
Southern Oregon University 1
Southwestern University 1
Spelman College 2
Stanford University 79
SUNY Binghamton 2
SUNY Stony Brook 2
SUNY Geneseo 1
Swarthmore College 10
Syracuse University 1
Temple University 1
Texas A&M University 3
Texas Christian University 1
Touro College 1
Truman State University 2
Tufts University 8
Tulane University 3
United States Military Academy 2
University of Akron 1
University of Alabama 2
University of Alberta 1
University of Arizona 3
University of Arkansas 2
University of British Columbia 1
University of California - Berkeley 48
University of California - Davis 6
University of California - Irvine 2
University of California - Los Angeles 39
University of California - Riverside 1
University of California - San Diego 6
University of California - Santa Barbara 2
University of Central Arkansas 2
University of Chicago 13
University of Colorado - Boulder 7
University of Colorado - Denver 1
University of Connecticut 2
University of Dayton 1
University of Florida 13
University of Georgia 5
University of Illinois 7
University of Iowa 3
University of Kansas 3
University of Kentucky 1
University of Lethbridge 1
University of Ljubljana 1
University of Maryland 13
University of Miami 2
University of Michigan 23
University of Minnesota 6
University of Mississippi 2
University of Missouri 1
University of Nebraska 1
University of North Carolina 13
University of North Dakota 1
University of North Texas 1
University of Notre Dame 20
University of Oklahoma 2
University of Oregon 1
University of Pennsylvania 57
University of Pittsburgh 4
University of Puget Sound 1
University of Rhode Island 1
University of Richmond 1
University of Rochester 1
University of San Diego 1
University of San Francisco 1
University of Saskatchewan 1
University of South Carolina 2
University of South Florida 1
University of Southern California 13
University of Southern Mississippi 1
University of Sydney 1
University of Tennessee 1
University of Texas - Austin 27
University of Texas - Dallas 1
University of Texas - El Paso 1
University of Texas - Tyler 1
University of Toronto 7
University of Tulsa 1
University of Utah 1
University of Vermont 1
University of Virginia 19
University of Washington 9
University of Waterloo 1
University of Western Ontario 2
University of Windsor 1
University of Wisconsin 4
Utah State University 1
Virginia Commonwealth University 1
Virginia Polytechnic Institute & State Universtity 2
Vanderbilt University 13
Vassar College 2
Wake Forest University 1
Washington and Lee University 4
Washington University 10
Wellesley College 4
Wesleyan College 1
Wesleyan University 5
Western Michigan University 1
Western Connecticut State University 1<br>
Wheaton College 2
Whitman College 2
Wichita State University 2
Williams College 17
Yale University 113
Yeshiva University 2
York University 2</p>
<p>The University Scholars program provides an unusual academic environment for intellectually dynamic students who have already demonstrated their commitment and dedication to research. Through mentoring, research funding and scholarly events the program encourages and supports students to make the most of their undergraduate years, not only with in-depth research, but also by making an early start in graduate and professional courses, ranging widely or in some cases focusing narrowly on their curricular choices.</p>
<p>Each University Scholar has a special mentor from the distinguished faculty who serve on the Council of University Scholars. With the help of this mentor, University Scholars become members of an intellectual network of individuals that help the student explore tailor-made education programs that permit them to progress at their own rate. Council mentors play a supporting role in finding appropriate opportunities with which the Scholars may begin their independent research work.</p>
<p>The focus of the University Scholars program is undergraduate research. In order to aid students in doing creative and in-depth research, the University Scholars has a fund with which to help students defray research expenses. Funding is meant to cover the expense of the research itself; this most often pertains to room and board costs over the summer months. Occasionally, students' research will take them away from Penn. In those instances, the University Scholars program may be able to fund travel expenses as well.</p>
<p>The University Scholars meet weekly for lunches at which they present and discuss their research. Because University Scholars attend all four undergraduate schools, the presentations come from a range of disciplines, and they illustrate a variety of research techniques. University Scholars learn how to approach and conduct effective research projects by participating in the greater community of researchers.</p>